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Upgrading to a bigger tank/Moving 1/17/12 Moving a 375 gallon tank -- 09/14/09
Successfully Moved my Reef Tank Contents 1400 mi. 5/24/06 Hello again, <Hi there> Amazingly enough I have reason to celebrate and thought I would share how I successfully moved the live rock and livestock of my 75 and 58 gallon reef tanks into a 120 gallon tank 2 weeks ago. <Please do> Sadly I did lose my very large (6-8") bubble coral and 2 Firefish that hid in the rocks, but incredibly that's all. The live sand went putrid as expected, but that was OK. It will be easier to run the tank bare bottom with the LR and keep the sand bed in the refugium until we get a house out here. No use having a sand bed in the tank right now as it will have to be torn down and moved again once we get a house out here. Anyway, I finally found a new job back out West ( Utah ) where I belong after working and living in Saint Louis , MO for the last 4 years. I'm from Colorado , so I'm right next door now. Anyway I moved into a temporary apartment here in Ogden , UT the first week of April and started my new job. Four weeks ago my wife called me at work to say that the 58 gallon tank was overflowing and was half empty. <Yikes> I had to fly back home to Missouri to fix it and remembered to put a big chunk of Chaeto in a Ziploc and bring it back with me. It was clear after the mishap that my wife couldn't keep my tanks going so I decided to move the contents out here where my new job is until our house sells and we can buy a new home. When I got back to Ogden , I bought a new 120 gallon AGA reef ready tank that I had my eye on and mixed up 150 gallons of saltwater to get ready for the move. I plumbed the tank so it would be ready for the drains to the sump and return pumps. The under tank sump is used for circulation and is the home of my EV-180 skimmer. I built an external 40 gallon refugium from an EBay kit and added some live rock rubble, 80 lbs. of seeded oolitic sand and the large chunks of Chaeto I brought with me from my tanks back home. I put a small heater and a small air pump in the refugium to get it going during the weeks prior to the move. I added a pinch of fish food into the refugium now and then to keep things going. I flew to Saint Louis to get the tank contents ready. I packed all of my fish and corals into Kordon Breathable Bags and suspended them from the sides of Styrofoam fish shipping boxes (Big Thanks to Beldt's Aquarium in Hazelwood, MO!) <What a great old store> with bamboo barbeque skewers to enable good gas exchange though the surface of the bags. <Interesting> (My wife's idea!) I tossed in some heat packs and left the Styrofoam tops off and only folded in the cardboard tops so as to have some air circulation and not suffocate the animals. I packed my 200+ lbs. of live rock in the same types of Styrofoam boxes and then covered the rock with wet cloth dish towels as they breathe better than newspaper and don't have the inks and chemicals that newspaper does either. I had about 2 inches of water in the bottom of the rock boxes and made sure that the towels were in the water to wick up the moisture and stay wet. I only folded the cardboard over the rock as well so that it could breathe. I tossed some heat packs enclosed in Ziploc bags into the rock boxes as well. I rented a minivan to drive to Utah and that night I loaded everything into the back of the van and left the van in the garage. I left the back door of the van open and ran a couple of space heaters aimed at the boxes in the van to keep the boxes warm until morning. The first night we stayed at my Mom's house in Colorado to drop off my dogs until the house sells in Missouri as it makes showing the house difficult for realtors when the dogs are there. I brought the fish and corals into the house and once again aimed a space heater at the boxes in the van to keep the rocks warm. The next day we got to Ogden and the rock was still wet and still smelled healthy. The only bad things that happened were that the 2 Firefish that hid in the rocks died and luckily fell out of the rock. Also the bag containing the bubble coral was cloudy and smelled really bad so unfortunately I had to toss it. The 200 lbs of live sand smelled like a sewer and found itself next to the trash dumpster. It's been 2 weeks now and I haven't detected any ammonia and everything looks just like it did before I moved it. So far my Flame Angel, Copperband Butterfly, all of my corals and clams are doing fine. I am really amazed at how well it went. Just goes to show with good planning you can successfully move a reef a long distance. Bryan <Thank you for sharing! Bob Fenner> Moving and combining tanks in one day = mission
impossible? 4/29/06 Greetings and thank you for your valuable
service and advice. Whenever I have a question, or anyone
in my aqua club has a question, I go to your site for
answers. Thank you for all that you do! I wish I
had more time (hours) to read all the FAQs on this topic, but it
appears my situation may have a unique combination of variables and I
don't want to screw this up, so I am going to the experts to make
sure I do this right. Hope you don't mind . . .
