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Question regarding crayfish and elodea <growing>    1/28/13
Hi Bob I work at a school district, and we are currently having problems feeding the overabundance of crayfish that we house for use in the classrooms. I am aware that we can use things like kale, potatoes, peas, etc., but I’ve found that those terrestrial food sources begin to decay and foul the water really quickly.
<Will eat/consume most all foods. I suggest a good pelleted food as a staple.>
So I’ve been trying to use exclusively elodea. Unfortunately, we’re finding the elodea is quickly becoming cost prohibitive. Therefore I’ve decided it’s in our best interest to attempt to grow the elodea, to at least offset the cost some.  In my department I have a large 2 sided industrial kitchen-style sink, and only one side gets used (and only water is ever in that sink, we attach the siphon setup for fish water changes to that faucet). When I started working here my predecessor was keeping crayfish in the sink, but I questioned the safety of that, and went and purchased a 100 gallon pond to put them in instead. Ever since then the sink has sat empty. But with my current need of elodea, and lack of space, I decided to try to plant the elodea in the sink. I have a standard florescent task light above it, but I also added a light fixture from an old 10 gallon tank I had with a plant grow light bulb in it. I have aquarium gravel to add, but really wasn’t clear on whether I would get better growth from burying the elodea in the gravel, or simply letting it free float?
<Floating is better for faster growth... though doubtful you'll be able to "keep up">
I also have some oyster shells in there from when there were crayfish using them as “houses” that I’d planned on leaving, as I read it could help with pH (accurate?).
So I’m wondering what thoughts you have on that setup?
<Can work>
 My second question is regarding the addition of fish to the setup. I have about half a dozen white clouds in a tank here that I was thinking of adding to my makeshift elodea growing tank/sink. But I wasn’t sure if that’s safe for them?
<Is likely fine... as long as no one pulls the plug!>
 I look forward to hearing your thoughts J
<Cheers! Bob Fenner> 
Re: FW: question regarding crayfish and elodea   1/28/13

Thanks for the quick response! :)
So you don't think that we'd have the issue of fouling the water if we went with a pelleted food?
<Much less so than w/ the foods you listed>
 A pelleted pond fish style food, or shrimp pellets?
<These would work fine>
 Or back to it doesn't matter because they'll eat anything and everything?
<More close to reality, yes. I'd opt for something low/er protein (under 20%)>
And no worries about pulling the plug. It has a special stopper in there that actually requires a wrench to remove it :)
<Ah good. Cheers, BobF>
Re: FW: question regarding crayfish and elodea   1/28/13

Super, I'll get started with the project. Thanks again for your help :)
<Ah, welcome. You have seen the bits on WWM re Elodea/Egeria/Anacharis I take it. BobF>
Re: question regarding crayfish and elodea <as food for>    1/31/13

Hi Bob
I was out of the office yesterday, so I wasn't able to respond to this. I have read about Elodea from several sources, I can't honestly recall if WWM was one of them, but I tend to end up on WWM when trying to research all things aquatic, so I probably did. I'll do another search though, just to make sure.
Why do I want to opt for a lower protein in the food?
<Slower growth is desirable, and lower protein is likely to include more vegetable material... better for your animals and maintenance>
 I ask because I spent some time trying to locate a sinking stick/wafer food (didn’t want tiny pellets, as I don't want them falling through the cracks amongst the PVC and oyster shells I have littering the bottom of the crayfish tanks, and not getting eaten, and fouling the water) that was under 20% protein, and I didn't have much luck. I think the lowest I found was in the 30-35 range...
<This will do>
Thanks again!
<Welcome. Bob Fenner>
Re: question regarding crayfish and elodea   1/31/13

<Big C!>
For now I've ordered some "Omega Veggie Rounds" wafers at 34% protein (http://www.arcatapet.com/item.cfm?cat=11091  ) , and some "Ken's Premium veggie sticks with Calcium" at 35% protein (http://www.kensfish.com/moreinfo/kens-premium-veggie-sticks-calcium.html ) I read good things about the Omega's not "dissolving" as quickly as some of the other wafers. Guess we'll see.
<Should be fine>
And the order of elodea I ordered for feeding and for setting up our little grow tank experiment just arrived today as well, so hopefully we'll be in good shape. I've had the dechlorinated water sitting for a good week now, and I just added a bunch of elodea and our 5 little white clouds. So we'll see how it goes.
Thanks so much Bob, I'll let you know if I have more questions :)
<K! BobF>

