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FAQs about Marine Scavenger Species, Specimen Selection
Related FAQs: Clean Up "Crews", Worms
As Scavengers, Snail Scavengers,
Shrimp Scavengers, Hermit Scavengers,
Crab Scavengers, Cucumber Scavengers,
Sea Urchin Scavengers, Serpent
Star Scavengers, Seastar Scavengers,
Fish/Groups as Scavengers, Marine
Scavengers 1, Marine Scavengers 2,
Marine Scavengers 3, Sand Sifters,
Sea Cucumbers, Shrimp Gobies,
Sifter Gobies, Marine Algae
Eaters, Hermit
Crabs, & FAQs on Scavenger:
Rationale, Compatibility,
Losses/Troubleshooting, Related
Articles: Marine Scavengers, Genus
Valenciennea Gobies, Hermit
Crabs, |
www.ipsf.com
www.inlandaquatics.com |
Re: Skeletor Eel; comp.
– 11/08/09
Dear Marco,
<Hello Bill.>
Planning to add the Golden Moray next week sometime but in the meanwhile
I have another question for you. Since this tank will only hold 2 Eels,
should I add some kind of cleaning crew to the tank to keep the algae in
check?
<You can. To oppose algae you'll also need a good water quality.>
If so, what would you suggest?
<Hermit crabs, snails, maybe an easy brittle star or if good water
quality can be achieved an urchin.>
Won't the Skeletor eel eat most of the crab and shrimp?
<No. It might try to eat hermits first, but if you select well armored
specimens, it will fail and leave them alone. Cleaner shrimps are more
of a gamble. Some morays accept them as cleaners, some eat them right
away. Snails with tough shells are mostly not eaten, the same is
generally true for brittle stars and urchins.>
I was told that the Golden Moray is a fish eater.
<In nature they mostly eat invertebrates (crabs, shrimps), but also
small and slow fish.>
Thanks again, Bill
<Welcome and good luck. Marco.>
Grocery Store Cleaner Clams?
.10/26/2009
<Hi Zachary.>
I've recently read online that the small 'cherry stone' clams that you
can purchase on ice at the grocery store are the exact same as the
'cleaner clams' available.
<Yes. Cherrystone, Littleneck, Quahog, and the like only refer to the
size of the clam when purchased for food. They are all Mercenaria
mercenaria>
I've come across much discussion and opinions on the internet but no
conclusive answer. Some credible info would be much appreciated! Thank
you!
<Unfortunately, there is little out there and nothing definitive, they
aren't collected much for the aquarium trade because they aren't good
looking, and usually burrow in the sand.
They are filter feeders, so they need fine particulate foods, something
that historically, is difficult to achieve in an aquarium. Further,
there is a significant risk of one dying in your tank and causing an
ammonia spike that could take the rest of your tank with it.
If you are set on trying one, I would get the smallest ones you could
find, slowly acclimate it to temperature, and make sure it 'spits'
before putting it in your display tank. I would then monitor your water
parameters very closely Anecdotally, they are supposed to come to the
surface before they die, but I would not bet the inhabitants of my tank
on it.>
I did find some threads about it on another BBS. Do have a read here:
http://www.saltwaterfish.com/vb/showthread.php?t=152707
http://www.saltwaterfish.com/vb/showthread.php?t=280118
http://www.saltwaterfish.com/vb/showthread.php?t=264945 >
Zachary
<MikeV>
Snails And Inverts/Janitors 10/16/09
Hello guys.
<Hello Mando>
I wanted to ask, what's the recommended amount of Astrea snails and
hermit crabs for a 90 g reef tank?
<No recommended amount, depends largely on stocking level, feeding
habits, etc. If it were mine, I'd likely start with about 10 Blue Legged
Hermits and somewhere around 7 or 8 snails, but I prefer a mix of snail
species such as Astreas, Ceriths, etc. The Nerite Snail is known to
consume diatoms among other foods, may want to try a few for your diatom
problem mentioned below along with reading here.
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/brownalgcontfaqs.htm.>
Currently I only have 3 red hermits and 3 large snails. I currently have
a lot of brown diatom algae on my glass, sand and o. <?>
My equipment. Do u <you> recommend I get a Lawnmower Blenny?
<They are not going to anything about the diatom problem.>
.And are they sensitive? Cause I've lost 2 in the last 2yrs.
<They are a hardy fish that do best in tanks that have algae on which
they can forage throughout the day. They will usually take frozen or
dried vegetable foods like Formula 2, and sometimes will take meaty
foods like bloodworms. It likely starved to death or was harassed by a
tankmate(s) to the point of preventing it
from eating, but the later unlikely, as these fish are territorial by
nature and will usually drive out other animals from their area
including their own kind.
James (Salty Dog)>
Black Marine Sand--Need a Clean Up Crew – 09/19/09
Hi,
<<Hello>>
I have a dilemma. I currently have 2 saltwater nano tanks that have
black marine sand beds. The black marine sand was purchased dry and
cycled using the ammonia method. Both tanks have been cycled and in use
for about 2 months.
<<Okay>>
The problem I am encountering is finding a clean up crew that can clean
the black sand.
<<Ah…>>
I have tried the Nassarius snail. It does not seem to burrow in the
sand.
<<Maybe it “hurts” to do so>>
The Nerite snail seems to be afraid of the sand.
<<Mmm, no…just prefers the air/water interface of your system (I did see
this snail at a black-sand beach on the Big Island of Hawai’i…but was in
the rocks…and mostly “above” the water line)>>
The keyhole limpet is not cooperating either.
<<Possibly for the same reason as the Nassarius>>
I currently have 2 blue legged hermit crabs in one of the nano tanks.
The other tank has 2 tiny zebra hermit crabs. Any suggestions on a
saltwater invert that might be able to handle this job?? I was beginning
to lean toward the sexy shrimp the opae-ula shrimp or the bumblebee
snail.
<<Depending on the stocking of these tanks the former is likely to just
become “food,” and the latter is likely to spend more time on your rock
than in the sand I think. I see two possible issues here. The simplest
is that your systems are too “new” and there just isn’t enough detritus
available in the substrate (unlikely). The other is the sand you have,
unlike a true Aragonite product, is probably to “sharp” for the
Nassarius snails to comfortably move on or through it. This may change
as the system matures more and bacteria encapsulates the sand grains…but
is only speculation. For now, your best bets are likely the hermit crabs
and/or maybe a small Brittle Star>>
Thank you in advance,
Lisa Lena
<<Quite welcome… Eric Russell>>
Clean up Crew 80G Tank
05/20/09
Hi
<Hello>
I have a 300litre aquarium (around 80G US) which I am just cycling. In
it I have 35 kg live rock, protein skimmer, and U.V..I am now looking to
stock it with my clean up crew, reef janitors. After asking around my
local fish stores I have a number of different recommendations from 30
turbo snails , 20 crabs and a brittle star fish to 6 turbo snails and 6
crabs and one even suggested a sea hare and mithrax crab. I am
now lost as what to use for cleaning my aquarium what do you guys
recommend?
<Craig, if possible try to stock slowly and as needed when it comes to
clean up "crews". These suggestions are not too crazy, but are still
likely a large amount of small "critters" for a newly cycled tank. Turbo
snails are great, but 30 is likely to many, and perhaps 6 is too few, it
really depends on your particular tank and the need you have for them.
As far as crabs go they are a personal preference, keep in mind that
most any crab is an opportunistic feeder and may decide to eat something
you did not intend to be it's food. Please do some reading here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/clnupcrwsel.htm, and follow the links along
to learn about each of the animals you are considering adding to your
aquarium.>
Hope you can help
Craig
<Hope I did
Josh Solomon>
Clean up crew with dogface puffer
I have the following stock list for a 300 gallon FOWLR set up:
1 1-2" Niger trigger
2 5" Yellow Tangs
1 3-4" Blonde Naso Tang
1 2" Hippo Tang
1 3-4" Emperor Angel
1 2-3" Flame Angel
1 6" Maroon Clownfish
1 7-8" Spanish Hogfish
1 6-7" Dogface Puffer
6 Blue/Green Chromis
1 4-5" African Golden Midas Blenny
1 6" Two Barred Rabbitfish
My question is what kind of cleanup crew can I have? I had serpent
sea stars which the puffer ate when he got bigger. I have a few
Nassarius snails but that is it. If I can't have a cleanup crew,
what type of
maintenance schedule should I provide to avoid problems in the
future? I currently do a 50 gallon water change every other week.
This tank has no skimmer but I will remedy that when I have the
available funds. I just have 250-300 pounds of live rock and a sump
with bio balls for filtration.
Currently my nitrates are at .20-.30.
Thanks in advance.
<Hello Robert. There's nothing you could add to a tank filled with
invertebrate-eaters such as this one! Beyond what small crustaceans,
worms and molluscs are multiplying in the rock and sand, nothing
else would last long. Do remember what the point of a "clean-up
crew" is -- to remove organic matter from crevices in tanks with
corals and anemones where it is impractical for the aquarist to do
so. In all other types of tank the clean-up crew is the fishkeeper!
So get some tongs and clean things up yourself. In the meantime, put
the cash you wanted to spend in the bank, and save up for that
protein skimmer: a FAR more important (many would say essential)
addition to community system with such large and heavy feeders
as your fish collection. Cheers, Neale.>
FOWLR Cleaning Crew 4/11/09
Hi again
<Hello!>
Another couple of questions for you incredibly knowledgeable people.
< Jeez , two lines in and I'm already down in the count.>
My first saltwater tank (a 29 gallon) is in the cycling process, and I
was wondering when I should add a cleaning crew?
< I like to wait until the cycle is over , but anytime after algae
becomes present should be fine.>
I'm assuming after I get a few fish, so there's some waste to clean, but
how long should I wait?
<If you are going through a full cycle you should start seeing algae
soon. Should be good anytime after this point.>
Also, there seems to be a lot of different opinions out there as to
which species make the best cleaners. I had in mind 2 or 3 blue leg
hermits, either a peppermint shrimp or a cleaner shrimp, 1 or 2 brittle
stars, and a handful of snails, probably turbo. Does this sound like a
good selection?
<The hermit count sound good. Always be mindful when adding any kind of
crab. They have been known to cross the line between scavenger and
predator. The brittle star I would leave at the store. They have also
been known to go after napping fish. Turbos are good additions but I
think the best clean up crew is a mixed one.
Instead of all Turbos maybe add a few Nassarius or Cerith. I don't
really consider the decorative shrimp to be part of the CUC , but either
one will make interesting additions. If you are looking into the
Peppermint shrimp for their aiptasia removing be sure to purchase a true
Peppermint. The Camelback shrimp is often sold as a Peppermint shrimp.>
Fish species would be 1 or two clown fish, 1 royal gramma, 1 green goby,
and possibly a trio of mollies from my brackish tank. And live rock of
course. If my research is accurate, none of these fish will harm the
cleaning crew, right?
<All sounds good except for the Mollies, of which I have no personal
knowledge. I will forward your email along to one of the other crew
members to get their opinions on them. >
<<Mollies can be kept in marine environments. You will want to acclimate
the fish slowly to the salinity...a drip acclimation can work, but I
would raise the salinity slowly over a period of days.
Scott V.>>
And I have one question that may be laughable to anyone who's not a
newbie like myself. I understand the difference between a reef tank and
a non-reef tank. But if I'm setting up a FOWLR tank, and then buy some
invertebrates for cleaning purposes, not to mention the cute little
feather dusters I've spotted on my new live rock, wouldn't my tank then
cease to be a "fish only with live rock" tank, emphasis on the "fish
only" part? Is there are term for a tank that has fish and non-coral
and/or anemone invertebrates? Thanks.
<The FOWLR aquarium would also includes a clean up crew. If you add any
sort of invert besides the CUC I would consider it "reef". Inverts of
all shapes ,sizes, and colors inhabit the reef. So I see no reason why
corals must be present to earn that distinction.
Adam Jenkins>
Clean-up crew, 12/10/08
Hello,
<Hi>
So I was
wondering about he cleanup crew for my 29 gallon saltwater reef tank. Is
12 dwarf blue leg hermits, 12 dwarf red tip hermits, 10 Astraea snails,
1 emerald crab, and 2 peppermint shrimp too much for my tank?
<Yes in
my opinion.>
I already have a little purple Firefish in there and I
was planning on getting a ocellaris clownfish too. If that is too big of
a cleanup crew what would you suggest?
<A couple hermits, maybe 3
snails, drop the emerald, and the peppermints.
