Tetra stocking-too many choices
9/25/18
Hello Crew!
Thanks in advance for your time. I have had a 20 gallon long with
fluorescent lighting set up for many years. It has been a peaceful
community tank. Due to some pretty intense circumstances in my life the
fish all dwindled away and it is now only home to a ridiculous amount of
cherry shrimp who apparently are thriving in this neglected planted
tank.
<Easy to trade in toward new livestock likely>
Now that things have settled down I have been able to purchase a
38 gallon bowfront LED lit tank. I set it up and it is
currently cycling with janitorial ammonia, I have hopefully fast tracked
this process by using a mucky (in a good way) filter cartridge from my
old tank and some rocks and plants and such. As of now the parameters of
the new tank are these:
Nitrites-0
Nitrates-20
GH-75
KH-40
PH-7
Temp-79
Ammonia is reading at .25 however it comes out of the tap like that and
I treat with prime so I am thinking it may be an ammonium reading,
however I am waiting patiently, I know not to rush the cycle.
<Should be cycled w/ the NO2 and NO3 readings you're reporting... I
think the NH3/NH4OH reading may be spurious>
So I intend to move the entire shrimp brigade over, (any suggestions as
to how to get all the babies are appreciated) and break down the old 20
gallon.
<Net out most all, drain water down and SLOWLY and carefully scoop out
gravel and place in the new system in scoop/batches>
I want to do a peaceful tetra tank. I love neons but don’t want to watch
them die from NTD. So I would like to do a few schools of tetras that
will work well. I live in Miami and there are “fish farms” here.
<Ah yes; how well do I know>
Basically giant cement outdoor tanks containing every fish you can
imagine, so my problem is this- I have too many choices and I don’t know
what to choose. The local fish farm has Rummynose, black neon, green
neon, ember and gold.
<All these are good choices and would mix; but I'd limit the arrangement
here to just two or three tetra species; add some catfish of choice,
perhaps a show specimen or two>
They have many more but I think I’ve narrowed it down to these. I would
appreciate any suggestions as to which ones would work together and how
many,
<At least ten of each>
I’m assuming a few schools of 10 or 12 each. I really love the Rummynose
but I’m not sure they will work with my parameters and the others.
<Should. All have been raised in local water quality I assure you>
Any advice is appreciated, I have researched every tetra but I’m
overwhelmed by too many options/combinations. Thanks again for your
time! It’s very much appreciated!
Marya
<Thank you for sharing Marya. Please do send along your further
observations. Bob Fenner>
Re: Tetra stocking-too many choices
9/26/18
Thanks so much! Will keep you posted...
<Thank you. Hey have you heard/seen the Zamora Catfish,
Auchenipterichthys thoracatus?
BobF>
Re: Tetra stocking-too many choices
9/26/18
I have not, but I’m going to check it out now!
<It's a beauty! A bit exotic, but does make its way into the petfish
trade on a punctuated basis. BobF>
Re: Tetra stocking-too many choices
9/26/18
Interesting. Will keep an eye out.
<Ahh>
Re: Tetra stocking-too many choices
9/27/18
Ok Mr. Fenner I have a few follow-up questions....
<Let's go!>
I started moving the cherry shrimp over, assuming it will take a few
days to complete the process.
<Good>
I went to the fish farm to get a plant and they had some black and white
striped bumblebee shrimp, I got 3. They told me they are very sensitive
but that they are ok with the cherries.
<S/b fine. Likely the same species. Like blondes/brunettes>
I checked wet web and in my haste couldn’t find a lot of info but I took
the chance. So far so good, any extra info on these would be
appreciated. So in the tetra choices I have, which ones are least likely
to bother the baby shrimp?
<All will eat the shrimp when they're very small; but some should
survive; and adults will be fine.>
I know there’s always a risk but in your opinion which are the best bet
Also I purchased a very large “mother” Amazon sword. It is so large it
has flowers and baby leaves growing off the top, so big I had to fold it
over to close the lid and this is a tall tank.
<Neato!>
What do I do to make the babies? Hahaha sorry.
<Pinch them off and plant them separately; or bend the stem down and
plant it in the sand/gravel>
Thanks again, you are the best,
Marya
<Thank you for sharing Marya. BobF>
Re: Tetra stocking-too many choices
9/27/18
Great! Thanks again for your advice. I am still working on the process
of moving all the shrimp and the Nerite snail, once they settle in I
will head back to the farm for some tetras, I’ll keep you posted, thanks
so much!