Any Idea what this is?   12/6/10
I received some of this Aledea and a few small tropical freshwater fish from my fathers tank when I went up for a visit. The tank originally only had a 40w fixture that had come with the tank. Since we decided to add the plants I purchased an extra fixture with roughly 130w. The tank is a typical 4ft 75g. About a month after we stared getting this growth on the plants. Any Idea what it is and is it harmful?
<Hello Collin. This is just algae of some sort. Harmless in itself, but an indication that the environment isn't right in some regard. I will remind you that Elodea is a COLDWATER plant and rarely does well in tropical aquaria. When kept in water above, say, 18 C/64 F is has VERY HIGH light demands, and simply won't thrive under less than 3-4 watts/gallon. It also needs hard water and won't thrive in soft water or at acidic pH levels.
Overall, a very poor choice for tropical systems, though a good pond plant and viable in unheated aquaria with 2-3 watts/gallon lighting. But please, do scale down your images before sending them, to around 500 KB or so each. On a Macintosh, the built-in (and default image viewing) application Preview does this nicely; just open the image, choose Adjust Size from the Tools menu, select 640 x 480 from the Fit To pull-down menu, and then click OK. The result will be an image ideally sized for use on e-mails and web
pages. I'm sure similar tools exist for other operating systems such as Linux, Windows, etc. It's a small thing for you, but makes our life massively easier because full-size images clog up our limited file space
for e-mail attachments, eventually causing other e-mails to be bounced back unread. I'm sure you'd be pretty annoyed if it was *your* message bounced back as undeliverable! It also makes it easier for us to quickly download your images and view them without having to wait a minute or two. Cheers, Neale.>

Re: Any Idea what this is?   12/6/10
Thank you for your quick response and I am sorry about the attachment size, I just wanted to make sure the resolution was adequate to show the organisms detail. I spoke with my father who gave me the plant and apparently I was mistaken about the species. It is not Elodea Canadensis as I had thought. He received it from a LFS some years ago and he says it grows well in his ponds and aquarium which he keeps around 70 and it dies off in the pond during the winter. Anyway he isn't sure of the species, but
he thinks it maybe Anacharis.
<Possibly, but more like some sort of Lagarosiphon or Egeria, both of these genera being more common in the trade than Anacharis. Do look at Egeria densa, Lagarosiphon major, Elodea callitrichoides and Elodea nuttallii, all of which are moderately to very common in the trade. Potamogeton crispus is also kept in ponds, but rarely in aquaria.>
He also mentioned that it has one white flower per node of the stem. I have not had it bloom yet. Apparently the leaves are also much larger than Elodea Canadensis. Based on this new information does this ring any bells?
<The white fuzzy stuff remains algae. Cheers, Neale.>

Live plants  - 4/1/10
ok this might sound dumb but I have never had live plants before. I have 2 Anubias barteri golden,
<This is an epiphyte. DO NOT bury the green lateral stem (the rhizome) in the gravel or the plant will die. Attach the whole thing to some bogwood or a piece of lava rock using black cotton.>
1 bunch Anacharis
<Likely Egeria densa or Elodea canadensis. Yes, push the roots into the sediment. This plant needs a good deal of light to grow. Egeria densa is intolerant of warm water, this a coldwater/pond plant, so keep below 24 C/75 F, which happens to be a good temperature for Platies and Swordtails.
Even then tends to get raggedy after a while. Elodea canadensis will only last a few weeks above 20 C/68 F. Both species also be left floating, and it will anchor itself with long white roots. Looks a bit messy that way, though. As you can tell, neither plant is recommend for tropical tanks. You would do much better with a good clump of Indian Fern (Ceratopteris thalictroides). This easy to grow floating plant is a superb addition to livebearer tanks.>
and 1 java fern coming
<Like the Anubias, DO NOT plant in the substrate but instead attach to bogwood or lava rock.>
now do I just plant them into the gravel in the fish tank? I have a 10 gallon tank with medium lighting and the fish are swords and Platies
<Too small for Platies, and MUCH too small for Swordtails. Adult Swordtails will need a tank three times this size. They are big, quite aggressive fish. Platies need 20 gallons. Do research the needs of fish (and plants!) prior to purchase.>
thank you so much for any help
<Good luck, Neale.>