Much more than that
and they will likely starve.>
Thanks,
Scott
<Welcome>
<Chris> Re: Clean-up crew, 12/10/08
Thanks
for the quick response,
<Welcome>
Many websites say a lot more
than that.
<Yep, easier to sell that way.>
Liveaquaria has a reef
cleaner package that has way more inverts in it.
<Yep, but way way
too much for the sized tank they recommend.>
Do you think I could get
by with 10 hermits and 8 snails?
<I think ultimately they will
starve, or the hermits will pick off the snails as they run out of
easier food.>
That is what I have used in my other similar sized
tanks. I do have sort of an algae problem. I trust your judgment but I
think I need more than what you suggested.
<I think you would be
better off determining the source of the algae problems than try to
combat it with the clean-up crew. If it helps in my 46G I have a 2
Astrea, 1 Cerith, 2 Nassarius, and 2 Red legged hermits.
They are
all about 7 or 8 years old now. >
Thanks again,
Scott
<Welcome>
<Chris> When to add a cleaning crew? 11/13/08
Great site by the way. I am setting up a 90 gal reef tank. The tank has
been up and I have live rock about 150lbs live sand about 100lbs and
RODI water.
The tank has been up for a few weeks with no lights and a
lot of water movement from the closed loop plumbing from a mag 9.5 and 3
power heads. I do have a high end protein skimmer and large sump with
more live rock. I was looking to add a cleaning crew of 50 snails and
the water is reading as of yesterday 76 degrees PH 8.4 Nitrites 1.0
Phosphates 1.0 Ammonia .5 Would it be safe to put snails in the reef now
or do I need to get the nitrites and phosphates down first. Also what
would be a good starting cleaning crew? I was thinking of added 50
snails for the sand and 50 for the glass, a couple of serpent star fish,
and maybe a sand sifting star fish, and a coral banded shrimp. I heard
hermit crabs will knock over frags? Thanks for the advice.
<I would
wait until all the ammonia is out of your tank. Inverts are quite
sensitive to ammonia. For a 90 gallon, I'd stick with just 50 snails
over all at first. There isn't really need for more unless you have an
algae problem. My favorite snails are Nassarius, Astrea, and margarita.
I would forgo the sand sifting star, you most likely won't need it, and
the information on hermits is correct. I'll never put another one in my
tanks.>
Brian
Ludlow KY
<Regards, Jessy> Re:
When to add a cleaning crew? ... much more... reading
11/14/08
Can you tell me what crabs and shrimp would be
beneficial for a fee or is there a recommendation on must haves in a
reef tank, and can you put a couple different stars in there? Also would
you recommend anemones in a reef tank? I hear they can sting the coral.
Is there a must have fish in a reef tank. I have heard tangs are good,
blennies, and fish that school together. That should get me started
until I start looking at frags and coral. Thanks for the expert help.
Brian
<I suggest more reading on your part. All those questions are
subjective and in reading more you should be able to devise your own
answers. DO NOT put any animal in that tank until you have researched
much more and got
your water quality under control.>
<Regards,
Jessy>
Cleaner Crew? – 03/25/08
I, first off, want to say thank you and
what a great site before I begin.
<<Welcome…thank you for the kind
words>>
I currently have a 300-gallon aquarium with these
inhabitants:
Small French angel
Two Percula Clowns
Two Black
Saddlebacks
Medium Maculosus Angel
Medium Six Bar Angel
Medium
Imperator Angel
Large Purple Tang
Small Red Scooter Blenny
Medium Koran Angel
Small Atlantic Blue Tang
Small Blonde Naso
Three Sand Sifting Stars
Two Yellow Striped Maroon Clowns
Small
Power Blue Tang
Small Sailfin Tang
<<That’s a lot of potentially
large and aggressive fishes…even for this size tank>>
I was wondering
what types of cleanup crew would work best in this aquarium for cleaning
up waste product and left over food, if any?
<<Many choices…and
should prove quite beneficial/necessary here>>
Shrimp, crabs, snails,
etc. .
<<Yep…along with some Serpent/Brittle Starfish
What species
of each if any would you recommend?
<<Cerith and Nassarius snails to
start…Blue-Leg Hermits…Peppermint Shrimp…and the fore mentioned
Starfish>>
And finally what would you recommend for trying to setup a
cleaning station for the inhabitants? Cleaner Shrimp, Cleaner Wrasse,
etc. ..
<<Avoid the Cleaner Wrasses…too delicate/hard to keep alive.
A few Cleaner “Gobies” (Gobiosoma sp.) and some Cleaner Shrimp (Lysmata
sp.) will do fine. And one thing to keep in mind…when adding any of
these critters, don’t just drop them in the tank like food…if ya know
what I mean [grin]>>
Thanks Again,
Brad
<<Happy to share.
EricR>>
Planning a Pod-Safe Cleanup Crew – 03/01/08
I'm looking for some
suggestions/options for some cleanup critters, but it's important that
they also leave pods alone.
<<Okay>>
I'm looking to add some
critters to my 30g which is plumbed into my 90g that houses a mandarin,
so being able to provide a source of more pods is important.
<<Indeed…you should seriously consider making this smaller tank a
refugium of some sort…preferably harboring a dense matrix of
Macroalgae>>
I'll have sand, LR, and some corals and a clam in this
30g - no fish.
<<Mmm, I see…this will not be a refugium then…>>
I'll have a variety of snails - they're usually the good, safe choice.
<<Usually?>>
But beyond that I have questions. I'm not sure if shrimp
would be a good idea, and am fairly sure I should pass on getting any
type of crab, but am I overlooking any good choices?
<<I would give
any shrimp or crab species a pass…quite predacious and opportunistic>>
Any good smaller, cucumber choices?
<<Nothing small that would be a
good choice (suspension feeders) for “this” tank. There are a couple
sand-sifting species that can be beneficial in larger systems…but the
30g tank is not big enough to support these>>
Other ideas?
Thanks.
<<Hmm…I think you are pretty much limited to Gastropods here…Nassarius
and Cerith species for detritus scavenging and some sand stirring, maybe
a couple Trochus and/or Astrea species for algae scavenging…or maybe
better yet, instead of the last two choices, a small “tropical” Abalone
(Haliotis sp.). Regards, EricR>>
Inverts & Quarantine, &
cleaner crew sel. 2/29/08
Hi Guys!
If I am to quarantine
snails and crabs (such as the Scarlet Hermit reef crabs) for 4 weeks,
what visual characteristics am I to look for during this time if they
are in shells?
<Mmm, if the system is not "too" large, I'd summarily
place these groups of animals... I.e., not quarantine them>
How will
I know if they are ok to place in the display tank? Furthermore, if
these inverts are carriers of disease or bacteria, isn't it possible
that they could still be carriers long after the quarantine?
<Yes>
Lastly, I have seen recommendations for a clean up crew of 45 units (30
snails, 15 crabs) for a 30 gallon tank. This seems a bit much, wouldn't
you agree? Or what would you recommend?
Thank you for your time and
patience and keep up the good work!
-Bob
<My opinions on the use
of such cleaners is posted:
http://wetwebmedia.com/marine/maintenance/index.htm
the first tray.
Am not a fan of their stated use... Bob Fenner>
Starting a New Marine Tank, Adding Clean-up Crew 9/6/07
Hi Gang!
<Hello>
Enjoy reading all your insightful responses to the various
inquiries you receive. You guys are the best!
<Thanks>
I'm new to
marine aquariums and I'm just swimming along in an ocean of overload
information.
I have searched your site and I know that you have
responded to questions similar to those I am about to ask, but there are
so many scenarios on your pages I'm a bit confused. I thought I would
ask with regard to my own particular case.
I have a FOWLR 30 gallon
tank that is 3-1/2 weeks old. (ph: 8.4, Ammonia: .50, Nitrite: 0,
Nitrate: 5) I have about 2-1/2 inches of the Aragonite reef sand (1-2mm
dia.).
<I would either add sand to get to 3+ inches, or take some out
to get to less than 1 inch, you are sort of in no-man's-land here, where
the sand can trap debris but not deep enough to get any nitrate
reduction benefit from it.>
I also have a 10 gallon refugium (2 inch
sand base) and 32 pounds of live rock. I'm getting close to the point
where I will be introducing animals.
<Get a QT tank going, it will
greatly help you be successful.>
I would like to ultimately have at
least one clown fish, but other than that, I will be looking at a
peaceful community tank. I have no other preconceived plans for any
particular kinds of fish except for nice coloration. There is no
livestock as yet, which brings me to my questions:
1) I need a clean
up crew. I am intrigued by Mr. Fenner's "no snail" concept. I really
don't want a proliferation of snails. Given my empty stage at present,
what could you recommend for a maintenance team? How many?
<Generally
marine snail do not reproduce in captivity like freshwater snails do, so
a explosion of snails is not likely. A few snails of various types,
Turbos, Nassarius, and Ceriths perhaps. You will only need a few at most
of each for this sized tank, don't go for the cleanup packages, they
almost always give you too much and inappropriate animals.>
2) Should
I introduce the clean up crew before, or after my first fish?
<Most
people add them before, but not a big deal either way.>
3) Can I
introduce the clean up crew all at once?
<Yes>
4) As you might
imagine, I am already getting to the point of some maintenance. Can I
introduce the "cleaner uppers" after 4 weeks, or should I wait until at
least 6 weeks?
<Any time after the tank finishes cycling and there is
some algae and other biological material for them to feed on.>
5)
What would be a good first fish to introduce to my tank?
<Depends on
what you are going to add. Make a list of what you want and then add the
most passive fish first.>
A lot of questions, I know. But while I had
your ear, I thought I would take advantage of it.
Thank you so much
for your time and keep up the amazing good work that you do!
-Bob
<Good luck with the new tank.>
<Chris>
Re: The Missing Pieces? Clean-up
crew sel.
6/5/07
Is there an issue with serpent stars in this tank with
eventually a trigger, pygmy angel, hawkfish?
<Possibly with the
first>
I have one thus far and it's left alone. I figured with a few
messy eaters, they'd be good critters to have to clean up?
<Please...
read on WWM re marine scavengers...>
Since crustaceans would be
eaten.
David
<Better for you and your gear to be said "clean-up
crew". Bob Fenner>
Re: Clean-up crew sel. 6/6/07
Thanks for the quick response. I'm
familiar with cleanup crews, but the problem is finding a cleanup crew
that is suitable for a tank with 2 Bannerfish, Harlequin Tusker,
Snowflake Moray, and eventually a Picasso Trigger.
<Yes, I understood
this to be your intended point, query>
Thus far my serpent star has
been left alone, but not to say the Picasso that I don't have yet would
cause issues. What can you recommend for a tankful of invert eaters?
<Again, the gear itself (circulation, filtration) and YOU, your
maintenance>
I have a tuxedo urchin in my reef tank that seems to be
doing well and I noticed in the FAQs you guys liked the idea of a red
slate pencil urchin in with a Picasso?
<Can be used likely>
Looks
like the red slate would be harder to get at then a tuxedo... Meaning
red slate is a bit more spinier?
<Mmm, is not>
Any other
recommendations for cleanup crew with critters that could be a predator?
David
<There are fishes that are smart, fast-enough if there is
room-enough... Perhaps a Goatfish species if you have room... But I
would put my money into Hydor pumps and/or Tunze Streams... Bob Fenner>
Re: Clean-up crew sel. – 06/07/07
Thanks again for your response.
Yes, as I mentioned that 200g tank is almost maintenance free... I have
a Panworld 250PS pump that circulates my volume about 16x/hr in addition
to two Tunze Streams.
<How nice!>
I built a manifold for my pump
with 6output nozzles that spray to each side and criss cross for
complete coverage across the front of my tank. The Tunze's are in each
front corner criss-crossing to the back corners. I do have pretty
awesome water flow coverage. Additionally, I have a Tunze Skimmer which
I am really impressed with... Works as well as my Aqua-C Remora Pro in
my opinion.
<A well-designed/engineered and manufactured unit in my
estimation>
I did notice my nitrates jump from zero to almost 40ppm
(is that the right term?
<Mmm, yes... and too high by about twice>
It was 40 on a Salifert kit). I figure this is because I purposely began
to overfeed while introducing the Tuskfish and 2 Bannerfish as my Yellow
Tang was giving them a rough introduction.
Figured if they all
realize there's plenty of food... They'd calm down a bit. Seems to have
worked, at least the fish all get along well now.
So I am now back to
a more appropriate feeding schedule along with 20% monthly waterchanges
done over about 3changes a month.
