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Trying to save my fish; CP f'      9/10/17
Hi
<Mike>
I had a group of 5 fish (juvenile Queen, an adult Imperator, a Powder Blue and Achilles tangs and a smaller Blue Jaw Trigger) in my 160 gal QT system, made up of 3 - 55gal tanks plus sump. They have been there since Aug.
12th. They seemed to be doing good at first. They were in lower salinity water for over two weeks ~ 17ppt, temp 78F, pH around 8. I started to slowly bring the parameters up to match my display when I saw Ick break out on the Tangs.
<Very common; as you likely know these two Tang species are VERY susceptible>
I lowered the salinity back down to 17ppt and did 2 treatments of Chloroquine Phosphate (from National Fish Pharmaceuticals) . After a week the trigger died. The Ick seems to have morphed into Amyloodinium
ocellatum - cloudy eyes, shedding slime, patchy white on the Achilles...I'm not sure if the darkening pelvic fin is on the Powder Blue is a symptom of something else.
<Could be sampled, looked at under a 'scope. Perhaps just chemical/physical burn>
The tangs have stopped eating.
<VERY bad>
The two angels are still in better shape - I only see white spots on the eyes and they are still eating well. I gave both tangs a fresh water dip yesterday but didn't see any improvement. I pushed the salinity lower to 14ppt. I am about to do a 25% water change and give another treatment of Chloroquine. Am I missing something?
<The CP may be hurting more than helping here. >
Is there something else I should be doing? Here are some pictures.
<IF these were my fishes, I'd NOT use the quinine, but just drop the spg.
down to 1.010, and hope. They may be too impugned to come back at this point>
I would appreciate any suggestions you might have Thanks,
Mike Spizzirri
<I would have you read re others experiences w/ CP (on WWM) as well. Can be tricky in use: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/QuinTrbFixF.htm
and the other Quinine FAQs files linked above. Bob Fenner>

Re: Sponge Spa Day     9/9/17
Good morning WWM,
<TT; oh... is this the same friend as on FB?> My two orange ball sponges (Cinachyra alloclada) tend to be more susceptible to debris/minor algae growth.
*yep same as Facebook!*

<I do think this is a common issue in captive specimens... and to a lesser extent on ones in the wild> They are positioned in low light areas to prevent algae and one of them hosts a cleaner shrimp (that is obviously horrible at his job). Occasionally, I will put on some gloves and use a fine makeup brush to gently clean them with my arms in the tank, but I am always afraid I will hurt them.
<Mmm; think this is fine>
*The wild one is so much "holier" than mine.*
<<Ahh!>>

This method, with me being so delicate, doesn’t completely clean them off either. How rough is too rough on the surface of the sponge or, more importantly, is this practice not safe for the sponges? What is the best way to safely clean them?
<I suspect that Cinachyra are very tough, resilient. I would do this brushing regularly (weekly) during water changes, gravel vacuuming, what have you; while you're in the tank already. I might add blasting them with a submersible pump during this maintenance period. >
*Good to know. I've sometimes employed the use of one of the turkey basters for this, but wasn't sure I could use a stronger water pump.*
<<Good>>

I consider myself something of a sponge collector and, since all the sponges in my system grow very happily, hope this general dirtiness is not a sign of poor health.
<It is not; assuredly. Will toss in a pic of one from the wild... AND invite you out to go dive adventure traveling with us (have done so) on the FB Scuba Diving Friends page... Out to Cozumel next mo!.>
*Thanks! I am so jealous and would love to go another time. I am teaching software classes for most of October, but I am pursuing my scuba license to finally go diving in Cozumel in December. Always wanted to scuba but I am a little claustrophobic. Overcoming my fears so I can join a program to replant coral. Can't very well save the coral if you can't dive, right?*
<<Lots of ways to contribute... less pollution, reproduction... B>>

Here is a photo of SpongeBob Circle Pants the sponge and Patrick the cleaner shrimp: https://www.screencast.com/t/Wco0cN2Qy
<Nice! I would move this specimen up perhaps a few (couple) of inches, onto rock. Bob Fenner>
*Will do!*

Any feedback you have is greatly appreciated. Thanks!
S pozdravem / Best regards,
<Vítejte, Bob Fenner>

Lymphocystis and Potamotrygon (RMF?)<I totally concur w/ your stmt.s>     9/9/17
I recently found white cauliflower like white tufts on the side of one of my CA cichlids. Upon much research I've 99% concluded its Lympho. Now my whole 340g system is infected.
<Let's be clear about Lymphocystis -- although there is a pathogen involved, it is almost certainly triggered by the environment rather than being contagious. Some type of stress is usually involved. For example, maintaining Scats in freshwater rather than brackish water, or exposing bottom-dwelling fish to a substrate that isn't kept properly clean. In the wild, heavy metals and industrial pollution are believed to be the main reasons Lymphocystis becomes common in some lakes and seas.>
I was going to rearrange some fish, one of the being some Marble stingrays into the 340 and cichlids to another system. My question do I have to break the 340 down and clean it or will the virus disappear upon removal of the
infected fish?
<There is no cure for Lymphocystis, and because it isn't contagious, it isn't something that needs to be eliminated. Treatment is really all about optimising living conditions (and probably diet, e.g., with a vitamin supplement and/or fresh green foods) and waiting for the fish to get better by itself. Lymphocystis tumours will take months, even years to subside, though vets will sometimes surgically remove tumours from big, expensive fish such as Koi. I think you'd be surprised how often Koi receive high-end medical care comparable to cats and dogs! For more mundane fish, time is the great healer when it comes to Lymphocystis. Do remember that Lymphocystis is unsightly but usually not life-threatening (unless the tumour obstructs something important like the mouth, gills or vent).>
Can Potamotrygon even catch the virus.
<Exposed to the wrong conditions for a long time, sure, it's possible. But the virus is probably latent in most aquaria, and not something we normally worry about being "catchy". Killing viruses in aquaria is virtually impossible anyway, though again, some treatments do exist for the high value Koi which are subject to viral infections of various types.>
What steps should I do to clean the system after removal of contagious fish and setup?
<Think about what inorganic stress factors (such as heavy metals, like copper) might be present in the system. Think about the cleanliness of the aquarium generally -- the quality of the water, the frequency of water changes, and the turnover rate of the filter. Low oxygen levels can easily stress big fish like Stingrays and South American cichlids. Diet is probably a factor too, especially when you're keeping cichlids -- most are omnivores in the wild, but aquarists frequently neglect the green content of their diet, and fresh greens are probably important sources of vitamins that help support their immune systems.>
Thanks, Don
<Cheers, Neale.>

Re: Website Reference About Freshwater and Planted Tank       9/8/17
Hi Bob,
<Ben>
Thank you for your reply.
Will looking forward of your updates.
Thanks,
Benjamin
<Cheers mate. BobF>