Marya
<Glad to share your adventure! B>
Re: Tetra stocking-too many choices
10/4/18
Hi Mr. Fenner,
So the update on the process is this: I have most of the shrimp moved
over thanks to the help of my 11 year old daughter, who has taken the
task on due to the $3 paycheck upon completion.
<Ah, the ole profit motive eh?>
And so most are doing well, I have lost a few, not sure why, maybe just
the stress of the move since all parameters have remained steady.
I went to the fish farm and purchased 10 ember tetras and 10 gold
tetras. They have been acclimated and are all doing well and tend to
school as one big group. I was at first concerned about adding 20 fish
at once however I am keepers by a close eye and parameters are holding
steady.
So as I’m getting ready to leave the fish farm the owner approaches me
to show me the fish he just got in and he shows me the most beautiful
Galaxy Rasbora.
<Neat animals>
So my question is this: what are the chances I can add them to my tank?
<Likely very good; as long as they're not much smaller than the new
Tetras>
If I bump the temp slowly down to 77? He says they are locally raised so
that wouldn’t be an issue but if I bump the temp down to 77 will this
mix work?
<Again; probably so>
Also if I that is a possibility is 6 enough or is more better?
<Six or more; yes>
Thanks again!!!!
Marya
<Welcome. Bob Fenner>
Green neon tetras for large tank question
5/29/17
Hello,
<Hi Andrew>
I am getting to stock my 120 gallon planted tank. It's been set up for over a
year but so far only has shrimp and Otocinclus. The tank is heavily planted with
plenty of stems and hairgrass, filtered by 2 Eheim 2217 (cleaned monthly) and
receives a weekly water change (30-50%).
<I'd like to use the change water on my house plants>
The main fish will be a school of green neon tetras (Paracheirodon simulans).
Tank mates will be 20 Corydoras similis, 4 Otocinclus, 75 Amano shrimp, and
probably what will end up being 100 or more tangerine tiger shrimp (after
breeding).
<Sounds good>
*How many tetras can I get while still keeping the bioload reasonable?* I'm not
concerned with nitrates and phosphates (as it is I have to add some daily for
the plants), but rather other dissolved organic compounds. I've
found minimizing these to be essential for planted tank health. I'd love to have
a large number to see the social interactions at their best.
<Fifty individuals wouldn't be too many, and would make for a nice school here>
Also I run the tank at 74 degrees - is this too cold for them?
<Mmm; yes; as well as the other life listed... I'd raise this to 77-78 F. for
all>
Many fish database sites seem to list a wide temperature range for this species.
<Tis so>
Thanks,
-Andrew
<Welcome. Bob Fenner>
Green neon tetras for large tank question /Neale
5/29/17
<<No real disagreements with BobF., but would remind you that this species is
very Cardinal Tetra-like in requirements; as Bob suggests, middling to warmish
conditions preferable to cooler low-end tropical (i.e., the
opposite to true Neon Tetras). Avoid strong currents, but ensure a good oxygen
level by under-stocking the tank and providing steady but gentle circulation.
Softer water also essential here; not necessarily mineral-free, but lowish,
maybe 2-5 degrees dH, certainly no more than 10 degrees dH. Keep the pH between
6 and 7.5 depending on your ability to maintain stable water chemistry.
Specifically, if you're using carbon dioxide fertilisation, for example, link
this to pH, and perhaps use a commercial Discus buffer to ensure stable
conditions. Green Neons (Paracheirodon simulans) have a poor survival rate in
busy community tanks, so choose tankmates accordingly. Small foods, fed in
frequent but rather small amounts rather than one feed per day probably best.
Bob is spot on in
suggesting a big school is best here -- Paracheirodon simulans does not do well
in the usual 6-10 specimen schools people often buy. Cheers, Neale.>>
Re: Green neon tetras for large tank question 5/29/17
Thanks for the information and welcome! What an honor to get information from
the man himself, Bob Fenner.
<Hee heeee. Just a petfish kind of guy Andrew>
I look forward to interacting more with your site in the future. I only
discovered it recently but quickly found
it to be a wealth of knowledge.
<Ahh!>
Wishing the crew a happy Memorial Day holiday,
-Andrew
<And you, BobF>
Hydrolycus scomberoides
7/20/11
Is it possible to keep Hydrolycus scomberoides successfully? I'm
told they die at 12" in captivity after approximately two years.
What conditions would be necessarily (if possible) to keep them long
term?
Regards,
Rob
<Hello Rob. There are a couple of obvious problems with this fish.