David Brynlund
<Ah, good. BobF>
Need Help Choosing A Suitable Detritivore For My Sump Sand Bed –
05/31/07
Hi guys!
<<Paul>>
Love the website and have
spent hours reading it, thanks.
<<Welcome>>
I'll start with a
description of my tanks: I currently have a 70-gal tank, a 30-gal
dedicated refugium and a refugium that acts as a sump. Now on to the
question, I'm looking for a detritivore/garbage eater that would
stir up the sand bed in the sump.
<<Mmm, several come to
mind...what are the “conditions for employment” here?>>
It
doesn't have a lot of water flow going through it, and I would
consider it low flow.
<<Not a problem>>
Being that it's the
lowest flow in all of my setup, I've found that it collects all the
organics that the prefilters on the overflow boxes do not.
<<Indeed...is a “settling chamber” for solids. You say you have an
attached refugium already...this being the case, your system would
be better served if there were no sand in this “settling chamber”
portion of your sump thus allowing you to periodically
(weekly/bi-weekly) siphon the settled material from the system...in
my opinion>>
Being that the pump is only blocked by a plastic
barrier that's approximately 10" high before water falls down to the
pump, I'm looking for something that can't get over the gate. Here's
a rough picture of my sump:
<<Mmm, yes...is this an accurate
representation? I see you have a plenum system...you do realize the
live rock hinders its function...and that large bioturbators are not
desirable as they can mix/destroy the different bacterial zones>>
I was thinking a starfish of either the Brittle Star family or
something in the Fromia family.
<<Both will server as
detritivores, and both can scale that partition you mentioned as
well...in fact...pretty much anything you place in this “sand”
chamber will eventually find its way to the “pump” chamber>>
My
main concern is that they will survive in a low flow environment.
<<As long as there is sufficient oxygen/gas exchange...yes>>
I
have a Sand-Sifting Star, and a Chocolate Chip Star and both
have
been alive and well for over a year and a half.
<<I see...so this
chamber is only for de-nitrification then, as these two stars will
voraciously consume the benthic and sessile biota within>>
The
Sand Star even lost one of his legs (I accidentally crushed him
under a piece of live rock) but over the course of the last 6 months
has completely regrown!
<<Well fed indeed...and testament to the
quality and care of your system>>
That being said I'm sure my
water quality will support another, I'm just trying to
choose the
right species for my purpose.
<<More than good water quality is
needed...you must be able to provide adequate
nutrition/environment/et al>>
I hope you can lead me in the right
direction of a good species for this purpose.
<<I would choose an
Ophiuroid species...is the least likely to “scale the wall” if kept
well fed, in my opinion, and will consume detritus without
disturbing/digging as deeply as the Astropecten>>
My LFS
suggested a Blue Linckia,
<<Ack!...no!>>
which I didn't buy
because I've read about their diet needs.
<<Ahh...Goodonya
mate!>>
So any help here would be much appreciated!
<<Hope I
have provided some. EricR>> | 
|
Re: Kalkwasser & Nano Reef; now nano clean up crew/s 2/24/07
Hi Bob,
<Karl>
Thanks very much for reply and advice on this, it
is very much appreciated! One last question, you do not recommend the
use of snails.
What would you recommend as a cleanup crew for a 15g
system?
<Mmm, you! As posted>
I have family in San Diego (La
Jolla), and when I am next over in the US, would really like to meet you
- maybe have some Mexican and chat?
<Sounds good>
Again,
thanks for all your help!
Best Regards,
Karl McNally
<Bob
Fenner> Cleaner Crew for Marine Sand 2/14/07
Hi gang,
<Hello.>
I have a 105 reef with a great deal of live
rock. . . meaning lots of vertical surfaces, and not much open sand. I
have no algae on the rocks. . .
coralline and my tangs take care of
that. However my sand tends to 'grow' some green algae that cements the
grains together. A purple pseudo which I added years ago and can't get
out makes small snails and hermits a no-go. .
. he attacks anything
small. A LARGE green brittle in the tank doesn't seem to do the job.
<No these are more of scavengers.><<Actually... I think Adam meant/means
that these Brittlestars are more predaceous. RMF>>
Any
recommendations for what I can use in here?
<Larger Nassarius or
fighting conchs (not queen) should be okay and do the "trick".
Additional water flow in the area of the sand bed isn't a bad idea
either...just stay away from sand-sifting starfish.>
. . . Thanks in
advance for any help on this. . .
<Of course.>
Chuck
<Adam
J.> Clean Up Critter For Sump 2/9/07
Hello Crew,
<Hi Chad>
I have a quick question for you; I have a 20 gal sump that
is hooked up to a 46 gal bow front reef tank and a 29 gal refugium. My
overflow sucks in food periodically when I feed my fish. I would like
to put a critter in the sump to eat the left over food. I have another
reef tank, 120gal with a 30 gal sump that I put a few black mollies in
to eat the leftovers and that seems to work out fine, although the
lights are on 24/7 because of the macro algae growing within it. In the
20 gal sump it is dark most of the time except some indirect light
coming from the reef tank above it. I'm thinking of an arrow crab for
the sump instead of a molly because most of the left over food is meaty.
Is this a good idea or do you have another critter that would work out
better?
<I prefer invertebrates over fish for clean up
work. Fish add to the bio load of the system. An Arrow Crab would be
fine for your purpose.>
Thanks,
<You're welcome. James (Salty
Dog)> <<Invertebrates add to the bioloads of systems as well... RMF>>
Chad Re: Clean Up Critter For Sump - II - 2/9/07
James thanks for the reply. This raises another question though. By
saying that the fish (mollies) in my sump add to the total bio load (I
do agree), you mean the use of oxygen and the production of ammonia.
<Yes.>
Do invertebrates (an arrow crab in this case) use less and
produce less therefore add less to the total bio load?
<Yes.>
Thank in advance for the further enlightenment.
<You're
welcome. James (Salty Dog)>
Chad Hermit Holocaust
1/15/07
Hey crew I need some help...
<Why we're here...
though the occasional "happy story" really makes ones day>
I got my
first real clean up crew the other day (Thursday) for my new 55 Gallon
reef tanks. The tank
<Plural, now single>
has been up and
running for about 3 months now.
<Allow me to preface the below by
stating I am personally NOT a fan of such assemblages/crews... too often
mis-mixes, predaceous, even not entirely compatible or totally aquatic!>
Included as a total package were 25 Astrea Snails, 10 Nassarius Snails,
20 Blue-leg hermits, 20 Scarlet Hermit, 1 Coral Banded shrimp,
<More
of an eater upper, than cleaner upper...>
1 "monkey" shrimp (Saron
marmoratus),
<Neat animals... but again, not scavengers in the
least>
2 lettuce Nudibranch,
<Not hardy...>
1 Camel Shrimp,
5 Emerald
crabs.
<See WWM re Mithraculus...>
I drip
acclimated all the inverts before adding them into my tank.
Everything is doing awesome except for the scarlet hermits. Everyday I
find one or two dead out of their shells. I am up to 8 losses in the
past few days. They are not eaten as far as I can tell. They are just
dying left and right. My specs go something like this: NH4/NH4=0, NO2=0,
NO3=0, PH=8.1,
Alk=9 dKH (I had a drop in this recently and am
thinking this is the culprit)
<Might be>
, Ca=420ppm, Cu=0,
<Good to know>
SG=1.023, Temp is steady all day and night at 80.
<Might be your Magnesium is deficient, out of balance...>
I do not
have an iodine test but just started adding supplements of Iodine about
two weeks ago via 1 tsp of Kent's Coral-Vite
<... I'd skip this...>
once a week. All the blue-legs are fine and dandy, just the reds. Fish
in the tank are a very small yellow tang (about 1.5"),
<Wow, this IS
small>
a Flame Angel, 2 Perc Clowns, 2 Blue Green Chromis, and 1
Royal Gramma. There is also a green BTA in the tank. Lighting on the
tank is 4X65W PC lights (2 12K and 2Blue) and 2X36W PC Lights (2 10K). I
am thinking either a) the Saron shrimp is getting to them but for some
reason not eating them.
<Mmm, would find just shell bits if so>
Or b) the Alk is too low and getting to them.
<Mmm...>
The alk
had dropped to 7 dKH due to my wonderful wife not remembering to
stabilize the PH of the RO/DI water before adding it as makeup water for
the past week while I was on vacation. I am bringing it up .75 - 1 dKH
per day till I get back to about 11 or 12.
<Mmm, by itself... this
should be fine>
Can you guys and gals shed some light on the
situation and think of something that I have not?
<The Mg... though
there are a myriad of other possibilities>
The only other thing that
I can think of is the bristle worms that come out at night. I know Bob
is a grad school expert
<Man! A new title to add!>
in these
things so I thought I would toss them out in the mix. I think I have
determined that they are of a variety that do not hurt anything. They
are round (or appear to be in the dark) with what appears to be black
and white stripes. They "Unroll" from the outside in if that makes any
sense. The base comes out before the head, really kind of cool looking.
I know there are so many types of worms but I have compared them to most
anything I can find a picture of that is harmful and have not found
anything like them. There are about 20 of them on one piece of live
rock, and they only come out at night, and the largest one can unroll to
a length of about 3". I just can not place my finger on what is killing
my inverts!
<Too many possibilities... I would just not replace the
types that are going>
Thanks again in advance for all the great work
ya'll do. I hope many people see the donation button at the bottom of
the page and give what they can for y'alls wonderful service. All the
money you guys have saved me and my wife over the past year is worth the
$25 donation we make every year.
<Appreciate this>
Brandon and
Jennifer Gray
<Bob Fenner... who wants to be more clear, complete...
would rely mostly on proper set-up, maintenance (you) to keep house
here... not a mix of invertebrates> Gastropods/Snails/Limpets
and an Over Abundance 12/5/05
I'll save space and your
having to read by not listing our tank setup - if you need to know the
setup to answer this question, let me know and I'll oblige.
<Okay.>
We setup 90 gal tank with 130 pounds Fiji and Marshal island live rock
about 5 months ago. Within a week, we found a large cap snail
hitchhiker...5 months later, there's so many in the tank (also a few in
the refugium) we lose count to get an exact number. I've read if you
know how many snails you have, you don't have enough,
<This sounds
like a retailers slogan…I to have heard such ludicrous rules of thumbs
such as this one and the common “One hermit and snail per gallon rule”
which is to say the least ridiculous.>
but is there such a thing as
TOO MANY CAP SNAILS?
<If you have an overabundance this means that
there is sufficient algae to support them. The algae is fueled by
nutrients. So if you want the herd to be naturally thinned out I would
check your system for detritus build-ups and watch how much you feed.
Water changes are your friend.>
If so, is there a natural predator
for them?
<Yes likely any mollusk and crustacean predators such as
wrasses and puffers. However they will not limit their predation to just
your snails, your microfauna population would be adversely affected as
well as any other small critters in your tank.>
cheers
<To you
too.>
Donna
<Adam J.> BB detritus eater
12/16/05
Hello Ya'll, <Hello Jason> I emailed you guys before
about my 125 gallon stingray tank and its high nitrates. Well I think I
have it under control. I built a DIY wet/dry refugium. The problem I'm
having is with the macro growing the refugium, which is bare bottom I'm
getting a ton of detritus and its very hard to suck out with the macro
on top of it. What can I put in my refugium that's not going to eat the
macro and just eat the detritus?? The refugium is about 20-25 gallons
and am growing Chaeto macro like crazy!! Thanks for any info you may
have. <The Cerith and bumble bee snails will consume detritus along
with serpent stars. I suggest you put a nylon sock (filter bag) over
your return pipe/hose to trap such. It will need to be cleaned
weekly. James (Salty Dog)>
Jason What Snails Do You Like?
- 01/10/06
Gotcha, Thanks so much Eric.
<<You're welcome
Dave>>
How do you feel about Turbo snails, Trochus, or Nassarius?
<<My problem with the first two is, aside from being prone to die-off,
they are like little bulldozers knocking corals around as they
prowl/graze...worse than any urchin for this in my experience. I do
like Nassarius snails...and Ceriths are an absolute fave of mine. I
also have what I believe is a very small conch (1/4"-3/8") that
multiplies like mad and is a great little detritivore.>>
Dave Harvey
<<Regards, EricR>> Re: What Snails Do You Like? - 01/11/06
Yeah, that's how I'm coming to feel about Turbos and Trochus also, not
to mention I'm pretty sure that every time they fall off a rock and
don't land right side up- the tusk is upon them in a moment.