Re: Pearlscale with dropsy?      9/8/17
Hi again,
<Hey Melissa>
If I were to treat with salt, would you recommend doing a salt dip or to treat the entire aquarium?
<The whole tank. Dips/baths in whatever salt/s employed would do very little here>

I moved the pearl scale to a ten gallon a few days ago; normally, I wouldn't, but the Oranda was nipping/chasing her so much I was scared that it would continue stressing her. I've included two pictures that show how red her stomach/behind has gotten (the reddest portion is where she is missing a scale that fell off, and the red is around her scales in case it isn't clear in the photos)
I'm cleaning her tank everyday with 70% water changes, and she has an air pump and sponge filter set up with her.
<... is it cycled. Id est, there is NO nitrite or ammonia present? If not...>

She isn't bottom sitting or hiding in this tank, and she eats (I'm only feeding her a few peas every couple of days now). She is a very social, good natured little fish (which hasn't changed since she became sick).
At this point should I be concerned about septicemia? Or would you say the red is ammonia burns/poisoning?
<The latter, perhaps aiding in the former>
Another note, one of her scales fell off but is still attached to her (just by a little bit), it's become 'fuzzy' looking, I figured I would leave it be and let it fall off on its own, but would it be better to cut it off?
The other fish (in the main tank) are doing better, the fin rot on my larger Oranda looks about the same (barring a few tiny red patches that I couldn't quite photograph).
I've been putting Tetra Safe Start in the tank (definitely not my first choice, but the only thing locally available), so far ammonia levels seem lower than they were originally, but I haven't detected any nitrite or nitrate.
<Not cycled, cycling unless nitrate is accumulating... AND this likely will NOT occur due to the too-large too-frequent water changes. SEE our prev. corr. and where I've referred you to re cycling freshwater systems.>
I will continue doing small water changes with the hope that it will cycle.
<.... PLEASE READ HERE:

http://www.wetwebmedia.com/fwsubwebindex/fwestcycling.htm
and the linked files above. Bob Fenner>
Thanks again for all your help!
Melissa

Sponge Spa Day      9/8/17
Good morning WWM,
<TT; oh... is this the same friend as on FB?>
My two orange ball sponges (Cinachyra alloclada) tend to be more susceptible to debris/minor algae growth.
<I do think this is a common issue in captive specimens... and to a lesser extent on ones in the wild>
They are positioned in low light areas to prevent algae and one of them hosts a cleaner shrimp (that is obviously horrible at his job). Occasionally, I will put on some gloves and use a fine makeup brush to gently clean them with my arms in the tank, but I am always afraid I will hurt them.
<Mmm; think this is fine>
This method, with me being so delicate, doesn’t completely clean them off either. How rough is too rough on the surface of the sponge or, more importantly, is this practice not safe for the sponges? What is the best way to safely clean them?
<I suspect that Cinachyra are very tough, resilient. I would do this brushing regularly (weekly) during water changes, gravel vacuuming, what have you; while you're in the tank already. I might add blasting them with a submersible pump during this maintenance period. >
I consider myself something of a sponge collector and, since all the sponges in my system grow very happily, hope this general dirtiness is not a sign of poor health.
<It is not; assuredly. Will toss in a pic of one from the wild... AND invite you out to go dive adventure traveling with us (have done so) on the FB Scuba Diving Friends page... Out to Cozumel next mo!.>
Here is a photo of SpongeBob Circle Pants the sponge and Patrick the cleaner shrimp: https://www.screencast.com/t/Wco0cN2Qy
<Nice! I would move this specimen up perhaps a few (couple) of inches, onto rock. Bob Fenner>
Any feedback you have is greatly appreciated. Thanks!
S pozdravem / Best regards,
<Vítejte, Bob Fenner>


Re: Avoiding Thiaminase      9/8/17
Thank you for the response.
<Glad that we're sharing Jason>
This is a quote from an article by Kylyssa Shay. Do you think that this is not true in all cases? Maybe puffers cannot have fish as their main diet, but can have it as part of a diet?
https://pethelpful.com/fish-aquariums/porcupine_puffer_basics
"Balloonfish are not piscivores. That means that, in nature, they don't eat fish. Do not feed fish, live or dead, to them. Feeding fish to pork puffers may cause something called fatty liver disease, a usually fatal ailment.
Not only that but the nutrient balance found in fish is very different from that found in mollusks and crustaceans, their natural prey. Feeding fish, especially live feeder fish, to your porcupine puffer can also unnaturally
accustom him to eating fish, making him a danger to future tank mates.
Carefully read the ingredients of any prepared fish foods you give your pet.
Choose those with invertebrates such as shrimp, krill, squid, clams, or mussels listed as their first ingredient. Avoid all prepared fish foods with any type of grain or fish meal listed first in the ingredients."
Jason
<Mmm; well... will have to look further for input; but though I agree that Diodontids are principal feeders on hard-shelled invertebrates in the wild; have seen them eat Seastars, fishes... BobF>

RE: Another picture of starfish  9/7/17
Thanks so much for the reply! I do believe this star comes from Florida area, as it was included in shipment of algae collected in Florida...., and my lighting in the picture is making the star look more blue, it's actually kind of a mauve color....
<Mmm; maybe another Echinaster then... E. spinulosus?
Bob Fenner>
Wendy

Day and Night Plecos  9/7/17
Hello:
<Hello Judy,>
I was wondering if there are any smaller diurnal, day time Plecos that can be kept with a male Bushynose?
<So far as Loricariidae go, the best bets are Whiptails. These are active day and night, won't compete for food, but are completely peaceful. Alternatively, there are the Hypoptopoma species, which are a bit like giant Otocinclus, up to around 8 cm/3 inches in length. Lovely fish, with requirements much like Otocinclus -- lots of current, plenty of oxygen -- but strongly herbivorous in diet.>
I have a feeling the answer is no, as it would be an issue of territory and for some maybe interbreeding. Thank you
<Most welcome, Neale.>

Avoiding Thiaminase  9/7/17
Hello crew,
I read the article on Thiaminase and I found it very informative. I was left with a question, what am I supposed to feed my porcupine puffer? I see that there are some non-Thiaminase fish offerings, but puffers do not eat fish.
<Mmm; assuredly they do. Have seen several species of puffers consume fish in the wild and captivity>
It caused fatty liver disease over time.
<Do you have reference/s for this assertion? Your intuition, experience?>
It seems that everything I feed him is high in Thiaminase. Squid, scallops, clam, mussel, oyster, shrimp is always in the mix. I do add Boyd's Vita Chem to the food. Is this enough to counteract the effects of the Thiaminase.
<To some extent; yes. B vitamins can be added to foods, water...>
I used to use Selcon, but the Boyd's seems to be a more complete multi vitamin.
Thanks,
Jason
<I'd add in some whole (small) fishes or bits of fillet in this mix of invertebrate fare. Bob Fenner>
Re: Avoiding Thiaminase      9/8/17