Anacharis and Platys or Guppies or Goldfish-Water Temperature    3/21/10
After 29 years, I am back to Tropical Fish. Just purchased a Hagen Fluval 6 gallon tank.
<A lot of money, not a very large volume of water.>
I want to include Anacharis-Elodea as a grass.
<Hmm... could be done, if you're up to frequent trimming... generally grows taller than what I would consider a grass. Please read here and the linked file above the title of the article:
Will the water be too warm if I keep it around 75 using a heater.?
<I think this is a good idea -- the room you mention below, which gets fairly cool, is going to make it necessary to use a heater. Small volumes heat and cool more quickly than larger volumes of water, so I'd place this where temperature fluctuation is minimized. Even if you choose to keep fish generally considered as cool-water, I would still use a heater here to avoid temperature fluctuation, which would cause the fish discomfort and possibly lead to illness.>
Will I be better of just with common Goldfish and forget about warm water.
<Too small for even one goldfish. Please take the time to read on WWM prior to writing...
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWsubwebindex/goldfish101art.htm and any of those links above.>
Perhaps Platys and Guppies will tolerate a tank without a heater, even if the room temperature is in the mid 60's during this winter.
<They won't. Please read here on livebearers, and note that this tank is too small for them:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWsubwebindex/livebearers.htm and linked pages.
These are tropical fish, and so they need warmer water than what you can offer without a heater, and again, fluctuations in temperature need to be avoided.>
When I was a kid 60 years ago, one spring and summer I kept Guppies in a three gallon tank with Anacharis, no heater or filter; the fish multiplied and the Anacharis grew beautifully.
<I do not doubt that the Anacharis grew, as it is usually referred to as a "weed" (!), but your Guppies surely suffered in this small volume, especially as their numbers increased. In any case, if you'd like to do this "right," it's necessary to do some reading. Please also consider that the fancy guppy varieties of today are no match, in terms of hardiness, for the guppies you kept back then.>
I want to go back to my second childhood! Your help will be appreciated.
<I think your enthusiasm here is great, but unfortunately, you're beginning with a very small volume for keeping fish. There are some really great small tank set-ups that can be done, and they end up looking quite beautiful, but small tanks require extra care when stocking, maintaining, etc. Please see here on stocking small tanks, which is a task which must be done carefully in order to avoid disaster:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ca/volume_5/volume_5_3/stocking.htm. There are some really nice ideas in this article for stocking smaller tanks. I do not mean to discourage you at all, but I definitely want your first steps back into this great hobby to yield positive results! Please feel free to write back if you have any questions.

Elodea (Egeria) - Invasive species 2/2/09 Greetings Robert, <Craig> I was reading your article about Goldfish systems from this link: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/fwsubwebindex/gldfshsystems.htm Plants Perhaps? Won't the goldfish eat the plants if you put them in their tank? Likely yes. There are some varieties of live plants (Myriophyllum aka Parrot Feather or milfoil, Hornwort/Ceratophyllum'¦) that are evidently distasteful to goldfish, but I encourage you to place at least some cool water plant in with them for their benefit. My favorite choice here is Elodea (Egeria), often sold as "Anacharis", which can be rooted by weighting it down or left floating below the surface. Elodea (Egeria) is an invasive species in lakes and ponds in the US: http://www.ecy.wa.gov/programs/wq/plants/weeds/egeria.html I lived on a lake in Massachusetts where this particular plant was found. It most likely was populated when people "let their fish go" and sent their plants with it. Granted, it is a nice looking plant, when it doesn't repopulate, but can be very ugly when it takes over a lake. Please consider removing this particular suggestion from your article. <Mmm, no. Thank you for your notice, apparent concern... I do know of this plant's capacity for becoming a nuisance, hence my absolute admonition to all to NOT release anything to the wild. But, as long as this species is deemed "safe enough" to be allowed into States for ornamental use... it should be suggested for use. Again, I will re-state that NOTHING should be "let go" into areas where it does not occur... Including ornamental trees and shrubs, domestic cats, parrots... Cheers, Bob Fenner> Thanks! Craig Campbell