<<Hmm...wouldn't be surprised if the tusk wasn’t “helping” them “fall
off.”>>
I have 2 larger Conchs, boy do they grow fast.
<<Have
heard this...>>
I'll probably only keep one-not sure about that, and
give one to my buddy. They certainly have cleaned up the sand of any
detritus very quickly.
<<Always a handy thing <grin>.>>
Thanks
again,
Dave Harvey
<<Cheers Dave, EricR>>
Micro
stars/Detritus Control 3/16/06
Hey crew, <Hey Eric>
Hope you are having a wonderful day. <Not bad.>
I am having a
little bit of a detritus build up problem in my tank.
Some of the
live rock I have has small pockets in the rock they look like small
craters, but detritus seems to settle in these pockets and I have to
eventually vacuum them. Well after I vacuum most of these out all my
coral and anemone seem to open up a lot more and last for a few weeks (I
guess they could be eating this material but I really don't think so).
<Correct.> I was wondering if adding micro bristle stars would help
keeps these areas clean. <Will help some. The best control is what you
mention...vacuuming and during every water change.> If you have any
suggestions of other organisms that would work better please let me
know.
180 gallon
300 lbs live rock
1600 gallons an hours of
power head water flow.
4-5 inch sand bed.
Thanks, <You're
welcome. James (Salty Dog)>
Eric
Clean Up Crew/Algae
- 05/19/2006
Hi there,
<Ewan>
Many thanks for all the
great information that's helped me so far!
<Welcome>
I have a 50
gallon tank. It has 30kg of live rock and 1.5-2" of live sand and has an
Aqua Medic TurboFlotor Multi SL protein skimmer that's designed to be
good up to tank sizes of 250 gallons. Water parameters re ammonia and
nitrite are 0. I currently have the following:
2 Percula Clowns
(medium size)
2 Banggai Cardinal fish (medium)
2 Firefish (the
orange and white type, medium)
My clean up crew is comprised of the
following:
2 Skunk cleaner shrimp
1 Blood Shrimp
1 Banded
Coral Shrimp
1 Arrow Crab
<These last two are more of
"eat-em-up" class than cleaner up...>
2 Bristle Stars
3 tiny Red
Hermit crabs about 1/2 inch in size
3 Hermit Crabs with striped
black and blue striping. 1 inch big I'm still getting some unsightly
algae on the tank glass. It's brown in color and thin and appears in
patches on the front and sides, but not really on the back of the
tank. I'm planning on using something to reduce phosphate levels as
I've been told this contributes to algae growth but was also interested
to know if there's anything I can add to my clean up crew to help the
problem.
<Mmm, all sorts>
Have seen several types of Cowry,
Murex, Scallops and snails listed on the web as being useful.
<Mmm.
some snails... but not the ones you list, nor the bivalve>
My LFS
stocks Turbo castaneus and a snail called Super Turbo Snail. What would
you advise?
Many thanks!
Ewan
<For you to read, starting
here:
http://wetwebmedia.com/algaeconMar.htm
and the linked files at
top where you lead yourself. Many approaches to consider here... enjoy
the process. Bob Fenner> Critter Stocking 6/27/06
Hi Crew,
<Hi>
Before I start with my question, I would just like
to thank you all for your time and effort, I really appreciate all the
hard work you put into the WWM, and I have gained so much from reading
all your FAQ's, thanks again.
<Thanks for the kind words.>
Now
for my question, I have recently taken up the fish keeping hobby again,
after a 15 year break and decided to go straight in at the deep end, and
go for a Reef Tank! <Welcome back.> So, I've now got myself a nice 70
gallon bow fronted corner tank, all setup and cycled, with some 30kgs of
live rock. <ok>
I am now at the stage of wanting to add some
"critters" and was wondering what qty / mix of critters would be good
for a 70 gallon Reef tank, and whether it’s fairly safe to add them all
in one go, or do it gradually in stages. Further down the line I'm
planning on adding a couple of Clown Fish, and Goby, but that's about it
fish wise.
Looking forward to your response.
Kind Regards
Andrew B.
<By critters I am assuming you mean snails, crabs, etc. I
don't really like any of the "rules of thumb" out there such as 1
snail/10 gallons etc. Each tank varies too much, what might work in one
tank with lots of algae will equal lots of dead stuff in another with
less food. Start slowly, just a few critters at a time. This will
allow you to find the right balance more easily without wasting money
and killing livestock.>
<Good luck with the new tank.>
<Chris> Selecting Safe Detritivores 11/20/06
Hello to the WWM crew. I have found very helpful information from your
site. Could you offer your advice/assistance on adding sand sifting or
detritivore type species? Here is my set-up. I have a 200 gallon reef
set-up:
72" x 32" x 24" (deep)
Circulation is powerful utilizing
a central Dolphin pump Lighting is 3 MH retrofits with 400W 20,000K
Below I list the details. I hope this is sufficient information.
I
have converted this tank from a previous fish only.
The corals are
doing well, with good polyp extension daily on the leathers. I have a
good skimmer, and that seems to be ok.
I have removed a lot of the
coarse crushed coral substrate when I have done water changes. Not quite
to bare bottom, but getting there.
I want to add a live sand
substrate, but I would like to add the right mix of detritivores and
sand sifters. I do not want to risk a big mistake due to the forward
momentum I have. The more I read on your site, the more cautious I am,
particularly with crabs.
<You are wise here>
Since it is a big
tank, how much do I add, and what? Thanks again for your great site and
advice. Take care,
George
Pachyclavularia violacea
Sarcophyton elegans
Sarcophyton sp.
Sinularia dura
Rhodactis
indosinensis
Actinodiscus sp.
Plerogyra sinuosa
Trachyphyllia geoffroy
Platygyra sp.
Alveopora
T. crocea
Small zoanthid rock
Pseudochromis paccagnellae
2 Chrysiptera
parasema
2 Zebrasoma flavescens
2 Amphiprion ocellaris
2
part B-ionic dosing
Calcium @ 475
Alkalinity 4.5
pH 8.2-8.4
some iodine dosing in small increments to supplement above
<Perhaps
some species of Valenciennea et al. gobies... I myself would avoid
snails, false/hermit crabs... and rely more on other mechanisms (other
than biological "cleaners" here). Bob Fenner>
Re: Selecting Safe Detrivores... no such word: detritivores
11/21/06
Dear Bob,
Hello again and thanks for the prompt
reply.
Quick follow up to my substrate / sifters questions.
Regarding Valenciennea gobies; can I have several in a 200 gal.
environment?
<Yes>
Could a clown goby or similar also be
incorporated?
<I would not... the genus Gobiodon are almost entirely
corallivorous>
Can you also elaborate on what you mean by "other
mechanisms", or are you referring to mean more frequent water changes?
<This and much more... posted on WWM... please see articles, FAQs files
on Marine/Reef Maintenance/Operation, Algae Control...>
Finally, I'm
not at all surprised about staying away from the crabs as this is well
documented, but what is the problem with snails in general. Are they
simply inefficient, or harmful?
<Often a bit of both... don't do
much, are vectors for pathogens...>
So many online retailers seem to
push clean-up crews, mainly made up of snails and crabs. I don't see
why.
<Highly profitable>
Thanks again.
George
<BobF>
Blue-Green (BGA) Slime algae (red too)
What inverts eat
Cyanobacteria?
<very few... almost none. It is unpalatable to most
and literally toxic to others>
I have hermits blue legs turbo and
Mexican snails and one or two emerald crabs.
<some limited
possibilities there... C. tricolor crabs, Turbo sp snails and some
comb-toothed tangs. Not the emerald crabs though>
None of them seem
to interested in eating the stuff. Please help. Thanks, Peter
<it is
noxious if not toxic. And it would be better to treat the problem and
not the symptom... do examine your nutrient export mechanisms... are you
getting daily dark skimmate from your skimmer consistently? Do you thaw
frozen food and decant the pack juice? Do you have very strong water
flow to keep detritus in suspension, etc? A good skimmer alone can
eradicate slime algae easily in 2 weeks or less. BGA is all about
nutrient control and water flow. Please browse the ton of content on
this subject in out wetwebmedia.com archives. Best regards, Anthony>
Dumping Detritus!
I have a 55 gal reef tank with sugar sized sand
as substrate. I would like to know what animal/s would be good in
helping me keep the detritus off the sand, as it is hard to vacuum?
<I like the idea of purposeful animals doing the job, rather than overly
disturbing the sandbed through aggressive siphoning>
I don't have a
preference as to snail, starfish, or fish. I currently have 6 Nassarius
snails and 1 serpent banded starfish( which I read on here are good for
this), but they don't seem to be keeping it very clean. Are these good
for cleaning detritus off sand and do I just need more of them? Any help
would be appreciated.
<I guess the definition of "clean" in a sand
bed is arbitrary. It's usually impossible for it to be perfectly
spotless, with no algae, detritus, etc. Keep in mind that a "sterile"
sandbed is neither natural or beneficial-not to mention, pretty much
unachievable! As long as you don't see excessive amounts of detritus,
algae, etc. in the substrate, and water parameters are within acceptable
limits, I think you're doing okay. Keep in mind that some organic
materials are required by the animals living in the sandbed. Keeping the
sand spotless through "natural" or artificial means can damage the very
processes that are keeping the tank in balance, and perhaps even injure
or kill the infauna that reside there. You could add one or two more
serpent stars, but I think that I would keep it at that. Fishes like
Pygmy Angelfishes (Centropyge) are detritivorous, as are some tangs.
However, you need to consider the needs of the fishes and the other
animals in your tank if employing these types of fishes to assist. Use
the resources on wetwebmedia.com to learn more about sandbed management
practices. Good luck! Regards, Scott F.> Adding clean-up
critters and LR
When should I add clean-up snails and crabs to LS
and tank? Then, when do I add LR?
<<Add LR first, let tank stabilize,
test for zero ammonia/nitrite, presence of low nitrate, do water change
and add clean-up as there is food available (algae, detritus, etc.) Low
fish load at this time after quarantine. Do a search on stocking and
clean-up crews at WWM, much more information there. Have fun, Craig>>
Hiring a Crew
I have just set up a marine system with a 90g
display tank, 20g refugium (with Caulerpa macroalgae) and a 10g
sump. It has 115lb live rock, 1/2" aragonite in the display tank and 4"
in the refugium, a large Berlin skimmer, and a Magnum filter for carbon
and occasional water polishing. Temp is 78, ammonia, nitrite and
nitrate are zero, carbonate hardness is 10 and Ph is just shy of 8. The
system has been curing about 5 weeks, and I introduced the first fish
today, a percula clown.
<Sounds nice. Recheck the pH, just to be
safe. I'll bet that the pH will be higher if you check it when the
lights are on.>
Two Issues:
(1)Brown algae has begun to form, and
I know it's time for a clean-up crew. What type of animals should make
up this crew? How many? Should I put anything in the refugium as well?
<Well- brown algae is an unfortunate, but totally normal occurrence in
new aquariums with abundant nutrients. "Clean up crews" can help, but
it's really nutrient export that's the issue. Keep up regular
maintenance, such as water changes with high quality source water, twice
weekly in small (5%) amounts, aggressive protein skimming, and keep up
the activated carbon use. It will eventually go away if you're diligent.
As far as "crew" members, I like some of the blue leg hermits, Trochus,
and Strombus snails. other animals, such as brittle stars, are nice,
too, but really not algae eaters>
>Flying Fish Express sells a 100g
clean up crew that features 20 scarlet reef hermit crabs, 40 turbo or
Margarita snails (ratio varies), and 60 red leg or left handed hermit
crabs. Does this make sense?
<That seems to make sense, but I
don't like that many crabs running around, myself...Granted, there will
be some attrition among these animals, so it's probably no problem. You
also might want to check Inland Aquatics and Indo Pacific Sea Farms-
both offer nice "cleanup crew"/biodiversity kits as well>
(2) Should
my Ph level be higher? How do I achieve this, a chemical
buffer? Adding calcium?
<Possibly buffer, but many times, regular
water changes with properly prepared saltwater, can usually do the
trick. Persistent low pH is a sign that something is out of whack with
your husbandry techniques...Relatively easy to correct-but do check your
pH at different times during the day to verify that you do, indeed, have
a problem>
Thanks for your input, Jeff
<Jeff- it sounds like
you're on the right track-system sounds good, you just need to stay on
top of things! Do read up on the wetwebmedia.com FAQs regarding pH.