Thank you for the response.
<Glad that we're sharing Jason>
This is a quote from an article by Kylyssa Shay. Do you think that this is not true in all cases? Maybe puffers cannot have fish as their main diet, but can have it as part of a diet?
https://pethelpful.com/fish-aquariums/porcupine_puffer_basics
"Balloonfish are not piscivores. That means that, in nature, they don't eat fish. Do not feed fish, live or dead, to them. Feeding fish to pork puffers may cause something called fatty liver disease, a usually fatal ailment.
Not only that but the nutrient balance found in fish is very different from that found in mollusks and crustaceans, their natural prey. Feeding fish, especially live feeder fish, to your porcupine puffer can also unnaturally
accustom him to eating fish, making him a danger to future tank mates.
Carefully read the ingredients of any prepared fish foods you give your pet.
Choose those with invertebrates such as shrimp, krill, squid, clams, or mussels listed as their first ingredient. Avoid all prepared fish foods with any type of grain or fish meal listed first in the ingredients."
Jason
<Mmm; well... will have to look further for input; but though I agree that Diodontids are principal feeders on hard-shelled invertebrates in the wild; have seen them eat Seastars, fishes... BobF>

re: Can't ID hair like growth in reef aquarium(SMALLER SIZED PICS). Hydrozoan control  9/7/17
I have tuxedo urchins Trochus up the time the no difference I've even put the urchin on top of the stuff and in morning or just moved away not eating
Matthew
<Am frequently surprised (while out diving in the wild) at just how MUCH hydropolyp biomass there is about... There MUST be a bunch of organisms that compete, consume these (pest in captivity) organisms... Or circumstances otherwise that limit their metabolism, spread... But what of real use in our aquariums?
IF you search (on the Net) re pest hydrozoa/ns, Myrionema and such, you will find that MANY other aquarists have had these challenges... and about the same possible/potential "cures" that I have mentioned categorically.
Bob Fenner>
Macri

Re: Lifting my content; aka stealing     9/6/17
And reported your stealing Dr.s Foster & Smith's content to them as well

I have asked several times for the link to your work so I can bring it to the attention of my web designer. If you don't provide me a link for me to verify this problem I will not remove it.
<... a link? Again, and hopefully for the last time. The writing and image work is mine. And attributed as such on your site. I have no record of selling you such and my stated content use policy: http://wetwebmedia.com/WWMUsePolicyStmt.htm
- WETWEBMEDIA<http://wetwebmedia.com/WWMUsePolicyStmt.htm>
<Taking other people's property w/o their express consent is thievery>
Do you know how many of these emails I get. Send me a link to prove to me it's your work or f### off!!!!!
<.... You've make a mistake. Robert (Bob) Fenner>
Chris David & Tammy Pelsinski
Twisted Tailfins Aquatics, Inc
574-208-8640
twistedtailfins@gmail.com<mailto:twistedtailfins@gmail.com>
Www.saltwateraquaticsofindiana.com <http://Www.saltwateraquaticsofindiana.com>
<You continue to steal my work. Have reported other thievery as above. See you in court. Bob Fenner, WetWebMedia.com>

Substrate Issue     9/6/17
Hi,
<Hello,>
I got a couple of African dwarfs and immediately fell in love. We had them in a 3 gallon tank, no filter and managed to keep them alive for 5 months with daily water changes and watching ammonia very carefully.
<Understood. But do review their needs:

http://wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/FrogsArtNeale.htm
Although basically easy to keep, their long-term care does require a few things to be 'just right' otherwise they will slowly starve, chill, or otherwise die.>
I think i have gone overboard testing ph twice a day ammonia once a day, and the tank obviously never cycled.
<Indeed not; without a filter, ammonia will simply accumulate between water changes.>
Anyways I went crazy and got a 20 Gallon, Fluval 106 Filter, an Anubias and hornwort live plants, and Fluval Shrimp Substrate (Very expensive and the salesperson suggested it.)
<It's a good substrate for certain situations. It is not chemically inert, which in my book is a no-no for easy fishkeeping! It (apparently) reduces the pH and hardness, which requires you to buffer the water to prevent pH
changes. That's fine if you want low hardness and neutral to acidic pH levels, and you're buffering the water accordingly (for example with a commercial Discus buffer) but for ordinary fishkeeping, this is one more hassle. Probably not a deal-breaker if you have 'liquid rock' water with a very high alkalinity and a basic pH, but if you have softish water, this could be a nuisance. On the other hand, it is also designed to be a biologically active substrate almost like filter media, so ideal for tanks with little to no filtration -- albeit tanks with very low loading, i.e., shrimps, where low rates of biological filtration is acceptable. Not an alternative to filtration with frogs or fish.>
So, I have been trying to cycle the system for almost 2 months, nada. I put the waste water from changes into the new tank for over a month with no change 0.25 - 1.0 Ammonia,0 Nitrites,0 Nitrates.
<Water contains few filter bacteria. What you want to add is gravel from a mature tank, or alternatively, some live filter medium taken from an established aquarium. Either way, the filter bacteria come attached to solid things, like gravel and sponges.>
We ended up putting the frogs in and they seem happy, but I have found my ph s staying at 6.0 - 6.2, after water changes, I have tried various methods, changing 20% water every second day, ph increase(i know you don't
suggest that) 50% water changes once a week. Even if I get the ph to 7.0 - 7.2 in one day it is back to 6.0. My guess is it is the Fluval substrate, as I have found out it is for lower ph systems.
<Correct.>
The plants love it and flourish, the frogs seem ok, but I worry its too low.
<It is a bit low for the frogs, which will be happier around a neutral pH, but provided the pH doesn't go below 6, it's not dangerous. I would suggest purchasing a neutral pH buffer, adding to each new batch of water when you do water changes, and seeing if that steadies the pH around 6.5-7, which is ideal.>
Should I remove the substrate and go with sand or gravel?
<If you've invested a lot in the Fluval substrate, you could certainly persist, though with the addition of some commercially available buffer.
But you could also switch to something chemically inert, like smooth silver sand (often called pool filter sand) if you prefer an easier life and don't mind setting the Fluval sand aside for another project. Spread it out on some newspaper under the sunshine, and it'll dry out quickly, and you can then store it until you need it again.>
I got a male for the two females, but we lost him, I feel this was because of the ph level.
<pH changes will certainly stress, potentially kill, the frogs. But do also review water quality, and more crucially, diet -- most frogs die from starvation than anything else. A varied diet is important.>
Thanks for any advice!!
Warm Regards,
Webmaster ~ J.
<Welcome, Neale.>