Elodea (Egeria) - Invasive species   02/06/09 Hi Robert, <Craig> I wanted to forward you this e-mail I received from a woman at the Department of Conservation and Recreation (DCR) in Massachusetts . Apparently, there are different types of Elodea - Egeria "densa" being the problematic species, as noted below. I imagine that there is difficulty in discerning which of these plants is "correct" when buying them. I challenge you to see if you have the 3 whorl or the 4 whorl in your aquarium! <These species are exceedingly hard to discern for most folks> Apparently, there are consequences to selling the illegal kind. There are also other illegals, at least in Massachusetts, including "Parrot Feather", which you also mention in your article. <Mmm, yes... am also looking about for my "Hydrilla Guerilla" hat...> I believe that it would be beneficial for people with fish to take care in selecting their aquatic plants, not only in terms of the fish welfare, but the community at large in regards to infecting the waterways with non-native exotics. Since your web page was one of the first I went to in regards to "fish care", I imagine you get many inquiring minds on your web-site on how to take care of the fish. If the information regarding non-native exotics were posted on your website, I believe your readers would be appreciative. In the mean time, I'm going to see if I can find some "3-whorl" Elodea to put into the goldfish tank. Thanks! Craig <I will continue to post all. Thank you for your efforts, concern. Bob Fenner>

Sinking Anacharis  8/4/07 Hello, would you have any idea why the unweighted and unbunched Anacharis strands in my 200-gallon drop-in pond keep sinking to the bottom? Once there for awhile they blanch from, my guess, lack of sun. Are they at least still doing their jobs down there, oxygenating etc.? <Have seen this as well... is it "something" to do with the circumstances, the metabolism, due to water quality, natural lighting... that the Anacharis/Egeria becomes more dense? Will continue to photosynthesize at depth> The Anacharis in my 40 gal freshwater aquarium on the other hand, float like corks. Of course in there, I wish they *would* stay bunched and rooted in the gravel, but the fish apparently have other ideas. <Ah yes> The Anacharis in both cases is from the same source, and was part of the same shipment. Kathy <I sense some experiments coming on... What is it about the two environments that results in this? Can it be reversed? Bob Fenner>

Anacharis   4/24/07 Hi crew, <Hi, Olly here in the UK> First of all thanks for running such a great site, all your information has been most helpful for us here in London, England. <Pleasure, a lot of great people have helped make it what it is> I have one question for you, I want to introduce real plants to our aquarium, most probably Anacharis, how would you recommend that I "install" it in the tank?  I assume the sponge and metal wrapped around the bottom of the plant must be removed before it is put in with our goldfish?  How do I then re-bunch the Anacharis to keep it together (is string safe for aquarium use?). < http://www.wetwebmedia.com/PlantedTksSubWebIndex/elodea.htm Run it through a dip to remove any unwanted hitchhikers. Leave the 'anchors' on as the metal in particular often acts as a fertilizer supplying the plant and then just plant it in the tank. It may eventually become a meal for your goldfish however, do watch out for this.> Thanks once again for all the help your site has given us. <Unfortunately not mine Heehee, but keep using it and enjoying it all the same> Kind regards, Sergio <Thank you for your well constructed email and good luck with everything, Olly>

Egeria densa sourcing    3/20/07 Good Morning, Can you tell me where I can order this plant for a science project. Regards, TODD DABBS <Mmm, you should be able to buy it locally, at/through an LFS (Livestock Fish Store)... Do you need a lot (boxes?)... If so, I would order through one of the aquatic garden suppliers in Florida... you can locate these through the FTFFA (.com). If you want, have greater facility through these means, the various Biological Supply Houses (e.g. Carolina) can/will supply you. Oh, and the usual cautionary remark to be aware that this species and Elodea canadensis are often mis-sold as each other. Bob Fenner> Re: Egeria densa   3/20/07 I do thank you for your response. I later found that any (waterweed) is illegal in Texas. Thanks you're your help. Kindest Regards, TODD DABBS <Ahh, you're welcome. And the usual taken opportunity to admonish the release of any non-native organism here... Do place such "extra" plant materials in the freezer (w/o water in a plastic bag) and toss in the trash on/near trash day... NOT down the toilet, NOR ever in an outdoor body of water with possible egress. Bob Fenner>