You'll be fine! Good luck! Regards, Scott F> - Which Herbivore?
-
Thanks Jason, <You are welcome.> I have wanted to add an
herbivore as you mentioned, but is there one that I could add
considering my present livestock?. I don't know of any that would be
able to "survive". <Well... just how big is this grouper?> Maybe a tang?
<Yes, although you will probably need to obtain one of size that would
discourage the grouper from making a one-bite meal out of it. Groupers
can be bad that way.> What about the little critters, is there something
that I might have success with? <You might try an urchin... I've used
Tuxedo urchins around more questionable fish, but there is still no
predicting what that trigger will do. Might be worth a try, but a tang
would probably be better.>
Thanks again, Tim
<Cheers, J -- >
What type of clean-up critters would you suggest for the following two
areas of my FO+LR system.
Display: 180 net gallon display tank
with a Huma Trigger, Maculosus Angel, Green bird Wrasse, Marble Wrasse,
Regal Tang and Raccoon Butterfly. Approx.175 lbs LR. Approx. half the
rock has hair algae. The substrate (coral gravel) does not have a
problem. The back wall has some hair algae, but not to bad.
<No
critters will magically clean up the hair algae. Believe me...I wish
they could. Reach into the tank and pull/siphon this stuff out as much
as possible and look for the root cause: high nutrients, wrong spectrum
of light (old bulbs), silicate and/or phosphates, high nitrates etc >
22"x22"x10" refugium which is located in the center of my sump. This
area acts as a settling pond for detritus. The live rock rubble has
hair algae and the substrate (again a couple of inches of coral gravel)
brown from the detritus. I have the upstream and downstream barriers
protected from the incoming water and the return section of the sump
with a combination of Plexiglas baffle with plastic eggcrate material to
the water surface. I eventually want to purchase macro algae for
nutrient export in the refugium
from Inland Aquatics, but will have
to wait until the temperatures in Fairbanks are 20 degree F or
higher. I think FFExpress will ship clean-up critters.
<If you
really want a cleanup crew you can order the usual snails and crabs like
the ones sold at FFExpress but realize the trigger will make short work
of many of them, especially if he's large. David Dowless> Re:
janitorial work needed
What's up WWM crew! I have some questions
about the cleanup crew I am about to purchase. I was thinking of getting
about 75 hermits:
25 Blue Leg Hermits (Clibanarius tricolor)
20 Red Tip Hermits (Clibanarius sp.)
25 Dwarf Zebra Hawaiian
Hermit (Calcinus laevimanus)
5 Scarlet Reef Hermits (Paguristes
cadenati)
<Wow! That's a lot!>
I was looking at around 75
snails as well:
10 Margarita snails (Margarites pupillus)
15 Cerith snails (Cerithium sp.)
5 Turbo snails (Turbo
fluctuosa)
15 Astraea Conehead snails (Astraea tecta)
15
Banded Trochus snails (Trochus sp.)
10 Nassarius snails
(Nassarius sp)
5 Red Foot Moon snails (Norrisia sp.)
<Jeez-o-
Petes! You really want a lot of these little critters...eh?>
Here are
the inhabitants and the parameters of my tank:
-125 gallon AG
-30
gallon Sump
-65 lbs. LR (various)
-60-70 lbs. base rock (various)
-2.5"-3" Aragonite and sand substrate
-3 x 250W MH 5.5K
-2 x 96W
PC True Actinic
>------------------------------------------
-Large
Tube Anemone
-3" Clam (?derasa?)
-3" Pencil Urchin
-unidentified corals and sponges growing on LR
-2 Green Chr. (1.5")
-2 Firefish Gob. (2")
-1 Clarkii Clown (1.5")
-1 Yellow Tang (3")
-1 Coral Beauty (2")
>-------------------------------------------
Temp = 78
pH = 8.3
Ca+ = 400
PO4 = 0
Fe = 0
NH3 = 0.3
NO2 = 0
NO3 = >10
sp. gr. = 1.022
Does this cleanup crew sound
pretty good for a start or do you recommend others or more?
<Not more
for goodness sake! After these guys have cleaned up your tank what will
they eat? In reality many of them will be out competed for food and die>
My tank is well-matured, I just haven't had a real cleanup crew in a
while. The Hair Algae and Red Slime are suddenly taking over and I need
something that is going to be able to keep this at bay. A couple of
factors could account for this I think.
<The 10 NO3 for a start>
I
turned off my Filstar XP3 last week because it had clogged and I thought
I would see how things would go without it ( loss of some of the bio.
filtration ).
<You don't need it any way. Stuff with some good
quality carbon and change the carbon once a week or so...That'll keep
from becoming a biological filter>
The food I had been feeding the
fish for a couple of days was really smelling after I accidentally left
it out, I quit feeding it to them because I thought it was no good (
Uneaten decaying food matter that was already no good ).
<Good idea.
Food isn't all that expensive>
Or maybe it's the fact that all of my
powerheads are not on. I ordered a Red Sea Wavemaster Pro for the tank
and when I tried to hook it up and plug it in nothing happened. I sent
it back and only plugged in half of the p. heads ( loss of heavy
circulation ). Your opinions and comments on this problem are very much
appreciated. I apologize for the format of this letter but I thought it
would be easier for you to read. Thanks for your help.
<The more
circulation that you have the better. Siphon the hair and skim before it
gets entrenched. Unless you are really want all of those little
critters, I would divide the top and bottom list and get those critters.
If you find that you need more, then get the rest. David Dowless>
- Adding Clean-up Crew -
more questions...90 gal..90lbs Kaelini
rock...5 weeks old...nh3-0..nitrite-0...nitrate- 10..sg
1.023...ph-8.3..1 coral beauty..2 percula clowns...will not be adding
more fish for a long while...when and how many crabs. snails etc do I
add and do they have to be qt <Greetings, JasonC here... I'm not a huge
fan of the typical snails or crabs as they just don't seem to do the job
they're meant to do and spend more time killing each other. I would
consider adding a Nassarius snail or two to keep the sand bed clean, and
depending on what happens with problem algae... perhaps just wait. The
Coral Beauty should be able to keep some of that in check. Cheers, J --
> Re: cleanup crews
Ok guys here goes...Hey Anthony and
Bob And all. <Hiya. Paul here this evening playing both Bob and Anthony>
I am sure you have answered this before to many of us, yet I am dizzy
with too much info. <Been there before>
What is recommended for a
reef clean up crew? Which snails? Which hermits, if any at all,? Abalone
or no. Mini-stars? Brittle Stars? <While there are a great many "reef
cleanup crews" (pre-made deals et al) out there, there are only a few
necessary additions to consider in my opinion. Mostly though it depends
upon the function and need, as in tank size and type of application
(algae, scavenger, or for biotopic aesthetics): One being mini brittle
stars, a few snails (Nerites, turbo, Astrea, and Cerith, if heavy feeder
((heavy in additional bioload)) then I would recommend Nassarius)
Hermits are too opportunistic for my tastes. Although I do employ them
from time to time they can be a burden on other inhabitants. In any
event see here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/algeatrcontfaqs.htm and here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marine/inverts/arthropoda/crabs/hermitcrabs.htm.
Hope this helps> Hermit crabs - algae
Dear WWM:
If
you were to choose 5 species of hermit crab or crabs in general, for
routine cleanup of green hair and filamentous algae in my reef tank,
which would they be?
I intend on having corals and want "reef safe"
varieties.
I live in Ft. Lauderdale and can collect hermits from the
tide pools. Can I use these? If so, what species...blue legged, red
legged, etc
Thanks,
Steve
< I would do mainly red leg
hermits. Sally Lightfoots are good at eating hair algae also. Cody>
Stirring The Sandbed
Good evening every one
<Hi there! Scott
F. with you today!>
I have a couple of questions about maintenance of
my new 4 inch sandbed. I perused your FAQs and got confused. I could
swear Bob said to use a wooden dowel and punch holes and gently stir
once a month - all the way to the bottom of the sandbed. I'm pretty sure
Anthony said to do this, but only to the top 1 inch. Is there a
consensus here? I am not a scientist but want my sandbed to work. I
currently have my old crushed coral substrate on top of the sandbed in
mesh bags to seed it, plus my live rock.
<If you're working on
developing a true "deep sand bed" (I think that Bob's reference was to a
"fish only" setup with a more shallow substrate...), I'd keep my
stirring limited to the top 1/2 inch to 1 inch, to avoid disrupting the
denitrification processes that you're trying to foster. To be honest, I
really don't stir my DSB at all. You may want to utilize the services of
a brittle star or two to do it naturally for you, without excessively
disturbing the sand bed>
I read an article today saying that I should
seed it with a kit (rotifers, etc.) Is this correct?
<There are a
number of e-tailers that offer "starter kits" of appropriate sandbed
animals. My favorite source is Indo Pacific Sea Farms in Kona, and other
folks swear by Inland Aquatics, or other firms. Most of these kits
contain beneficial worms, snails, bacteria, and other useful creatures
to help "jump start" your sandbed. Do some searching on the net for some
good sources.>
Also, I had lavender/purple algae all over the sides
of my tank and in the substrate. I left it on the sides when I cleaned
the tank, but it is vanishing fast. Why is this? And will it come
back? I have plenty of it on my rocks, don't want to lose all of
it. Can you explain?
<Well, if the lavender/purple stuff is
coralline algae, then you will need to maintain proper
calcium/magnesium/alkalinity levels to keep it going. If it is a
Cyanobacteria (a nuisance algae), then you don't want it back! Do a
little reading on the WWM site, using the Google search feature to get
more information on exactly what kinds of algae you are seeing>
A
note to Anthony: I took your advice and went through all the
crabs. Just have six red-legs now, along with snails. I will watch them
carefully, and if I lose any more shrooms they will get fired.
<I'm
sure Anthony will be stoked to hear that!>
I also got a new Remora
skimmer, and wow, what a difference.
<It's an outstanding skimmer,
and really will do a great job for you! Glad to hear that it's working
so well for you!>
Thank you all so much for your continuing
support I have been doing this for a little over a year now and have
come a long way. It is a very rewarding "hobby" (more like "addiction".
And it would not have been possible without your continued support and
advice. Connie
<Connie, we are so happy to be able to be of
assistance for you! Sharing experiences and growing together in the
hobby is what this site is all about! Keep growing in the hobby, and
feel free to call on us if you need any additional assistance! Good
luck! Regards, Scott F> Clean up crew help
Hi Guys,
<Hi Louis, Don here tonight>
I have a 55 gallon salt tank that has
currently cycle very nicely with about 30-40 lbs of LR
from Florida. Things have started to proliferate on the rock including
green algae. Don't know if you would consider them Macros, but I don't
think so. No real developed leaf structures. They are more grass
like. All chem. levels at this point are perfect at 0 with Nitrates at
10ppm, temp at 77 deg f.. These reading have been constant for well
over two weeks now.
<Good for you, but if you are going with corals,
need to see the nitrate at 0.>
I would like to move to the next step
in my tank process, but as always, due to past failures I am afraid to
make the wrong decisions.
<Nothing wrong with going slow, actually
can be a benefit.>
Can you suggest a combination (numbers and names)
of snail/crabs etc that I would need to place in the tank for clean
up? I have no fish at the point, and in the future I plan on only some
simple soft leathery corals. Fish species still up in the air,
definitely a Yellow Tang somewhere in the picture. Still learning about
fish species.
<I don't like using any type of crab. I hade red leg
hermits that decimated my snails and have moved to snails only. Astraea,
Nassarius, Cerith, Trochus, a good mix is what you are looking for.
Numbers will depend on the load of the tank. I would start with 6-8 of
each except the Trochus, maybe 3-5 of those. See how they handle the
clean up and then modify from there.>
Lastly, I would like to
continue as well by adding another 30+ lbs of LR and probably stop
there. Would it be detrimental to add the LR to the tank to cure at
this time? Will it hurt the current flourishing LR? Can I add the
clean up critters simultaneously with the next batch of LR or do I need
to wait out the next cure phase before moving forward on inhabitants?
<If you are going to add more rock now, I would wait to see if there is
an ammonia/nitrite/nitrate spike, maybe a week or two. Then start adding
livestock.>
Thanks so much as always.
Louis Rizzo
Selecting a "Cleanup Crew"
Hey Guys
<Scott F. your guy
tonight>
I am somewhat confused about what "critters" to use for
cleaning up detritus etc. I have had a few crabs, a few snails, and some
shrimp. I need to purchase a restock of "critters" Could you give me a
list of the BEST ones?