Re: Website Reference About Freshwater and Planted Tank     9/6/17
Hello Bob,
<Ben>
Thank you for your reply.
<Sure>
Looks like the link has error place in Education Site section.
<Oh?>
Now your site show Error pointing to :
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/WWMadminSubWebIndex/aquafishwiki.com
Can you check if the link missing " http:// " on the front?
<Ahh... it does not>
Should be http://aquafishwiki.com in your <a> tag.
Looking forward of your reply.
Thanks,
Benjamin
<Will fix during the routine in the AM. Cheers, BobF>

re: Can't ID hair like growth in reef aquarium(SMALLER SIZED PICS)     9/6/17
Mr. Fenner
<Matthew!>
Here I bought a stereo microscope and took pictures of the pictures of the hair like growth being told. Hydroid digitate, Bryozoan Bryopsis, algae of unknown... Can someone please help me now??
<Mmm; well the color, strands remind me of algae... are there cell walls in the strings? That is individual cells making parts of the strands? If not, perhaps a blue green "algae". The expanded tips remind me of the ciliate Vorticella... how big are these? Could be a digitate hydroid, but so green?
Sorry, can't make out more here. Bob Fenner>
Matthew

re: Can't ID hair like growth in reef aquarium (SMALLER SIZED PICS)     9/6/17
Some are 1/4" some maybe 1" but they come back quick...
<Umm; these are digitate hydroids... I'd be removing them>

Let me mess with the new Gadget it says up to 600x. I just held it with my hand and focused as best as I could I'm going to suction it down to a piece of glass I did add some distilled water to it I pulled it with tweezers from the base I
was hoping you could identify it by the circle tips at the ends of the object it looks like a red blood cell but green this is what they look like at there latest like largest... 1" tall Max. Look white not matter if I use a blue flashlight or if I use a white flashlight they look the same until I pull them out of the water then they are green right away I don't know if it's the oxygenation or if they're just green and look white but they have no feeding response when I feed my Montipora wouldn't a did you take hydrated have a feeding response to Reef Roids or Coral Frenzy or even Cyclops I see no change in anything actually the ones that have peaked in size have ingrown no more but if I were to pull them off or toothbrush them they would come back not as fast like tall wise but they come back on the Fred I brush them off when they were very small and within two days they're still back to their very small stage of maybe one 20th of an inch did you take my droid have a feeding response to reef Roids or coral frenzy or even Cyclops I see no change in anything actually the ones that have peed in size haven't grown no more but if I were to pull them off or toothbrush them they would come back not as fast like tall wise but they come back on the Fred's <?> I brush them off when they're very small and within 2 days there they're still back to their very small stage of maybe 1/20 of an inch. ..
<Pull the affected rocks out... dry>
if I can't figure this out I'm going to trash the library and then quarantine all my coral into a small 22 gallon frag tank because I'm worried that if I toothbrush this stuff off put them into a new tank it will just start the process all over again even though I'm using dry live rock next time or maybe I will just frag pieces of SPS that don't have any
near it but it's the track of philia that I don't know if it has these things on the small base underneath they don't grow on any fleshy Parts only on hard surfaces except glass... I noticed them growing on my overflow wall there is none in my refugium skimmer compartment because which is weird I have a 300 watt Mars light and a macro reactor and a CFL light growing some red color for red kelp tree like red grapes growing on a vine None but in the display...
<Thank goodness>
If I can't figure this out I'm going to most likely have to throw away a lot of corals that I've been nursing back from that product vibrant liquid aquarium cleaner and caused my anemones to basically shrivel up and it did nothing to this stuff after five doses I will try to get a better photo more detailed of the cell walls I mean the box of this microscope stereo microscope shows this thing looking at organisms not just maybe that's the picture I took of this stuff was maybe 40-50 X I mean looking at a hair is not that impressive when it advertises 600x maybe it's the distance I had it at it was too close Maybe I know it wasn't too far away... Just another question I bought some live rock drive from BRS.
<... see others opinions.>
The curing process. Just sit in barrel for few months small WC every week maybe and when no nitrite there ready? But how long do u leave em in there so there actually live and not just the decay wearing off and no po4 leaching.,. Also when I start so I have to seed with i.e. Biospira or an alrdy cured LR (NOT ONE OF MINE) even though some have these things on them while some but taking the risk isn't my biggest thing. I notice they don't sting cut irritate the sps and stunting growth. I have my macroalgae reactor running now and I also reinstall my algae Turf scrubber which the vibrant aquarium cleaner people told me to take off line so I'm hoping after that I've already
noticed a tripling of my Chaeto that I put in there a very small amount that you twist tie onto the plates and I'm also going to reinstall a new UV light I haven't had a UV running for about 8 months now but I think a recent tail rot and a Popeye incident in two separate fish I think UV would not be a bad thing
<Is a good thing>
and maybe when I toothbrush these things off it might stop the spreading of these or regrowth because the spores if any will die once they go inside the UV chamber fingers crossed thanks for your response and if you could please reply about the live rock curing that would be great thanks again you guys are wonderful for taking the time to answer regular folks like me that sometimes the answers might not even be there ever.
With much appreciation
Matt Macri
<Welcome to my input. Bob Fenner>

re: Can't ID hair like growth in reef aquarium (SMALLER SIZED PICS)     9/6/17
What about taking one rock out... Putting in a bucket of tank water with heater and pump... Cover it dark for three days and see if it dies..
<Mmm; not likely to die this way; but go ahead and try it>
How long can you dark out a tank safely without killing Coral?
<Depends, but likely the corals will die at about the same rate/exposure>
Ppl do it for Bryopsis etc.. I can hammer a piece of rock that the top half has the largest strands of this stuff.. it's a large branch rock with s large green Monti growing from a small ledge in the middle of it.. I was thinking of
basically halving it and black it out for 3-4 days and if it kills it.
It's an algae and I should do it to my whole tank....
Your input?
<Physically systematically removing, scrubbing off (and rinsing) outside the tank is my fave, direct approach... There are folks who advocate chemical means of burning, sealing... There are some potential predators including Nudibranchs, Seaslugs, Urchins, possibly fishes (e.g. dwarf angels) that might consume this pest>
I've never had a pest issue in 2 years I always found natural remedies like Emerald crabs or Turbo snails are sea cucumbers to keep mice and overturned or Nassarius snails to do the same thing bristle worms to eat overfed food always having a quarantine tank at Bay in case something happens always not being cheap on equipment even though I'm on disability but I save my money rather than buying cheap stuff I buy the good equipment this way it doesn't break or electrocute me or there's all kinds of stuff that can happen but I also buy a backup that's less expensive just in case... I just don't want to have to somehow take my fish somewhere else to a fish store which I can't monitor mean for all I know they could be breaking out and diseases and dying cleaning my tank out putting my Coral in a small frag tank with an acrylic box filter and basically scrubbing my tank with water and bleach and then scrubbing out my sump as well..
Done cycling my tank curing my live rock which isn't going to be new dry live rock once it's cured I have to re cure it so there's no phosphates linking or put it in my tank fish only for a month or two while the phosphates Leach out and then put my corals back in my tank once the phosphate start reading zero again that's a very very long and tedious process and I would have to find a place for all my snails crabs cucumbers pet shrimp of many sorts but I have a quarantine tank that is medicine free I could just add a few of the bad live rock in there to give them places
to hide and just Neil
<?>
throw some food in there once in awhile some algae Wafers some other kinds of food just to keep him alive and sand on the bottom for my Tigertail cucumbers one is almost 2 ft long and the other is about 10 inches and I definitely don't want them to die them are one of my favorite things to look at when they come out
Matthew
<Bob Fenner>
re: Can't ID hair like growth in reef aquarium (SMALLER SIZED PICS)     9/6/17