The first is that adults come from very fast flowing rivers with lots
of oxygen, and the second is that these fish are extremely large when
mature, potentially over 1 m/39 inches in length. Also bearing in mind
that these are schooling fish to some degree, if you had three
specimens 60 cm/24 inches in length, you'd need a tank upwards of
500 gallons in size, and be providing water turnover rates 10 times
that, i.e., 5,000 gallons per hour. Outside of public aquaria, it's
hard to imagine many people having those sorts of resources. On top of
this, these fish are difficult to feed, and have a definite preference
for live food. Those aquarists who elect to use feeder goldfish and
minnows may be able to feed their fish in the short term, but in the
long term such foods create serious health problems as you hopefully
know, partly because of exposure to diseases, but also because those
fish contain fat and thiaminase that cause damage to the fish over
time. So anyone buying these fish would need to either breed safe
feeders at home (for example livebearers that could be gut-loaded) or
else concentrate on things such as earthworms and river shrimps (again,
gut-loaded). All things considered, these fish are not suitable for the
home aquarist, and yes, they all seem to die once they reach a size of
30
cm/12 inches, the length at which wild fish switch from being
stream-dwellers to river-dwellers. Cheers, Neale.>
TigerFish (HYDROCYNUS VITTATUS) Dear Bob I would like to
enquire about a market for live tiger fish. Is there a market for live
tiger fish? <Yes, but a limited one... do to their size,
voraciousness, and difficulty in shipping (they don't move
well)> Who would be the best candidates to purchase live tiger fish?
Could you let me know if it is possible to export live tiger fish to
the USA? <If I were a supplier, I'd try various freshwater
wholesalers... or if you just wanted to sell to one, contact Steve
Lundblad at Dolphin International (Los Angeles) re> Would it be
possible to give me a couple of names of live fish distributors in the
east (Japan, Taiwan, Thailand, China)? <Please see the O.F.I.s
listing here> I heard from someone that there was a big market for
these live tiger fish in the east, but after searching far and wide, I
have not been able to get any detail ... Please can you help? Freddie
<I don't think this market is large... I would look into selling
at least other African species as well... Bob Fenner> Midnight
massacre - help! This last week I have been losing my albino
Longfin and zebra Danios during the night. In the daytime these mainly
occupy the top layers of my aquarium, but ay night sleep in the cover
of numerous plants and rocks. Each morning I find their numbers
diminished and some with their tails completely chewed off and bloodied
stumps. There is no indication of the culprit during the daylight
hours, but I am wondering if my golden algae eaters are to blame as
they seem very protective of their personal space. My
tank: 300ltr (80gal)
with mix of artificial and live plantings
Temp: 21oC (70o
F) as I have a mix of goldfish and semi-tropicals
PH: 7.0
- 7.1 Ammonia: 0 ppm
Fish: Comets,
Shubunkins, Calico Ryukins, Fantails
Buenos
Aires Tetras, Black Widow Tetras, Bitterlings
Golden
Algae Eaters, Chinese Algae Eaters
Peppered
Catfish, Tandanus Catfish
Albino
Longfin Danios, Zebra Danios I have suspected the Tandanus Catfish, but
there is only one, a juvenile, no larger than the Danios. Until now,
these fish have been socializing quite happily since installing this
tank about three months ago. Can anyone enlighten me please? < My
money is on the Buenos Aires tetras. These tetras are quite active and
have appetites to match. I suspect they are out looking for a little
midnight snack and find these albino Danios easy to find in the dark
and easy to catch when they are asleep. As these tetras grew larger
they have found that they can now eat at least part of these Danios
when they catch them.-Chuck>
Re: Massacre Thanks for your input Chuck. With your advice in
mind, I removed the four Buenos Aires tetras to my emergency
"hospital" tank, but the carnage continued. Last night I did
some torchlight surveillance and located the culprit. It was indeed the
Tandanus catfish! Even though he was only slightly larger than his
prey, he sure could open wide! Have found out that this breed can grow
ENORMOUS, so as he is a native of Australia, he has been removed to one
of the dams on my property. Peace now reigns. Thank you once again.