Freshwater plant (Anacharis) stunted growth  - 10/25/06 Hello crew, I'm having a problem with some of my plants, Anacharis in particular. I have a 55 gallon tank and 55 gallon filter, and a 10 gallon aerator. I only have a partial load of fish (maybe 25 inches worth) Including 2 silver dollars. <Am surprised these haven't eaten this plant material> Which is why the Anacharis is so important-its the only plant besides Java Moss that they won't eat. <Mmm... unusual> Initially the Anacharis was growing wild, but now the older bundles are barely growing at all, and even new bundles won't take off the way they used to, they just kind of break off bit by bit until its all gone. I do and have done for two years) weekly water changes and testing, and nothing has changed-water parameter wise. I'm not really sure if I want to start fertilizing, or adding CO2, as I have heard these can cause complications. Can you guys recommend anything? Thanks -Julian <There is a sort of "age span" for Egeria/Elodea and its non-sexual reproductive phase... I suspect yours has reached this limit. I would try introducing some new stock here. Bob Fenner>

Hardy Plant Health Mystery - 12/13/2005 Dear Mr. Fenner, <Actually, Sabrina with you today, in his stead> Please help, upon research, I can find no solid information or logical conclusion as to why my current batch of Elodea densa turns brown at the tips, roughly three inches back. this comes after a long growth period under "prime" conditions (see specs below) with no other problems to any of the other plants.  The Anacharis is not growing but are not falling apart, they appear stunted, my only hypotheses is, after the long growth period the original stems (rooted) have up to five consecutive side shoots and combined are roughly two feet in length. In conclusion I ask for your advice, do I need to prune, <I would.> raise temp, <No, your temp is fine.  Warmer would be bad for E. densa.> or anything else you may know, that I have overlooked (29gal, 36wt. 67k, 36wt. 10k, <Tank size would be helpful to know, with regards to your lighting amount....  and type of lighting is more useful to know than just wattage alone....> 62f-72f. hang-on refugium, 5lbs. miracle mud, <This is almost starting to sound like a salt tank....  How is the miracle mud working out for you in a freshwater system?  I didn't realize there was a miracle mud product marketed for freshwater folks.> C02 setup, laterite base, API iron supplements, heavily stocked with fish and plants).  I appreciate your time and expertise, <The only other thing that I can think of (and this really is entirely likely) is that the other plants may actually be outcompeting the Elodea/Egeria for food/nutrients.  Otherwise, it is also possible that your various plants are engaging in allelopathy....  I would Google "freshwater plant allelopathy" for more information, and might look at Diana Walstad's plant book.> Eric Lammers <Wishing you well,  -Sabrina> Elodea use in Conn. 12/14/05 Dear Mr. Fenner: <Bill/William>      I am a high school science teacher and I would like to conduct an experiment using Elodea. <A "stock" organism for such>   I have been to five aquarium supply stores and two of them told me that the state of Connecticut has deemed it an "invasive species" and it can no longer be sold in these stores. <A possibility... is trouble if released into the wild... as are most things that can survive where mis-placed> I can find nothing about this on the Connecticut State Department of Environmental Protection web site and they are usually pretty good about providing up-to-date information about these things.  Do you know anything about this?  Thanks. Bill Watts         <I do not... but I would check with your State Fish and Game... this is often the controlling agency at this level. Cheers, Bob Fenner> Elodea canadensis I am carrying out an experiment on how light intensity affects the rate of photosynthesis. I would like to ask if you could please email me some information about how light intensity varies in the niche of the Elodea canadensis. Any help that you could offer is greatly appreciated. >> Elodea is found here, just around Montreal Island in shallow water of the St. Lawrence River. You can get a good idea of current weather, daylight hours and seasons at this site. Remember that here we have ice on the river from December to March, sometimes longer. http://meteocentre.com/home_e.html http://www.cbc.ca/montreal/weather/?station=YUL&style=montrealFull You will have to research some data to see how much light intensity drops with turbidity (the current visibility in the habitat is around 30 feet) and depth. Good Luck, Oliver