What if I remove the affected rocks couldn't I significantly lessen my biofilter
<? I wouldn't remove the rock permanently... Just to scrub/clean it. B>

Re: Another picture of starfish     9/6/17
Hi Bob, I've seen that star before, but can't identify it at this time.
Sorry for the delay in responding - on top of the hurricane Harvey stuff, I slipped on Monday, fell and wound up with a concussion, a cut worthy of Harry Potter on my forehead and a broken arm/wrist.
<Aye ya! When it rains....!!!>
It's nothing time won't heal, but in the meantime, I don't have any of my research books and can't find that star online. I agree that it looks like some sort of Fromia spp - or maybe an Echinaster of some sort. There's a variety in Florida/Caribbean (Echinaster sentus - not blue) that has what appears to be nodules on the arms, but they're more spine-like. I'm thinking Fromia. I'll keep looking - if I find it, I'll send in a response. Take care, Lynn Z
<Thank you Lynn. Please do take care. BobF>

Website Reference About Freshwater and Planted Tank       9/5/17
Hello WWM Team,
<Hey Benjamin!>
My name is Benjamin. I have been follow WWM updates and contents for a while ago.
I have start a project few months ago, about freshwater tropical fish and planted tank guide, to put my passion and share fishkeeping hobby with other hobbyist and have fun. http://Aquafishwiki.com provide educational values and fun for site visitors.
I would like to ask if it is possible to link up my site aquafishwiki.com with wetwebmedia.com in Sites Linking section :
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/WWMadminSubWebIndex/general_links_pg.htm
We will also link up WWM website for our audience for more informative reference if that is possible.
Looking forward of your reply.
Best Regards,
Benjamin Law
Founder of Aquafishwiki.com
<Will certainly add your link. Thank you for your efforts. Bob Fenner>

Starfish ID       9/5/17
Hello Crew!
Can anyone assist with ID of this pretty hitchhiker I found in a shipment of Botryocladia?
He appears to like meat.... found him on top of a large PE Mysis today in my seahorse tank.... Attached pics of top and bottom with Mysis attached!
Thanks,
Wendy
<Any idea Lynn? BobF>

Another picture of starfish       9/5/17
Here is a better picture of my Botryocladia hitchhiker. Can you identify?
<Looks something like a Blue Fromia species. Am asking Lynn Zurik to chime in here. Bob Fenner>


Re: Pearlscale with dropsy?       9/5/17
Hello again,
<"Little sweet one">
Thanks so much for your quick reply!
The condition of my pearl scale hasn't really changed, her scales are still sticking out, there are also increasing red areas around her bottom, and she is continuing to lose scales (I suspect more will fall off). (I have included another picture of her below)
I fed her peas, and she did end up pooping (normally I feed Repashy Soilent green fish food daily or every other day, and then feed peas once a week) her behavior is still fairly normal, she swims around the tank and isn't sitting with her fins clamped.
<Ahh>
My next concern is my largest Oranda has developed fin rot, I have included two pictures I took yesterday; what concerns me most is that her tail has gotten even worse since I took these pictures (I'll try to get more pictures later today), as there are now red sections along the edge of her fin.
Is it safe to treat the entire tank for fin rot while it's still cycling?
<Not really; and the principal reason for my previous suggestion NOT to treat. The toxicity of such is far greater concern>
I would like to treat the entire tank in this case because my other Oranda and black moor have tears in their fins and white spots along the edges.
(although not nearly as severe as the fish I've pictured, I'm still a bit concerned about them both)
<I would still hold off till the system is thoroughly cycled. There are means of advancing such, mostly via the use of exogenous bacterial culture products; ala "Dr. Tim's One and Only">
What's especially bizarre is I noticed a white fuzz on one of the Anubias nana plants I have in the aquarium (once again I'll try to get a picture later today); it's coming from the stalk and from some of the ends of the roots, it looks like some sort of fungus. Should I remove the plant from the aquarium or is it safe to keep it in?
<I would leave all as is. The fuzz is simple decomposition from excess food. You can remove when doing partial water changes>
Any advice you could provide would be greatly appreciated!
<Mmm; IF I was going to add anything... it might be simple NaCl and/or Epsom Salt. Please read through Neale's piece here re: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/fwsubwebindex/SaltUseFWArtNeale.htm
Melissa
<BobF>

small error       9/5/17
60 cm is 24 INCHES, not 24 FEET.

<Hee!>
Species
The by far most common moray eel sold as a freshwater fish is Gymnothorax tile, it is often simply referred to as 'freshwater moray eel'. Sometimes it is labeled 'Indian mud moray', 'snowflake eel' (not to be confused with the other 'snowflake eel' Echidna nebulosa) or 'gold dust moray'. It is grey and has numerous yellow to golden spots spread on the dorsal and lateral part of the body. With age the yellow spots become smaller giving the adults a more or less uniform grey appearance. They are common in the Sundaban mangrove swamps in East India, but they are also distributed in Indonesia, the Philippines and the Andaman Islands. The species reaches a maximum length of 60 cm (24').
<Can you tell me the URL where you found this error? Thank you, Bob Fenner>
Ahh, I found it: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/fwsubwebindex/fwmorayart.htm
Thanks again. BobF

Re: Maybe Not Really Algae  9/4/17
It helps tremendously, thank you!
<Most welcome! Neale.>

Munched corners  9/4/17
Hello! I need some help with my new (to me) 45 or 50g glass aquarium I just got. It measures 48" long by 18"tall, by 12" wide...in case the measurements might mean something.....
<They do... smaller, less high and long systems can suffer chips better>
lol. Anyhow, while I was cleaning it out, I noticed it has a couple of slightly munched edges along two corners. I've never owned an aquarium this size and I'm assuming even the smallest chip could potentially be a catastrophe when there's 50 gallons of water pressure pushing on it. I've taken a few pics....what is your opinion?
<Mmm; well; the clean, cup-shaped chips you've shown are likely not problematical... the one bad one is in the 20170901 pic... I'd place a strip of 2" wide 1/4", triple-strength plate against it (on the outside, up to the edge with Silastic) and turn that corner to the wall>
There's still some tape shreds I haven't scraped off from his background showing in the pics. When I noticed the corners, I quit cleaning it, lol.
The first two pics are of the munched spot on the left side. The 1st pic is a close up of the munch, and I circled where exactly it is on the 2nd pic. The rest of the pics are of the chip that has me most concerned, on the other side.
<Yes>
In the last photo I also circled where it is in relation to the entire tank. And if it means anything, both munchings are on the same side of the aquarium....(the same panel of glass).
If you need better/different pics, I'd be more than happy to go take them.....just let me know. Or a better description even....lol.
Thank you so, so much!
Cheers,
Pat Burroughs
<The second munch needs addressing as stated; the first munch I'd fill in with Silastic, to discount cuts. Bob Fenner>