<Well, it all depends on what you need them
for...If you're looking for algae control, you may want to consider
Strombus, Trochus, and Turbo snails. I like some of the herbivorous
hermit crabs, too. For detritus control, you could look into some of the
so-called "Margarita snails", or the interesting "Sandbed Clams" that
you can obtain from my favorite source, Indo-Pacific Sea Farms in
Kailua-Kona. IPSF has a great selection of "cleanup crews" and diversity
animals...Inland Aquatics, LiveAquaria, and other e-tailers offer a
variety of animals that can do the job nicely....Do check out the many
possibilities...Hope this helps! Regards, Scott F>
Thank You
Rudy
SCAVENGERS
>Hello,
>>Hello, Marina here.
>I have a 75
gallon saltwater fish only tank with crushed coral for
substrate. Please tell me what type of scavengers would be best to help
clean up uneaten food? Something that is easy to maintain. Also, how
many would you recommend?
>>Serpent stars. You could add three or
four easily. I cannot recommend anything else without knowing what you
have for residents (hermits, shrimps, and so on, may be eaten by
wrasses, triggers, large angels). Best of luck! Marina Re:
SCAVENGERS
>I have 2 clowns, 1 orchid Dottyback, 1 flame Hawkfish
and 1 coral beauty dwarf angel.
>>Then you should also be able to
have small hermit crabs, Lysmata spp. of shrimps (they'll take up
uneaten food rather than specifically detritus). Marina <<Mmm, the
Hawkfish will eat the shrimps, and possibly/eventually the Hermits...
RMF>>
Re: SCAVENGERS
>I am sorry, what is Lysmata spp.
of shrimps?
>>Look here, many, many species. http://www.google.com/custom?q=lysmata&sa=Google+Search&cof=AH%3Acenter%3
BGL%3A0%3BAWFID%3Ac12f9ba1e9294d73%3B&domains=wetwebmedia.com&sitesearch=wetwebmedia.com
Clean Up Crew And A Skimmer, Too?
I was hoping you would be
willing to suggest a good clean up crew. I have a 125 FOWLR tank. A wet
dry filter, 2 H.O.T. magnums, and 2 small undergravel plates. Currently
I have 2 sand sifting stars, 1 brittle starfish, 1 serpent starfish,
about 12 blue leg hermit crabs, a red general starfish, and a cowry
snail. I was thinking of getting a 100 small blue leg hermit crabs and
about 50 to 100 snails. However I was reading through you FAQ's and seen
some mentioning of brittle stars, queen conchs, and serpent stars. What
would you recommend?
<I like the mix of animals that you are
considering, but I have become less of a fan of the hermits, myself. I
question their ability (and desire!) to do what we think they should do!
I really like brittle stars and Turbo, Trochus, and Strombus snails.
They seem to do a good job for me.>
Also, I am looking into getting a
protein skimmer, would you also please give me some guidance as to which
you think is a better, in sump or hang on, which method, any specific
name brand??? I was hoping to stay between $200 - $250, can I get a good
one for that price? Any online places you recommend? Thank you.
Bill
<Well, Bill, I'd lean towards one of the Aqua C. units...The Urchin Pro
is an in-sump model that can handle 75 gallons plus, and it's right in
your price range (although it would be operating at the limits of its
performance envelope). If you can push it to the $300.00 range (and
afford a pump), you'd be well-advised to check out the Aqua C EV120.
Either way, you'd be hard-pressed to find better skimmers in this price
range! Good luck! Regards, Scott F.> -125g Clean-up crew-
I have another question for you all. I am looking to get a good cleaning
crew and I was hoping to get some input. I have a 125 gallon FOWLR
setup. I run a wet dry, two 250 hot magnums, and a corner undergravel
plate. I currently have 2 sand sifting stars, a serpent star, a brittle
star, a cowry snail, and about 12 blue leg hermit crabs. Here is what I
am looking into getting:
4 brittle stars <Larger brittle stars can
consume small-medium fish at night. Buyer beware!>
5 bumble bee
snails
2 fighting conchs <It is unlikely that you could keep two
conchs fat and happy since they get so large>
5 peppermint shrimp
4 queen conch <I'd suggest only one conch, the smaller the better, but
you may not even be able to keep one alive in the long term>
2
serpent stars
2 emerald crabs.
In the future I would like to get a
few cleaner shrimp and some fire shrimp. Will that be a good cleanup
crew or so you recommend anything else? <Sounds good, how 'bout some
snails for algae control? Good luck! -Kevin>
Thanks
Bill
How many hermits - 10/14/03
I'm a little confused. <Aren't
we all?> On the hermit crabs page, it says:
"If you use them, place
about one, two small Hermits per actual gallon of your system. <Emphasis
on small> Use a mix of species and make sure and provide many "upgrade"
homes (empty shells) for your Hermits to move to." <I can agree to this
view with the exception that the hermits should be small>
However, on the first hermit crabs FAQ page, the first question
reads:
"Snail & Hermit Crab waste
Hi Bob:
My tank finally
cycled with a lot of algae bloom. Two days ago I added 10 Scarlet Reef
Hermits 10 Turbo/Margarita Snails and 30 Red Leg/Left-Handed Hermits
from FFExpress. They have done an excellent job cleaning but I noticed a
lot of waste since I added them in the tank. Is this bad for the tank?
And should I pull out some of the hermit crabs out?
<You neglect to
mention how large your tank is. I would not use anymore than 1 hermit
crab per 10 gallons. I use about 1 snail per 2-4 gallons depending on
the tank, lights, etc.>
Thank You, Aram
<You are welcome. -Steven
Pro>"
So which one is it? <Well, I can see this view as well,
different strokes for different folks. Let me tell you what I have in my
ten gallon tank. Two hermits. That's right....two. Ask me how many I
started with? Ten hermits of varying species. Aggression and starvation
has eliminated the competition. So my recommendation is one no more than
two per ten gallons period. The same equation works in my twenty gallon
for the most part. I now have three left out of twenty. So maybe no more
than four in a twenty gallon should suffice> There's a big difference
between one or two hermits per gallon, and one hermit per ten gallons.
<Agreed. The above recommendation is what works for me. You might have
luck with a few more if you feed them regularly. Is it a little bit more
clear? Hopefully so>
As you can see, I am confused.
<Naw.......just a difference in point of view. You are gathering
information for a better point of view. Good on ya' mate, -Paul>
Brian Peppermint Shrimp, marine scavengers?
If I
am starting a saltwater tank - 55 Gallon - I have spoken to people who
said that I need Peppermint Shrimp to help keep it clean - How many do I
need to buy? How often should I expect to replenish them?
<Mmm, I
believe you have mis-heard. This species of Lysmata shrimp is employed
as a cleaner of sorts... for removing pest anemones. Please make use of
the search tool on the homepage of www.WetWebMedia.com (at bottom,
left)... insert the terms "marine scavengers"... and read.
Bob
Fenner> Clean up crew choice for a Mandarin tank - 11/04/03
Hello all,
Just a question. <Aren't they all> I have a Mandarin
(Synchiropus splendidus) named "Chowder" who has been loving life in my
tank for the last 6 months and is quite fat and eating well. <Very glad
to hear!!!> I want to know if there is a good bottom cleaner (snail,
shrimp, fish, crab) that will be a good clean up guy that will not
invite himself to partake in Chowder's food supply. <Well, are we
talking eating chunks or leftover marine meats, algal matter, or the
actual amphipods and copepods?? (naturally occurring food stuffs)> I
have a few blue-legged hermits and was wondering if there is something
better. <depends.....I like a mixture of Nassarius snails, Cerith
snails, maybe an Astrea, some blue-legged, zebra, scarlet hermits.
Usually they will do the trick without doing too much damage the reef
environment per se. Some like blennies as fish go. I think a brittle
star or any starfish, cucumber, or even an urchin would not be a good
choice here. Try and resist these particular "cleaning crew" choices as
they can be somewhat destructive to the reef environment. Extracting
materials in the natural food chain in the tank and eventually
disrupting the ability for the amphipod larvae to find food stuff at the
proper size. Also, it is possible the starfish might predate on a
sleeping "Chowder" or could just out compete him for food stuffs. Be
resourceful and informed my friend. Again, my recommendations are just
some things I hear in the field but have not seen myself. My starfish
don't seem to care there is even any amphipods in the tank others have
told me they will hunt them. -Paul> Thanks again. Amblygobius
(actually other) species that eats algae
Hi all,
<Hello there>
I contacted previously about Amblygobius rainfordi, and realize that
this is not the fish for me. Thanks for the advice and info. I would
still like a goby, and I like the look of the Amblygobius gobies. I for
article at WWM it was indicated that some species eat algae. I have a
well established 135G tank of 3 years, with a refugium . One of the
reasons I am interested is I have heard that they will eat hair and
other filamented algae's. I have normal algae growth, but my tangs just
won't touch the stuff.
Thanks
Bryan
<Mmm, a few pertinent
points to (try to) make. One is that there are some algae species that
most all fishes refuse to ingest... perhaps they're unpalatable for
chemical, physical reasons... And approaches to these algae control lies
elsewhere... Second, there are better blennies for cropping filamentous
algae than gobies in general... Look to the genera Salarias,
Atrosalarias if your system is large enough. Please use the Google
search tool on WWM here for much more. Bob Fenner> - Seastar
Questions -
Hi crew,
Long time reader first time writer.
I
just want to make sure my last purchase is a smart one. <Ok.>
First
I'll start off with some tank facts.
Saltwater 55 Gallon FO
ammonia- 0 nitrite- 0 nitrate- 0 pH-8.3 Sal. - 1.023
don't test
anything else
carbon run 24x7. protein skim with a Versa-jet skimmer
(cheap I know, but actually has wonderful performance for me, about 4-8
oz of dark skimmate daily.)
3.5-4" crushed coral substrate
cheap
lighting (perfecto strip of I would guess two 15" fluorescents)
Inhabitants - a few damsels
clarkii clown
Pseudochromis
very
small valentini puffer.
I am looking into getting a star,
particularly the chocolate chip star.
I would like to get this star
to help clean my substrate and glass. <Not a sure thing.> Also I have
heard its very hardy. <Hardy in what sense? All seastars could be lumped
into the category of 'not hardy' although some may tough it out longer
than others.>
Are my conditions good enough for this star to thrive?
<Hard to be certain - are many variables, health of organism on arrival,
appetite of that puffer, available food, etc.> There is plenty of algae
that I have to clean biweekly to weekly off the substrate and glass.
<Can't guarantee that this seastar will eat this.> Will this be enough
for him along with the left overs from my fish feeding (frozen krill,
frozen brine shrimp, dry blood worms, flake, frozen silversides, frozen
clams)? <Well... I'm sure you know that these animals don't move very
fast, so it may not get the opportunity to get to all this food or clean
the glass as quickly as might be useful for you.>
Would you suggest a
different star (although I would like to stay with a hardy specimen)
<Again, really no such thing as a hardy seastar in the pet-fish trade -
are all delicate and responsive [in a negative way] to water quality
issues. There are others, like the general star that are impractical to
keep that would rate higher on the hardiness scale than a chocolate chip
star.>
I would love to add some live rock too but I know my lighting
wont be sufficient for the invert. <Wouldn't be so concerned about this
- live rock with or without lighting will provide benefit to your tank.>
hitchhikers and coralline growth. So I think I will wait for better
lighting till I get the LR. <I wouldn't wait if I were you.>
Thanks,
APM
<Cheers, J -- > Clean-Up Crew (1/20/04)
Hi WWM
Crew. It has been sometime since I last email you folks. I finally got
around to converting to DSB and Live Rock and protein skimming for
filtering my 75 gallon FOWLR tank. It look great. I now have a 4.5 - 5
inch DSB comprised of 150lbs of Southdown (hard to find in Texas)
<impossible in Utah> and 40lbs of Carb Sea live sand. <Sounds nice>
I
just set it up a few days ago and was wondering how long to wait before
adding a detritivore and or clean up crew kit. I still have a 6 hermits
in the tank. Everyone says that the LR will seed the bed, so do I need a
detritivore kit to get the pods and worms for the sand? <Much can come
from the LR, but a detritivore kit will give I a boost. Up to you. I am
a big fan of these two sources:
www.ipsf.com and
www.inlandaquatics.com > If I order a clean up crew, should I order
a 30 gallon clean up crew now and another 30 gallon crew a few months
from now? <It's really up to you. I'm not a big fan of hermits myself. I
like various snails like: Nassarius, Nerites, Turbos, Ceriths. Also a
big fan of Brittlestars. There is no specific # of snails/hermits you
need. Retailers will tell you that you need whatever # they want to sell
you.>
In addition to the DSB, I added a 20 gallon long sump/refugium.