Overwintering Anacharis Hi All, Can Anacharis be overwintered in a New England pond?  Would you advise it?   <If it is the "right" "Elodea"... Please see here re: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/PlantedTksSubWebIndex/elodea.htm There are a few plants, some tropical and some temperate that go by the common name Anacharis... If you have a coldwater one, it likely will overwinter fine, unless the water freezes about it> If so, should it be weighted to the bottom of the pond or can it be left to float on the surface as in warm months?   <Best to wait it down if you anticipate your pond surface will freeze> How should the Anacharis covering the entire surface of a 125g bacteriological/bog filter be treated?  Should I submerse it in my pond for the winter? <I would submerse it> Karen Randall of BAS, you may know about this. Thanks, Jeff <Yes, am sure. Bob Fenner> Jeffrey Zegas Elodea  I want to know the origin of this plant and what medicinal effect it has and what countries grow it.  <Hello! Thanks for writing in to WetWebMedia. Elodea, specifically Elodea canadensis, is native to cooler areas of North America, as it likes a nice, cool temperature of 50-68 degrees Fahrenheit. It is very easy to grow, and very adaptable. As for medicinal value.... I often recommend offering this plant to goldfish to keep a good content of vegetable material in their diet, which can help prevent constipation in this (and other plant-eating) fish; but I am not aware of any medicinal value of this plant outside of that. Try here for more information: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/PlantedTksSubWebIndex/elodea.htm . Wishing you well, -Sabrina>

The Beginner Plant "Anacharis", Elodea and Egeria Hi, <Hello there> I am doing a science project that involves Elodea.  After reading your article, I realized that I was required to use the author, latest date updated, and name of institution for my bibliography.  I was wondering if there might be a way for you to email me the above.  Thank you very much for your help.  Please e-mail me if you can or cannot answer the above. Thank you, <You may cite me as author, w/o a date (as in "undated") and http://www.WetWebMedia.com as the source. Bob Fenner>

Anacharis, elodea and Egeria Your article on the website is informative, but could you tell me what are the legal issues regarding sale and use of these plants for outdoor use? <There are, as far as I'm aware, no such restrictions on the sale of freshwater plants in the ornamental trade. There are some laws on the books concerning Caulerpa algae... and some fin-fish... vis a vis they're potential harm on release to the wild> The similarity of elodea to Hydrilla scares me, knowing what an environmental problem Hydrilla has become. FYI, I am a landscape architect in Louisiana. <These two genera are VERY similar indeed. As usual, I proscribe that nothing be released to the wild... terrestrial plants included. Bob Fenner> Margaret Waring

Re: No Elodea in Washington state... Hi Bob, I remember reading that there are some restrictions on Elodea. Several states have defined it as a noxious weed, including Alabama, Maine, New Hampshire, Oregon, South Carolina, Vermont, and Washington. A nice list of what's considered a weed where is www.pondkeeper.com/articlepdf/noxiousweeds.pdf .... --Ananda <Thanks much. Will post... Bob F>

Re: plants for sale? >HI there :) >>Hello Erica.  Sorry this is so late, but I've been out of town. >I came across your website and was interested in purchasing some Anacharis, I am not sure if you sell any but I would love to buy some. >>I'm sorry, but to the best of my knowledge we don't sell anything other than advertising space on the site.  Maybe one of the sponsors?  Although most are geared for "salties".  You might try a Google search, Anacharis should be easy enough to find. >I have home made turtle ponds and my turtles crave plants. Would you be willing to sell me some? I am really interested! Please get back to me. Thanks in advance :) >>Sorry I can't tell you what you'd like to hear, Erica, but as I said, it should be easy enough to find via Google (or even a search of your local pet shops?).  Best of luck!  Marina

Plants for sale? Who sells Anacharis? HI there :) I came across your website and was interested in purchasing some Anacharis    , I am not sure if you sell any but I would love to buy some. I have home made turtle ponds and my turtles crave plants. Would you be willing to sell me some? I am really interested! Please get back to me. Thanks in advance :) Best Regards, Erica Belczysnki <Hi there. We don't sell anything other than our own books, images, but there is a list of businesses that do offer aquatic plants, including Anacharis/Elodea. Please see our root web: www.WetWebMedia.com and from there, the "Planted Tank" Subweb, and the "links" pages there and the "Ponds" link pages... see the livestock listings? These are links as well. Bob Fenner>

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