Munch 1                                                     Munch 2

Re: Munched corners  9/4/17
Hello Bob
Thank you for your prompt reply. Other than the first two pictures, the rest of those pictures are of the same chip, just different angles...and that was the one I was concerned about as well. I guess I now own a 4 foot long reptile house.
<Mmm; no... you could do the simple repair I mentioned. Read re others experiences on WWM:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/SystemPIX/Tank%20Repair/glasaqcracks3.htm
and the linked files above>
Pretty disappointing considering I don't much like reptiles....hahaha.
Thank you so much for your help! I really appreciate it.
Have a great day!
Pat
<And you Pat. BobF>


Pearlscale with dropsy?  9/4/17
Hello,
<Melissa>
To start, my aquarium parameters are 0 nitrate, and 0 nitrite (I'm not sure about ammonia, since I've been dosing with prime I know that can change results/ give false positives) I detected a presence of ammonia a week ago (0.25 ppm) , which alerted me that my cycle had crashed.
<I see>
For reference, this is a 55 gallon I just set up a few weeks ago with four goldfish; however, both canister filters were moved from previous aquariums the fish lived in (which led me to incorrectly believe my cycle would be fine in the upgraded aquarium).
<Should have been... if the canisters didn't "go anaerobic", and water conditions were similar>
Since detecting the ammonia I'm now doing 45% water changes every two days (before that I was doing water changes biweekly).
My Pearlscale has what I assume are ammonia burns (red areas, which later started to turn black); however, in the last two days she has lost two scales and the red areas are spreading. (Pics included show both sides of her) I am the most concerned about her scales beginning to pinecone out (she's had it for a little longer than a week), obviously my main concern at this point is dropsy. She isn't floating or having any trouble swimming, her gills are red, and I haven't detected any 'air bubbles' underneath her scales.
She's eating fine, but I'm not sure that she's pooping as much as she should (she normally has long, dark poops, but hasn't recently).
<What are you feeding? Some greens I hope/trust, and not much protein>
Her behavior is okay, she's resting near the bottom/in plants more, but I'm not sure if it's because she's sick or because one of the other fish (a larger Oranda) seems to get agitated when the tank light is on and nips at her; which causes her to stay hidden more often (This Oranda and Pearlscale got along fine previously to them moving to the new tank)
I was going to leave her in the main tank and continue to do water changes; but would it be better to set up a ten gallon quarantine tank for her?
<Not move>
If so, would you recommend that I begin treating her with antibiotics? Or should I do salt baths?
<Neither>
<I would leave all fish where they are and cut back your water changes to no more than 25% at a time; AND pre-treat and store change water if you can... ahead of use>
Thank you so much for your assistance,
Melissa
<Time alone should see these fish improving here. Bob Fenner>

What fish can I add.?    Nonsense mixes in too small world      9/3/17
Hey Team,
<Hello!>
I have a 10-15 gallon tank. I had to give away:
1 ID Shark
2 Blood Parrot
1 Tinfoil Barb
as they were growing large.
<Indeed they would.>
I currently have
1 Tinfoil barb
<A social species; looks and behaves better in groups. But in a 10-15 gallon tank? That makes no sense at all. Tinfoil Barbs can get to 30 cm/12 inches, and even under aquarium conditions you can easily expect them to reach over 20 cm/8 inches within a couple of years.>
2 Firemouth
<A much better aquarium fish, but again, needs a bigger tank. Adults should get to at least 12 cm/5 inches in length, and potentially a little more. A singleton on its own might just be viable in a 130 litre/30 gallon tank, but realistically two specimens plus companion fish will need at least twice that.>
1 small white aquarium catfish.
<Covers a lot of possibilities here! The commonest catfish are Corydoras species, with adult sizes around the 5-8 cm/2-3 inch mark, hence groups of 5-6 specimens may be kept in tanks from 70 litres/15 gallons upwards. But
the other common catfish are Pterygoplichthys species, which get to 45 cm/18 inches, hence require tanks upwards of 350 litres/75 gallons.>
2 Silver\Bala Shark small
<Again, much the same as Tinfoil Barbs, and in no ways suitable for a tank this size.>
I would like you suggestion on what else can be a good add-on to the existing set.
<Nothing! This collection of fish makes no sense at all. I've written extensively on the sorts of fish you might keep in small tanks; here for example:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ca/volume_5/volume_5_3/stocking.htm
The fish you currently have will surely need a tank 10 times the size of the one you have. I would either get a bigger tank, or more sensibly perhaps, return them as start over.>
My plan was to add either 1 Tinfoil or another pair of Bala shark
<!?>
Please suggest.
Thanks and regards,
Shriram
<Hope this helps, Neale.>