What should I put into the Refugium? It is about 15x12 inches. My
primary goal is NNR. <Will you be lighting it? Chaetomorpha or
Gracilaria algae would be great. You could also put some critters in
there (refugium fauna kit, for example.>
Thanks, Glenn <Hope this
helps, Steve Allen> Detritivores - 2/22/04
Hello again,
Thank you guys for all the help, however, I always manage to need it
again. <Hello again> This time I'd like to know what kind of
detritivores are good for cleaning the whole tank. <where to begin. Look
through our site on maintenance and algae control. Also, look through
some of the live marine sites for their recommendations. I like brittle
stars, hermits crabs, snails, shrimps, cucumbers, and even some fishes.>
As of right now I have a 70 tall that has lots of rocks and corals in
it. The detritus in the tank seems to be affecting the health of the
system because the corals are not extending well and the tank seems to
be coated with a thin film of poop. <Then maybe you could siphon it
out?> I've tried water changes but it doesn't seem to be doing as much
as I want it too. <More frequent changes with siphoning or you could do
just as well with blowing it with a turkey baster and then do the water
change> Is there any really good organism that eats the poop and turns
it into a smaller more chemically filterable matter (something my sand
bed and rocks and filter out?). <Some sea cucumbers in the genus
Holothuria:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/seacukes.htm But remember not to look to
adding an animal as much as you should look at your maintenance habits
and regimes> I have plenty of snails, crabs, and sand sifting stars (4)
but they don't seem to be doing enough. <Sand sifting stars tend to
filter out good bacteria that may aid in the breakdown of detritus. Not
to mention one to a large tank is more than adequate. Not too useful in
my opinion> Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. <I suggest to
cut back on feedings, increase water changes (implementing blasting and
siphoning), increase circulation to keep detritus in suspension to be
siphoned out, no sand sifting stars, and maybe the addition of a new
detritivore. Good luck ~Paul> Chris Set Up and Stocking
Questions
Whomever is answering questions--thanks.
<Welcome>
These may seem repetitive. I have The Conscientious Marine Aquarist in
my lap, and I've looked at your set up and stocking pages but am still
confused.
Background: I started keeping freshwater about 3 years
ago and last November started a 12-gallon nano-reef, which was set up
at the local fish store for me. It had a tomato clown, a bubble-tip
anemone, 1 firefish, umbrella and leather soft corals,
<These get
much bigger than this tank... can be disastrous chemically if "upset">
live rock and live sand, and later three tiny gobies (they called them
red-cheeked at the store, but I've never seen them in a fish book)
<Likely Elacatinus puncticulatus:
http://wetwebmedia.com/neongobies.htm
Do you see this fish here?>
as well as many snails, a peppermint shrimp, and some macroalgae. I had
no problems. Changed 2 gallons of water a week and changed out carbon
once a month. I gave that set up and all my freshwater set ups away
when I moved in September.
Am now trying to set up a 46-gallon tank
as a mini-reef tank.
<Ah, much better>
Found a very helpful LFS
but they insisted that I buy uncured live rock (which is nice rock, but
uncured) and base rock (total of 55 pounds) and put it in the tank
above not live sand. So I now have that set up and the ammonia is off
the charts.
What should I do now?
<Off the charts as in more than
1 ppm? I would change a good part of the water out with some pre-made...
keep the skimmer clean, running at peak efficiency... maybe dose the
system with a Kalk product...>
Also, I need to keep a clown fish and
an anemone.
<Need?>
With that information, the
LFS had me buy
a 110 36 inch watt 9325K light. Is that enough light?
<Not likely...
unless it is a specimen, species that can/does derive a good deal of its
nutrition from eating vs. photosynthesis... you will soon see... as it
will move about...>
(I need the clown fish and anemone because their
relationship is the only thing my husband likes.) If it's not enough
light, I'll buy what is.
<I see>
Here's what I'd like to keep in
the tank, in addition to the clownfish. It seems too much, but some
answers seemed to suggest it'd be o.k., others not. 1 Jawfish, 1
symbiotic goby and shrimp, 2 cardinalfishes (pajama or Banggai),
1 firefish, and 1 (or 2) Bannerfish, whichever is the smallest hardy
breed.
<Heniochus acuminatus>
I am planning on adding macroalgae
to the system.
<Do consider adding a refugium... locating at least
some of the macroalgae there>
Cleaner crews: should I buy a
pre-established set?
<Maybe... but like securities, stock picking,
you could do as well putting your own assortment together as by
purchasing a "mutual fund">
Some of them seem to have things like
sea cucumbers in them which don't make sense from what I've read, as
well as scarlet hermit crabs. That's confusing, suggesting that
the aquarium stores are wrong. Also, when should I add it?
<After the
system is completely cured, ahead of the fishes>
I really appreciate
your help, and think that the Conscientious Marine Aquarist is a
wonderful book.
All the Best,
Margaret Cooter
<Thank you for
your kind words. Bob Fenner> Detritus Eater
Dear crew,
I just had a quick question, in the near future I will be purchasing
this tank,
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Product/Prod_Display.cfm?pcatid=10677&inm=1&N=2004+62760+113565
, what are some things I can purchase to control detritus that are reef
safe? A list with a few things would be nice, thank you very
much. -Randy
<<Hello Randy. You can put a few hermit crabs, and a
snail or two...depends on the size of critters you are buying. A large,
one inch or more snail can handle a twelve gallon tank all by himself.
"Reef safe" leaves some broad horizons...what exactly are you planning
to keep in this tiny tank? Corals? Fish? The water parameters might well
fluctuate so much that the Reef Safe animals you do house may not
survive. For now, you should start with the cheap, easily replaceable
animals, like a few small blue legged hermits (say, 5 of the lil beasts)
and one turbo snail, an inch across, OR two smaller Nerite snails, you
get the picture. Avoid anything fancy for the time being. By the way,
small bristleworms are excellent detritivores. Perhaps you can buy some
live sand from your LFS.
-Gwen>> Marine system algae bloom
I have a 75 gallon marine aquarium that recently had an algae bloom in
which I lost some of my favorites. I have done water changes faithfully
and it appears I am winning the war. However I still have some bubble
and green hair algae. So recently I added 2 green myth. crabs and I do
have a few scarlet and blue Mexican hermits...my question is how many
"cleaners" and what type can be maintained in a 75 gallon tank?
<Not
able to state given the provided information... more than you list if
you have a good deal of live rock>
What type and how many should I
have to keep my tank healthy?
<Up to you... what you
consider "healthy"... You should read through WetWebMedia.com re set-up,
maintenance aspects in lieu of such "crews">
Many places sell the
big "attack packs" which I purchased when I originally set the tank up
about 2 years ago. The quantity seems like overkill, and indeed I did
see the "cleaners" thin out in number. Your wise advice is, as always,
gratefully accepted.
Thanks,
Jeff Wagner
<We agree as to
these "kits"... read my friend... there are many ways to get you where
you want to go... nutrient limitation, export... rather than
establishing predator-prey relations twixt producers (algae in this
case) and consumers. See WWM re. Bob Fenner>
Nano Reef
Clean-up Crew and Detritivore Recommendation 8/17/05
I
like to say first off great web site I found a lot of good info here...
<<Thanks>> I was actually wondering if I could get a good suggestion on
a clean up crew for my nano reef, both algae and detritus... my tank is
a 15 gallon eclipse system w/ a retro fitted lighting system consisting
of one 15w Coralife fluorescent and two 13w pc's all 50/50. I have no
protein skimmer just the built in pump with carbon filtration and a
BioWheel... sorry didn't mean to get side tracked. I was just wondering
if I could get an idea of a good set of inverts to help clean both algae
and detritus from the tank... I would like a variety of creatures in the
aquarium including snails, Nudibranch or cucumbers, and hermits, and I
eventually want to have a yellow-banded coral shrimp so compatibility w/
this creature would be appreciated. <<I'm not trying to discourage you,
I just want to make sure you are well informed. Please understand that
nano reefs are harder to maintain than larger systems. I would encourage
you to search WWM and read up on every aspect. Here are few links to
start you out:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/smmarsysdisfaqs.htm
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/smmarsysfaq6.htm
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/smmarsysfltfaqs.htm>>
Current
Specifications of Water Quality
Temp 76 degrees F
Ph 8.1
Specific Gr 1.021-1.022
Ammonia >0.25 ppm (but not quite 0)
Nitrate >2.5 ppm
(but not quite 0)
Nitrite >0.05 ppm (but not 0)
Calcium
Level 450-500 ppm
<<Raise the SG to 1.025. How long has the system
been setup?
Strive for Ammonia and nitrite of 0. With the high
calcium level, I would guess your alkalinity is low. Unless you are
planning on keeping stony corals, strive for a calcium level between
350-425 and alkalinity of 8-12dKH. You will find values in these ranges
easier to maintain.>>
Additives
Daily: Iodine, Liquid Calcium
Weekly: Strontium/Molybdenum, Kent PhytoPlex or ChromaPlex (each on
every other week)
Biweekly: Tropical Science NitroMax w/ Oxyboost
(also added w/ water change approx 2.5 gallons every other week)
<<Wow, you are a dosing machine. IMO, you can save a lot of money and
still have a thriving system by using a good quality salt and changing
1-2 gallons of water every week. The water changes will supply all of
the elements needed for you reef.>>
Thank you for your time
Donald Summers
P.S. this was my Idea let me know if it sounds good
or not, thanks
1 x Banded Coral Shrimp, Yellow (Stenopus
scutellatus)
1 x Sea Cucumber, Tiger Tail (Holothuria sp.)
10 x
Dwarf Blue Leg Hermit Crab (Clibanarius tricolor)
2 x Nassarius
Snail (Nassarius sp.)
10 x Cerith Snail (Cerithium sp.)
1 x
Lettuce Sea Slug "Nudibranch" (Tridachia crispata)
<<Your list seems
reasonable although I might reduce the number of hermit crabs. Clean up
crews are a little bit personal opinion.
Also, be aware that when
the hermits are hungry, scavenging gets a new interpretation. I would
wait a few months before adding a detritivore kit. Also, please read up
sea cucumbers and clean up crews. (http://www.wetwebmedia.com/seacukes1.htm
and
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marscavfaqs.htm).>>
If this is a good
selection what are some compatible fish to go along with these
specimens?<<As for fish, again personal preference will prevail and
there are many small, colorful and interesting fish to choose from
including clowns, gobies, blennies, damsels, etc.>>
Thanks again
<<You're welcome and good luck - Ted>> Re: Nano Reef Clean-up Crew
and Detritivore Recommendation... actually mainly a stocking query
8/20/05
Hey Crew,
Thank you for the quick response.<<You're
welcome>>. Previously I asked about a good clean up crew for my 15
gallon eclipse system 1. I have a retrofitted lighting system consisting
of on 15w Coralife fluorescent and 2 13w pc's all 50/50. Is this enough
lighting or do I need more, and with this being a carbon filtered system
how often should I replace the Carbon. <<For the animals listed below,
the lighting is fine. You will need more light if you plan on adding
stony corals.>> I perform weekly water changes and currently replace the
carbon monthly. <<That sounds about right>> I know it is to early to
much of anything right now but I would like a second opinion.
Currently the system has been running for approx 2 months.
ammonia 0
nitrate 0
nitrite 0
temp 76 F
PH 8.1-8.2
calcium 450 & 500
alkalinity is 10 dKH
Specific Gr 1.021-1.022
<<I would raise the SG to 1.025. Your
calcium level is elevated. Are you dosing a calcium supplement? You
don't need dose anything as long as you keep with the regular water
changes and don't have any stony corals in the system.>>
This is my
revised idea for total stock in the end. Currently I only have the
hermits and about 20 lbs of LR and 2-3 lbs of LS
1 x Banded Coral
Shrimp, Yellow
(Stenopus scutellatus)
4 x Dwarf Blue Leg Hermit
Crab
(Clibanarius tricolor)
2 x Nassarius Snail
(Nassarius
sp.)
8 x Cerith Snail
(Cerithium sp.)