<Likely not> I currently have a 55g reef with about 60+ lbs
liverock and 2-3 inches crushed shell/coral substrate (I now know after
reading some of your site that this substrate is not a good thing).
<Mmm, well, not as good as others in the majority of applications...
but more so in others still...> Tank has been set up for 6 years but
neglected by previous owner who sold it to me on eBay. I
have nursed it somewhat back to health (didn't realize the
substrate was such a big problem). It is running a skimmer
and HOB CPR refugium. No other sumps/filters
applied. It has PC lighting, not enough to do high light SPS
corals, etc, just enough to grow a few softies, etc. Current
livestock: mated pair false Percs, royal Gramma (owns the
tank), juvenile coral beauty, 2 yellow goby clowns, 4 green Chromis,
large peppermint shrimp, 3 emerald crabs, large serpent sea star (fancy
banded) and a large and varied assortment of dutiful hermits and
snails. I just purchased a non-drilled, non-bulk headed, 90g SW reef
system that has been running for about 3.5 years (despite its previous
owner, apparently). It has a deep sand bed (2-6 inches, not
even), 90+ lbs liverock, flame Hawkfish, two clowns (not same species,
I know, again, big no-no), possibly a coral banded shrimp (may have
been dinner to Hawkfish), sand sifting starfish of some sort, two tangs
(yellow and maybe sailfin), very large anemone (he didn't know what
kind), 3-4 damsels (will be donating those to a new home somewhere), 2
"furry" crabs one black one grey (?). He is
running two sumps/mechanical filters and no skimmer. He has
a UV sterilizer and several hundred watts of PC lighting plus
moonlight. he was not running a heater or any other
powerheads (the glass looks rather green . . .). When
combining tanks, I will ditch the crushed shell/coral substrate in
favor of the live sand. I will also ditch the two sumps and
UV sterilizer in favor of skimmer and large CPR HOB
refugium. Are these good ideas? Or would you keep
one or both sumps? <I would keep at least one of these... better
both, and make one or... into refugiums...> I hate the
idea of sumps and the possibility of power outages leading to soggy
carpets. .. I also will likely sell the other two clowns and Hawkfish
and damsels to fellow marine aqua club members assuming the clowns will
not get along well (not a big assumption I think). <Well worth
investigating more here... much reduced maintenance and increased
vitality from the sumps' use...> "Plan A" is to move
the entire 90g setup and livestock, sand, rock and all in one day, set
it up in the new home 30 miles down the road and once the sand settles,
put livestock back in with livestock and rock from 55g, all in one
day. "Plan B" would be to move the 90g tank, set
up in new home (with skimmer and fuge) and put livestock in the 55g
reef temporarily. I am worried that stirring up all that
sand will result in a huge die off and nitrate/nitrite
spikes. Will this happen? The livestock will
undoubtedly be cramped for those few days while the 90g
settles. Aside from the clownfish issues and Hawkfish v.
shrimp issues (serious issues), will the livestock be compatible enough
to tolerate each other for a couple days in the 55g? <Should be fine
here> I have no other tank space in which to temporarily house
inhabitants. Which would be better, Plan A or Plan B? <Plan B... A
is too hectic, likely to have/cause problems> And do you have any
suggestions/modifications to make this move better?