Maybe Not Really Algae; Misgurnis dis.      9/3/17
Hello WWM Crew!
<Hello Renee,>
This is Renee, in Idaho with the human remains in the water!
<Eh?>
Haven’t written to you for a while, and I hope you are all well, but everything here is going great! The BGK is healthy, happy, and almost 6 inches long now! The Elephant Nose has filled out nicely, is eating well, and has turned out to be a gregarious little charmer!
<All sounds like good news.>
I even “inherited” a Baby Whale (completely separate tanks from both the Elephant Nose and the BGK {who are also in separate tanks from each other}) who is turning out to be a really fun little fish! We had a little “bump in the road” in the loach tank earlier this week (see attached picture), but I took this same picture down to my aquarium store, they sold me some Kanaplex which took care of the problem completely in 24 hours (I still have one more treatment to give, but the fish were clear 24 hours after the first dose). But something unforeseen happened after the first treatment and it is that event I wanted to ask you about.
This all took place in my 125 gallon which houses 7 Weather Loaches and 6 SAE’s (the SAE’s did not get whatever this white stuff was – just the loaches).
<It looks like Slime Disease, also known as Costia.>
Its been up and cycled for 2 years now. That is significant because this tank was in operation before I found out about the .5 – 1 ppm of ammonia and the human remains in my tap water. I changed the substrate when I switched to the RO water, but the tank, ornaments, filter, and powerheads, were all exposed to the creepy, nasty, water from my well. When I changed over to the RO/DI water, I did it incrementally so as not to destroy the biological filter in the tank. Regardless, for the last year, I have been battling a nasty algae that sprung up and covered the ornaments and the back wall (and only the back wall) of the tank. Originally, it was the long black hairy looking algae, hence the SAE’s who took care of that promptly. But a blackish green algae remained (you can kind of see it in the background of the picture of the sick fish), again, only on the ornaments and back wall. But the SAE’s wouldn’t touch it. I tried putting one of my Bristlenose in for a while, but I never saw it go near that back wall.
<Black slime on an aquarium is almost certainly algae. If it has a distinctive musty smell, chances are that it's Cyanobacteria. If you have a hand lens or microscope, you can look at it, and often see it has a fine, matted, thread-like texture even though it looks glossy and sheet-like. Red algae, which can be black, turns red when left in clear alcohol (hence the same, and yes, vodka should work) has a coarser tufty texture in most cases and other than a watery smell, doesn't normally smell of anything.>
So I’ve been scrubbing that stuff weekly ever since without much success. I mean, this stuff is tough – I scrub with a fairly aggressive plastic pad as well as an algae scraper from my aquarium store and I have to scrub very hard for what seems like forever to even put a dent in this stuff. Well, the Kanaplex that I used to treat the loaches is killing this stuff (I don’t call it algae, even though that’s what it looked like, because I no longer believe that’s what it was).
<Antibiotics can, do kill Cyanobacteria.>
After the first dose, ¾’s of it was gone. After the second treatment, all that’s left is a few patches here and there. And it’s NOT floating loose and creating a green cloud in the water like it does when I try to scrub it, it’s just gone (YEAY!)! I’ve been researching and the stuff that comes closest to what I had was the Cyanobacteria – but still not quite the same. The pictures I saw of the Cyano showed the stuff covering ONLY the floor and ornaments in the tank, not the glass walls at all.
<There are of course various kinds. In my experience Cyanobacteria tends to be promoted by a number of things: slow water movement, direct sunlight, high temperature spikes during the day, and infrequent water changes that allow nitrate to stay consistently high.>
The stuff I had covered the back wall harder than cement, but only the back wall and the ornaments. Maybe that means nothing, I don’t know.
<Oh, it often is significant. Sand and gravel may be at places where water flow is slower, and ornaments will certainly reduce water flow.>
So I guess what I’m asking is can you identify this stuff, could it be responsible for the sick fish, and will it come back?
<I think the loach has Costiasis, which is unrelated, and while somewhat difficult to treat, there are medications available that do deal with it effectively.>
I take care of both of my elderly parents and my father had a health crisis three days before I noticed the sick fish (he’s ok now), so they could have been suffering with this during that time.
<Possibly, but might simply be bad luck.>
The day I realized what was going on also happened to be the day of their scheduled water change and their monthly filter cleaning. Ammonia and nitrite were zero, but the nitrate test was a fairly dark orange, but no red, which I interpreted as 20 – 30 ppm (which is a little higher than normal). The tank has an E-heim 2217 canister filter and a powerhead (on the opposite side of the filter spray bar to keep the water moving on that end).
<Hope this helps. Cheers, Neale.>

Pest control      3/2/17
Dear WWM crew,
<Sarah>
I've been looking into various IGRs (Nylar in this case), but can't find any information about how effective they are outside of the treatment area.
<Mmm; am concerned enough to write that I would do my best to keep over-spray out of the systems; lay damp towels over the tanks, turn off air pumps, air-entraining gear...). Don't see much re Nylar itself, but other IGRs are recorded as being detrimental to aquatic invertebrates>
I don't want to risk killing or sterilizing any of my aquatic inverts, and don't plan to treat the room the tanks are in, but I have no clue how far away is "safe".
Best regards,
Sarah
<I'd be calling the manufacturer of record. Look for their MSDS sheet/s on the Net; perhaps call your local to not "poison center". Bob Fenner>

2 male koi found dead in pond in the AM the rest (6) are healthy    9/1/17
Can’t figure out the cause for 2 of my male Koi dying. One I have had for 25 years and weighed close to 6# and 2 ft long.. The other was a 4 year old about 10 inches long. All the fish were fine the night before. ( I did a 1/6 water exchange for my 2800 gal pond) I found them dead in the AM. All the rest (6 koi and 5 goldfish) are totally normal with no signs of stress. What could have happened?
Thanks for your time
Elaine Brown
<Can only speculate, but have seen occasional anomalous deaths (male and female) from no apparent cause. Have you inspected the bodies thoroughly? No predators at play here? Could be simple coincidence that you lost two (and males); differing sizes imply varying tolerances to such phenomena as dissolved oxygen... and sexual behavior? Doesn't really occur in the dark with these minnow fishes. Did the water change somehow induce some overwhelming stress here? Bob Fenner>
Re: 2 male koi found dead in pond in the AM the rest (6) are healthy    9/1/17

After eliminating several causes, I believe it was caused by them eating the roots of a Calla Lily plant that has been in the pond for years, but the roots were exposed when a large rock surrounding them fell in the pond a few days before, and when I added the water they were assessable to them. Thinking they were poisoned...
<Interesting. But not the other koi and goldfish? BobF>

Lifting my content; aka stealing     8/31/17
It's come to my attention that you've posted my work on your company website. This writing, image work is not for free for commercial purposes.
Please remove it at once.
Bob Fenner
http://saltwateraquaticsofindiana.com/information-videos/basic-information/aquacultured-corals-marine-fishes/
Re: Lifting my content; aka stealing     8/31/17

I will have my web designer look into it. What is your page address so I can look at it and verify before contacting my web designer.
<... page address? Our URL is WetWebMedia.com. Bob Fenner>
Chris David & Tammy Pelsinski
Twisted Tailfins Aquatics, Inc
574-208-8640
twistedtailfins@gmail.com
Www.saltwateraquaticsofindiana.com
Re: Lifting my content; aka stealing     8/31/17

I will look at it but I need a web page address to compare it to my page.
<?! Do you doubt that this is my work?>
If it is lifted I'll get with my web designer and get it removed.
<Thank you, Robert Fenner>
Chris David & Tammy Pelsinski
Twisted Tailfins Aquatics, Inc
574-208-8640
twistedtailfins@gmail.com
Www.saltwateraquaticsofindiana.com

Banded coral shark egg     8/31/17
Hi there my question is.....i have a shark egg was seeing lots of movement and now it has stopped for a couple weeks now. as of today every time i check on him its floating around the tank. does this mean he died?
<Possibly>
when i
held him up to light air bubbles came up when i tilted him.i can see he is about a inch and a half long .but don't see any movement. feeling bummed!!!
Please give me ur input. Ty colleen
<... I would shy on the side of conservation here... Wait a week more. Bob Fenner>

Hilton Anaheim Reservation Confirmation      8/30/17
Hi Bob,
See below for your room reservation confirmation. See you soon!
Thank you,
Brock
<Thank you yet again Brock. B>

Bloated juvenile Foxface      8/30/17
Hi
I have a young Foxface approximately 1.5-2 inches that has been eating well for the last month and appeared to be the picture of health. Was treated with PraziPro and Paraguard over the last month for internal and external
parasites. This bloating happened very suddenly about 3-4 days ago. His color and balance are good but he isn't eating and hides most of the time.
There doesn't seem to be much info on bloat in saltwater fish so I have treated him with a combo of Metronidazole and Kanamycin in case of a bacterial cause. Any insight or direction on what to do with the little guy
would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Andrea
<Such extreme and fast swelling could be due to bacterial involvement or cellular circumstances... from?...
I'd suggest isolation (in another system), and administration of Epsom Salt... and patience. Bob Fenner>