1 x Rainford's Gobi
(Amblygobius rainfordi)
1 x Yellow Candy Hogfish
(Bodianus
bimaculatus)
& assorted polyps and mushrooms corals
<<A good
list but your tank is probably too small for the hogfish.>>
I am
trying to get as many thoughts as I can what should I add next or better
yet what order should anything be added. I have read and heard
everything from start with fishes to allow your system to stabilize w /
the corals first. I believe the best way to tackle the situation is to
get a couple of thoughts on the matter as to stocking order. This is the
order I have used in the past: Inverts , Corals and then Fish (I have
also taken a FO tank and added LR then Corals and then inverts) both
systems worked but what's the recommended way to go.<<I would add the
clean up crew, followed by the shrimp. After that, it's up to you. There
are many variations depending on factors such as the age of the system,
fish species and coral species.>>
Thanks again.
<<Cheers - Ted>>
Cleanup Crew/Algae Control...and what else? More Mandarin trouble.
10/4/05
Good afternoon, Bob!
<Actually Adam J here with you
tonight.>
I have found your website to be invaluable for
information. Thank you very much!
<Well it’s not my doing but I
agree this place is awesome.>
I am the temporary keeper of a
29-gallon saltwater aquarium. I know that it has more inhabitants than
it should have for its size, but it's not my tank! :-)
<Sounds like you should show your “friend” the way of the force….I mean
responsible aquarium keeping.>
However, I am wanting to control the
algae & get some help with leftover pellet food cleanup! <If there is a
lot leftover you are over feeding.> I recently purchased a horseshoe
crab, which I now know from your website, was a mistake for this tank
size. <Yes.> However, I also have a turbo snail & a mandarin goby in
there. <Whoa a Mandarin? Do you know the requirements of this species?
It will surely starve in a 29-gallon tank within months.> In
considering hermit crabs and additional snails, can you offer
suggestions? <Trochus snails are a favorite of mine for algae grazing,
though the best way to prevent algae is to remove the nutrients that are
feeding them. Efficient skimming and frequent water changes should be
employed.> The most aggressive fish living in the tank are 3 damsels,
so I don't think that will be an issue. <An issue as far as what?> But
my concerns are these: (1) the aggressiveness of hermit crabs as they
outgrow their shells, and I wonder if there is a breed of crab that will
work whose shell grows with him or who will accept a spare shell rather
than attack others for a new one. <You should always have extra and
larger shells for the hermits to choose from. This will help minimize
the aggression. Hermits “rent” shells they do not grow with the
crab.> (2) How many crabs/snails will I need to control algae in this
size tank? <The one turbo and a Trochus or two is more than enough. I
prefer not to use hermits.> (3) How big will a hermit crab grow...
will he outgrow the tank? <Depends on the species some stay dime sized
while other can become softball sized.>
Your response is very much
appreciated, and I look forward to hearing from you, Vicki Racette
<No trouble but please address the Mandarin, as it is not suitable for
this set-up. Adam J.>
We Need Merry Maids! 11/12/2005
Hello WWM Crew,
I hope all of you folks are doing GREAT and as
always, thanks for the wonderful website! I am almost completely cycled
and getting ready to start stocking my 240 gallon reef tank and I think
I have most of my livestock list figured out except my "cleaning crew".
This has been the most confusing aspect of figuring out my livestock
list thus far and was wondering if I could get some advice.
My first
question concerns the Nassarius obsoleta or Ilyanassa obsoleta. I was
considering adding some of these to my cleaning crew for their glass
cleaning, algae eating; sand stirring ability but I have read so many
mixed reviews I am not sure what to do.
<"When in doubt, leave them
out">
One person swears by them and the next person condemns them. I
was wondering if you would give me your opinion and/or experience with
them, whether or not you recommend them and if you do recommend them,
<Are useful creatures of utility for many types of marine aquariums,
species mixes>
how many you would recommend for my 240 gallon tank?
<A handful, two handfuls>
I have 500 pounds of rock (250 pounds base
rock/250 pounds live rock) and an average sand depth of 2". Also, I am
including what I have come up with for a cleaning crew and I was
wondering if you could advise me whether you feel this is appropriate
for my setup or not and if I should add the N. obsolete along with this
crew, substitute if for one of the other snails or leave it out all
together. I haven't purchased any of these items yet because I don't
have a LFS or anyone locally to ask advice and to be totally honest, you
folks are the only source I trust when it comes to my reef tank. I also
would like your opinion as whether I should add this cleaning crew first
or should I add some of my other livestock first
<They, the
cleaner-uppers, should go in first>
and wait a few weeks before
adding my cleaning crew so they won't starve on such a new tank.
<Not likely with the LR>
Anyway, the cleaning crew I have come up
with is as follows and please direct me as to whether you feel this is
appropriate or as to what changes I should make. The list is as follows:
(50) - Mexican Red-Legged Hermits Clibanarius digueti, (200) - Small
Blue-Legged Hermits Clibanarius tricolor,
<Am not a big fan, okay
even mid-sized fan of using Hermits, and not in large numbers... I would
start with far fewer if you want to use these>
(120) - Turbo Snails
Astrea sp., (120) - Nassarius Snails Nassarius vibex, (30) - Nassarius
Snails Nassarius polygonatus, (30) - Nerite Snails Nerite funiculate,
(120) - Cerith Snails Cerithium strercusmuscarum and (6) - Peppermint
Shrimp Lysmata wurdemanni.
<... this is way too many snails... by
about an order of magnitude in my opinion/experience. Many will die
off... polluting your water, others will "die mysteriously" consumed by
the Hermits...>
I am sorry for such a long email but I just want to
make sure I am on the right track before adding such a critical
component to my reef tank.
As always, thanks so much for your help!
Take care all,
Bryant
<Please read here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marscavart.htm and the linked files
above... Do agree with you re differing opinions in this hobby
interest... And mine is to scrub more, circulate, aerate and skim
more... be careful re introduction of the means of algal and detritus
production, and severely limit the introduction/use of such "cleaners".
Bob Fenner> Clean up Crew
I'm putting together my
clean up crew for my 46 gal. tank w/ 65 lbs. of live rock with lots of
Algae.
Would you recommend a combo of Turbo and Trochus or Turbos and
Astrea snails? How many of each for my size tank?
Thanks, Rob O.
>>
Well... you've asked a pointed, defined question... So... I'll
gladly respond in kind. I don't encourage the stated stocking density of
Trochus genus Snails, and I do favor the use (if being utilized) of
Turbo and Astrea genera gastropods over the use of Trochus... (though in
Europe... there are some collected/collectable trochid family members
that are desirable...).
Bob Fenner
Thanks Bob for answering the
question of what kinds of snails. How many would you recommend for my
size tank?
<Oops, sorry for missing this part previously... IF I was
using snails, five or ten of
Astreas and Turbos... Some Blue Legged
Hermits... again five or ten... depends on the types, amounts of live
rock used, lighting... other algae eaters... am a bigger fan by far of
using fishes... like Ctenochaetus Tangs, Blennies...>
I also really
want to get some starfish. I was thinking (1)Blue Linckia,(1)orange
marble and (1)brittle starfish. Should I purchase these when I get my
clean up crew or should I wait until my tank is more established? How
many would you recommend for my size tank? Right know the tank is 6 wks.
old with lots of Algae mostly brown).
<I'd only consider the middle
species... and you can place it now... or wait
Bob Fenner>
Thanks
again, Rob O.
Suitable Herbivores for Reef Tank
I want
to add an active herbivore to the tank that will prune the plants (grape
and lettuce Caulerpa) without disturbing the other members of the tank
community. A tang seems like a logical choice but have some
contradictory information on whether or not they are compatible with
coral and other invertebrates.
I have a 125 gallon reef tank with 100
pounds of live rock and crushed coral substrate that covers about half
the bottom of the tank. Wet/Dry filter, protein skimmer and UV
sterilizer.
The current population includes: Clean up crew, 4 cleaner
shrimp, 4 clown fish, purple fire fish, coral beauty, fairy wrasse, a
mix of hard and soft corals, 3 anemones, 2 starfish and a horseshoe
crab.
Can you recommend suitable tank mates?
Also, would like to
know if I can add an additional dwarf angel to the tank (Flame Angel)?
Your articles are extremely informative, and I enjoy reading your
responses.
Thanks: Dave
>>
Thank you for writing and being
part of this forum. I would indeed trust a tang of either the Sailfin
genus Zebrasoma (like the Yellow and Purple) or the Combtooth genus
Ctenochaetus (like the Kole/Yellow-eye, or Chevron) for the job... the
only real downside of these fishes is they might eat too much of your
"spare" Caulerpa.
And I would definitely get a nice Flame as a show
piece for your system. For your size system it should learn to get along
with the Coral Beauty within a few weeks maximum...
Be chatting. Bob
Fenner Cleaners???
Hi Bob,
Was just wondering what
your recommendation for a "Cleanup Crew" would be.
I've got a 92 gal
tank. My rock (being cured now) has some bubble algae and assorted
macroalgae on it now. I like the Mithrax Crabs, Blue and Red leg
hermits. Do these guys get along? <Yes> I've heard that snails can do
more harm than good. Is this your experience? <Depends... the snails
that are most often used are not much problem... dying,
disease-spreading wise... Just do your best to get some that are
initially healthy... FFExpress does a very good job with these>
I
don't want anything (if possible) that gets large (over and inch or so).
I want the cleaners to do their work in the background, and leave the
fish and corals as the main focus. I've seen tanks that are over loaded
with cleaners. I don't like that look.
<The Mithrax Crab will be
bigger than this with time (a few inches)>
Is there any "cleaner (s)"
that would sift and clean the sand bed enough to eliminate the need for
vacuuming the sand bed? And no toxic time bombs!!!!
<Some fishes...
keep reading>
If you could be as specific (species, quantity) as
possible with your recommendation, I'd really appreciate it.
Thanks
in advance, Tony Revinski
PS Do you live in San Diego?
<Yes, for
most of the year, Bob Fenner> Goby vs. Cucumber vs. Starfish?
Hi Bob,
Thanks for your time. I have been having green algae problems
growing on the sand with my 60G fish tank with LR lately. I already have
a phosphate sponge and keep phosphate to <0.03. I have been reading on
the subject people are recommending me get the Golden Head Goby, a sea
cucumber or sand sifting starfish. Do you have any suggestions and how
many of them do I need?
Also would I have to keep the Goby in pairs?
Thanks. Brian >>
<Hmm, well, all of these might do you some good...
but for my moolah, time, I'd get a member of the Salarias, Atrosalarias
blennies, just one, and watch that algae disappear.
Bob Fenner>
BoDP? (PF looking for creepy crawlies)
Me again,
I was
wondering if you could aim me at a good source for detritivore
propagation techniques.
<sure... the Gulf of Mexico. Thanks for
asking :)>
Besides some places offering LS, I know of only 2 places
offering detritivore kits ('pods, worms of various sorts, mini-brittles,
etc.).
<yes.. they are both great suppliers but scary overpriced (or
rather... lack competition to keep the prices lower)>
I was thinking
the market place may well be due for some more competition (once I buy
that friggen' house and have room...).
<much agreement... I have
made this pitch to many upstart coral farmers that I have talked to. All
this far have elected to stay hungry and farm SPS frags rather than make
money in the market...heehee>
I was thinking of going to the current
sources, acquiring some product, setting them up in their own dedicated
culture tanks and letting nature take its course.
<helpful yes... but
seriously, some fresh rock and sand from the Gulf is seriously teeming
with life and targeted species>
as for the email title, I think you
can figure that one out. ;)
<heehee... yep. I'm almost as smart as I
look [insert joke here]>
aloha, ('cause I can't remember how to spell
au revoir [?])
PF
<Hasta potato, because I'm hungry. Anthony>
Mail order
You mentioned you could mail order scavengers, who can
you buy from this way. Caudill
<You can buy livestock from many
mail-order or e-tailer establishments. Check our sponsors and our links
page. -Steven Pro> 1st Tank - Clean up crew for my 40 gallon
(UK)
Hi, <How goes it?
I've been advised by my LFS to buy
his 'critter pack', what a surprise!
It consists of:
6 blue
legged hermits
6 turbo snails
a choice of a brittle starfish or
emerald crab.
Would this be sufficient to for my tank or too much??
<Probably not enough, and not much variety in species, either. Check
out the clean up packs at www.garf.org or www.liveaquaria.com>
I am
going to stock 2 percula clowns at the same time.
<Don't add any
fish until your tank is completely cycled!>
Cycling should finish in
about 2 weeks time.
<Wait until then>
Thanks
Dave
<Anytime - M. Maddox>
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