<Posted... on WWM> I do have experience moving my current 55g
across town as well and all went well with that one (except for nearly
dropping the tank on the way up the stairs, but we don't like to
talk about that). <Yeeikes> Thanks in advance for any and all
advice and sorry for the long novel! <Thank you for writing,
sharing. Bob Fenner> Re: Moving 20H Tank 3 Feet Over? 01/03/2006 Hi again, <Welcome back Susanne!> Wednesday, December 21, 2005, 10:49:08 AM, crew@mail.wetwebmedia.com wrote: I'll let you know how things went after the "operation" is over! <Do keep us posted. Try the Wet Web forum for pump input/reviews. May have some in the CA Magazine but I think it's on powerheads.> Best regards, Susanne <Happy holidays, hope all "moves" smoothly. - Josh> Just an update on the move: everything went just fine, with 75% of the water and all but the bottom rocks taken out. <Glad to hear it.> The 2 fish and pistol shrimp stayed in and all made the move without any problems. <Well done.> The house was a mess with buckets and bowls everywhere, but the move enabled me to syphon out gunk from places I hadn't been able to reach, and I took the opportunity to frag a few things while they were easily accessible. <Good old spring cleaning...uh..early;)> Fortunately I took pictures of the tank, since it's really hard to remember which rock fit where. :) <I always just made something up and convinced myself I liked it better.> Happy New Year to everyone! <And to you, thanks for the update. - Josh> Best regards, Susanne Moving Hello, This past weekend I moved my 90 gallon tank to a new apartment across town, and thanks to all the advice posted here, it was mostly successful. I say mostly, because I had planned to do it all in one day to minimize troubles/recycling, but the movers did not show up on Saturday afternoon like they were scheduled to,<oh> and I was not able to move the tank myself on Saturday.<ok> We were able to get movers on Sunday morning, and so they moved the tank then.<good to hear> I am describing all of this because I am worried about the tank needing to recycle and a possible subsequent ammonia spike. <agreed> I moved almost all of the water, although added about 20 gal. new water, moved about 200 lbs. of my deep sand bed, covered with water in the Rubbermaid's, and moved my 80 lbs of live rock, also covered with water. <sounds good> The fish I put in a 30 gal rectangular Rubbermaid's, w/ 2 pieces of live rock, an air stone, powerhead, and heater during the whole ordeal. <good> I broke down the tank starting at 10am on Saturday and was able to restart the pumps and add fish in the new place at 8pm Sunday. Last night I checked the ammonia, and it looked like there was some present, btwn about 0.2-0.3. Also, I know that there was a decent amount of algae that died off in the tank by being out of the water for a day.<could be the problem> The fish (one 4.5" Naso tang, one yellow tang, 2 ocellaris clowns, 1 neon goby, 2 cleaner shrimp, various hermits and snails) were all living and swimming this morning , although they are clearly spooked. I have a EuroReef (CS8-2? can handle a much bigger tank than my 90) skimmer going. Also, I took out the original bioballs in my sump about 5 months ago, with good results, so they are not a factor here in bio filtration. How bad will the ammonia get? Will the sand and rock and water all need to recycle?<Well sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't ...I would check water parameters daily> What should I do in the meantime? <Do small water changes... to dilute the ammonia/ and keep checking the water> What level of ammonia is lethal for a short amount of time? <any ammonia in aquariums can be deadly so its best to keep checking the water... and do small frequent water changes to dilute it> Many thanks for all of your advice, especially for posting it in one place on the web! <your welcome, IanB> Thank You, Laura A note of thanks, and a question Hi all--- I managed to successfully move my 55 gallon saltwater aquarium yesterday (just from one room to another), and your help made things a lot easier. Having things planned out in advance, having tubs ready for fish and everything ready to go when needed was a big plus, and I owe two guys a great deal of thanks for your advice. <I am sincerely glad to hear it went so well for you.> Now, my question...I replaced the UG filter and crushed coral with live sand, and added about 45 pounds of live rock to the 25 pounds I already had (I used about 40-50 pounds of live sand, about 1" thick throughout). <All sounds good.> I did some water tests last night and there was a bit of ammonia (NH4) present which is gone today. However, for the first time since cycling over a year ago there is nitrite present (~0.5ppm). I am assuming (perhaps incorrectly) that there is a bit of LR or LS that wasn't totally cured, even though the sniff test was unremarkable when putting it in <A good guess.> or, and hopefully this is the case, that by changing all the substrate that the bacteria in the canister filter need some time to catch up and become re-established (with the bacteria in the sand) and re-cycle. <You changed all your media in the canister filter, too? If so, probably not the best thing to do at the same time.> Should I: 1. Leave things as they are and continue monitoring nitrite levels (and not feed at all)? I have increased the aeration in the tank already. <Sounds like a good plan.