< Australian fishes are rarely found outside there native country
and so are very rare in the aquarium hobby or in the aquarium
literature. You bring out a good point in that aquarists should
research proposed tank mates prior to introducing them into their
aquarium.-Chuck> Lois
Head and Tail Light Tetra Hi! I have head and tail
light tetra in my tank. Water is fine. Ph and all
that are normal. One of the fish is swimming
vertical. Is this a problem? Chris Casey <<Hello. Yes,
it's a problem. Please get your water tested, ASAP, at your local
fish store, or buy your own test kits. Test the following: ammonia
(should be zero), nitrites (should be zero) and nitrates (should be as
low as possible, between 20-60ppm is a decent range to aim for). If any
of those test high in your tank, water changes will be required to
bring them down and control them over time. IF you have had these
tested, please tell me the results. You will also need to give me more
info on the fishes symptoms, so I can tell you if the problem is
treatable or not...-Gwen>>
"Freshwater" "Lionfish", Red Belly
Piranha I was just wondering if that you can put a (fresh water)
lion fish in with a fire belly piranha. <Well, unfortunately, the
"freshwater" "lionfish" is actually a high brackish
to fully saltwater animal, and will not last long (if at all) in
freshwater. Beyond that, it is not a lionfish at all, but a
toadfish. The one most commonly available in the aquarium
trade is Batrachomoeus trispinosus. More on this fish here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/batrachoididae.htm
and here:
http://www.fishbase.org/Summary/SpeciesSummary.cfm?ID=10747&genusname=Batrachomoeus&speciesname=trispinosus
.> The piranha is about 8.5" in length. Who would
eat whom? <Provided that the lion survived long enough to be eaten,
I'd name him "dinner" and not get attached, to be on the
safe side. But really, I would absolutely not try to keep
this saltwater fish in fresh water.> The fish tank is a 33 gallon
tank. <Yikes. This tank is too small for the piranha
alone, in the long run, as it grows to be at or over a foot
long. I would *certainly* not add any fish, compatible or
not, in this tank.> Also how can you tell between a male and female
piranha. Please send pics, if you have any. <You can find the
WetWebMedia article and photos on piranhas here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/serrasalminae1.htm
. Sexing this fish can be difficult to
impossible. Upon maturity, the females may be more robust in
the belly, and males may have slightly more blunt heads. I
would recommend using http://www.fishbase.org/search.cfm
to find out more about this and other fishes. Here is their
info on the red piranha, Pygocentrus nattereri:
http://www.fishbase.org/Reproduction/FishReproSummary.cfm?ID=4501&GenusName=Pygocentrus&SpeciesName=nattereri&fc=102&stockcode=4699
They have quite a great deal of information on this fish, please be
sure to make use of the links at the bottom of the page.>
Thanks, Travis <Wishing you
well, -Sabrina>
School's In Session Long story. I have a 5gal tank, for
lack of expenses, though I have heard that 20gal is better. Last week,
out of compassion or whatever, I tried to save some goldfish some
people on my college campus were not treating right. Oops. Found out
later that they are not good starter fish. Well they all died within a
few days. I had not given the tank enough time to cycle. I was told
that I could get a couple fish to put in here for starters. Three days
ago I got one Serpae tetra and one black skirt tetra. The man at the
pet shop said they were his favorites to use. Later that day, I found
out online about the schooling fish, and that they need to be in groups
of six minimum. What do I do? They seem healthy so far, active.
<Well, I would give your tank a little more time to finish cycling,
then you might want to add maybe two more of each. Not exactly a
school, but small groups> I realized yesterday that I was
overfeeding, so I have cut back to once a day, smaller pinch. Water is
clear, but there is a smell, reminds me of urine. No other way to put
it... Here are my questions. is the smell something bad? how do I get
rid of it? <Well, if it smells like urine, it may not be a good
thing. A healthy tank has an "earthy", pleasant smell, not an
ammonia-like smell. What kind of filter are you using? If you are not
already (and assuming your filter can accommodate it), try using some
activated carbon. That will help remove discoloration and odor. And, of
course, in a small tank, you should be diligent about regular water
changes! Acquire some test kits: ammonia, nitrite, nitrate. By regular
water testing, particularly in the early stages of your tank's
existence, you can really get a handle for what's going on.>
Would the two groups work good together, or do I need eventually to get
a separate tank? <I think that they will work with diligent
attention to maintenance, but you will eventually have to get a larger
tank to accommodate these fish at full size. Maybe neon tetras would be
a better choice for the long run?> To add fish, how big a tank do I
need for a good number? <Maybe a 10 or 20 gallon tank. This would
give you more flexibility> Don't have the gages yet, but will be
getting them soon. Any help will be so appreciated. Thanks for
everything. I've been reading and it's good info. Amy <Keep
reading and learning! You're doing great! Scott F.>