Re: Bloated juvenile Foxface      8/30/17
He has never left the 30 gallon quarantine tank. I tend to qt for at least a month having learned the hard way. Do you have an article on the Epsom Salt administration. Is it a bath?
<Can be administered either... the search tool, on WWM, every page:
Some here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/fwsubwebindex/SaltUseFWArtNeale.htm
Please write back if a/your path isn't clear, and with your further observations. Bob Fenner>

Important RAP California info needed      8/29/17
Mr. Fenner,
<Hey Brock>
My name is Brock Goines and I am gathering information for the upcoming event.
<Is this the Oct., 7, 8 one in Cali? What day for speaking (Sat., and/or Sun.?). Are you folks supplying an overnight hotel? >
We need a high resolution picture of you and the topic for your presentation.
<Mmm; the best is likely "Anemones for Aquariums: Use, Husbandry">
The picture I saved from the web is low resolution. Please contact me as soon as you can because it is time sensitive to get banners etc printed for the event site.
<Couldn't find the one you have posted in a larger size, but sent along another (attached here). Will this work? BobF>
Thank you,
Brock Goines
www.reefapalozashow.org
www.scmas.org
Re: Important RAP California info needed      8/29/17

Hi Bob,
<Brock>
yes we will book you a room as part of your Speaker deal. What name do you want me to book it under?
<Mine please. B>
Re: Important RAP California info needed      8/29/17

Bob,
i have you scheduled for Saturday at 2:30. I sent the photo to my graphics designer. Hope it works.. fingers crossed.:)
<Real good Brock. B>
Re: Important RAP California info needed      8/29/17

Bob,
Do you want a room for Saturday and Sunday? Or just Saturday night?
The picture works fine!
<Just Sat. Brock. Thank you, B>

Re: African Claw Frog      8/29/17
SO, I'm back and HE LIVES!!!!!!!!! He was skinnier, naturally I suppose, but he is good!!!!
<Excellent news!>
Thank you so much for all your help!!!
<Most welcome. Cheers, Neale.>

Goldfish and Water Tanks      8/28/17
I have an 88 gal water tank for my horse. Last spring I got 5 small goldfish and put them in it to control larvae. They've grown to about 2 to 2.5 inches and I'm wondering if the water is still safe for my horse to drink?
Thank you, Mary Barger
<Yes; assuredly. If the water is fine for the goldfish, it will be potable for your equines. Bob Fenner>
Re: Goldfish and Water Tanks      8/28/17

Thank you. Makes me feel much better. ��
<Am very glad to set your mind to ease. The goldfish impart very little "waste" to the water,
and naught that is harmful to horses. Additionally they are useful for vector control (mozzies). Bob Fenner>

Fish lice and American freshwater eel (RMF, anything to add?)      8/28/17
Hello, I have an American freshwater eel that I bought at a Maryland bait shop about 5 years ago.
<Interesting fish, T! Kept a European Eel years ago, and it was quite a beast!>
Although shy, he has been doing well.
<Anguilla species are generally extremely robust but fundamentally nocturnal, which accords well with what you've seen. The biggest obstacle to success is escape, because they do have a very strong migratory instinct.>
Just the other day I brought home a dozen comets to feed him, and only noticed a day later that one of the feeders had fish lice.
<***Sound of Neale bashing his head against the wall***>
(lots of Google searching there) I got out 3, 1 swimming and 2 on the feeder, but found a line of what looked like eggs that I was unsuccessful at removing.
<Oh dear.>
( they swirled away. oops.) I am worried what I can use to treat the tank with that would be safe for my eel.
<Prevention better than cure, here. To recap for the benefit of our readers, there is NO reason at all to use "feeder fish" when feeding virtually any aquarium fish. As our correspondent here has learned, it's a good way to introduce disease. Furthermore, goldfish are rich in Thiaminase and fat, two things that cause health issues in pet fish. Anguilla species hunt by smell, and from personal experience I can tell you they'll eat anything, even strips of fish fillet and squid. No need for live food, except perhaps earthworms and river shrimp while acclimating new specimens to life in captivity.>
Or if goldfish lice can even spread to an eel?
<Probably. Fish lice (Argulus spp.) are certainly known from Anguilla spp., so the balance of probability is that this is a real danger.>
I think copper is supposed to be bad?
<Copper is toxic to virtually all life; it's really a question of how much.
The "art" is dosing enough to kill the pathogen without killing the patient. In this case, copper isn't really your best option. There are really two good solutions here. On fish farms, you'd simply move the fish into strongly brackish or marine conditions. That'd kill the external parasites without much trouble. Anguilla spp are euryhaline, but once
acclimated to brackish or marine conditions, chances are it'd go into its reproduction mode, changing from its current yellow eel phase into the breeding silver eel phase. Keeping such eels in aquaria is very difficult because they will desperately try to escape, even if it means they need to hit you over the head and steal the car keys to do so. Your second option is a suitable insecticide (typically organophosphates) though Fish Lice are, of course, crustaceans. Using these organophosphates is potentially risky because they are highly toxic, so you need to follow the instructions provided by the manufacturer or vet very carefully. As far as I know, copper is not toxic to Argulus at levels safe for your fish, which is why treating Argulus on ornamental fish is such a headache. It's primarily pond people who have to deal with it; for some reason it doesn't often become established in aquaria. Of course if you introduce pond fish (like "feeders") to an aquarium, then all bets are off, and Fish Lice can become
a serious headache. They are difficult to deal with, severely harm the host, and the wounds they create quickly become infected with Aeromonas and Pseudomonas infections.>
And a salt soak would not clear out the rest of the tank.
<Not sure what you mean here. Run the tank as moderately brackish to marine, and yes, Argulus will die. Standard operating practice on salmon farms.>
Research has not given me much as most people have marine eels or spiny eels.
<Oh, wow, there's tonnes of research into Argulus if you check out the academic literature. It is potentially a massive threat to commercial fish farms. Koi keepers also deal with it on a regular basis IF they don't quarantine new livestock, and organophosphate medications are available for treating pond fish -- you'll need to use one of those, unless you have a local vet able to help you. Regardless, organophosphates should work well, but Anguilla are unusual, and organophosphates are acutely toxic, so do carefully observe your eel for signs of distress. I'd have some good quality carbon handy in case something goes wrong -- at the first sign of distress, do a massive (~90%) water change, followed by filtering through carbon (or some similar marine-grade chemical adsorbent) together with increased water current and aeration.>
Can you give me any advice?
<Don't use feeders, EVER.>

Thank you, T
<Most welcome. Cheers, Neale. PS. BobF's our pond guru, so I'm going to ask him to chip in if I've missed anything.><Nada mas Neale. Excellent resp. by you as always. B>

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