> 2. Add some Cycle to speed things along <Not really that useful, IME/O.> 3. Do a 20% water change now, or wait a few days when hopefully the nitrite will be lower and the nitrate up a bit. <I would wait and watch (both test kit results and fish behavior) at this point.> My hope is that this is all temporary and will return to normal soon, but I don't want to jeopardize my livestock by letting things persist. Once again, I thank you for all your help. All good wishes, Daryl Klopp <Good luck! -Steven Pro> The big tank swap Hi guys, Since I've pestered you so much on my swap of a crack 210G, I thought I'd give you an update on the swap. Today was the big day. The new tank is a beauty (thanks, Skip at Tricon). Went to three main cut outs instead of two with 1" corner rounds. Nice and sturdy looking on top. It was a long, grueling day with the help of my tank maintenance buddy but aside from two mishaps, things went smoothly. I went with an island arrangement inspired by Bob's book. I have a freestanding island for my anemones and two other islands with a few good bridges between them. You may or may not remember my comments about my shy asfur and tang. The new arrangement has worked wonders for their temperament in just the first day. The tang used to dart from cave to cave and the asfur rarely came out at all. Now, the tang does loops around the islands and the asfur glides from island to island. The other fish seem to enjoy the arrangement as well. Additionally, it provides lots of places to display my corals (a second pair of blue VHOs helps too) and the whole effect is quite nice. I highly recommend this sort of arrangements. Pleasing to the eye and the fish love it. <This reminds me of something I was told a long time ago. The more good hiding spots you have for your fish, the less they will hide. Sounds contradictory, but it is true. If your fish can get to several good hiding spots in a moments notice, because there are plenty to go around, they will stay out in the open more.> One mishap involved the death of two of my prize fish, a flame angel and a fisher's angel. I think the O2 got low in my holding tank due to my powerhead malfunctioning although the other fish seem fine. Might also have been stung by some BTAs in the close confines (it was a 20G). Both were dead without a mark on them. Very disappointed; they were old friends. So far, everyone else seems fine and unstressed but time will tell of course. <Truly a shame.> The other mishap involved a heater. All day long, my buddy kept asking me if I'd turned off the various heaters as we moved stuff around. And sure enough I remembered. But I guess the shock of my dead angels made me momentarily careless and I left the heater for the 20G holding tank "on" on a stool. My wife smelled smoke and we started hunting all over for it. Fortunately, we found it before a fire started but there was some serious char. <Even worse is when you leave them on and then try to fill the tank back up with water. They explode sending shards of glass raining into the tank.> On the bright side (or at least very odd side), while we had the doors to the house wide open a humming bird flew in. After 3 hours in the house, I was able to catch him this evening with one of my large fish nets. Very weird. With this same net I caught a damsel yesterday in my seahorse tank I have been trying to catch with nets and traps without luck for 6 months. I need to have this net bronzed. <Other than the two Centropyges, it seems to have been your lucky day.> Anyway, thanks for all the good advice along the way. When my tank settles down, I'll bug you about some fish selection choices but no point in worrying about that just yet. Marc <Talk to you soon. -Steven Pro> Successful Aquarium Move Follow-up Hello, <greetings, Bill... you made it <smile>> I've been writing and conversing with Anthony about my recent quick move. During the 18 hour drive, I'm pleased to say nothing died! <you planned and executed well...kudos> Even my large scopas tang and ribbon eel lived the trip.. I've got some interesting information though.. During the drive, the livestock was in the car, but the rock wouldn't fit, so it was in the bed of a friend's truck, along with 60g of system water (had to add about 7g when I got here.. it wasn't enough for the 58+sump) The temp during about 8 hours of this trip was below 30 degrees Fahrenheit, and it took about 24 hours total before the water was heated to an acceptable level and the fish were added back to the tank.. I triple bagged all fish, closed them w/ the room air, and added no additives to the bags. I placed all livestock in a Styrofoam container and packed it tight, filling in any gaps with bags of water (to keep the temp even in there) <very good thinking> I used no heat/cooling packs since I could keep the car nice and warm.. The rock however was frozen when I got to my new home. What's interesting is when i put it in the freezing water (it was already frozen , what could it hurt?) A few snails I must have missed started to crawl about the tank. I must say, I was shocked that they survived such arctic temperatures. < a very pleasant surprise... and while these animals would surely never see such conditions in the wild, many of the tidal species weather similarly dynamic extremes of heat and salinity when the tide is out and/or it rains in shallow pools. Resilient creatures!> My thermom didn't say the temp, but there were ice chunks in a few of the cans I used to store water in.. Also.. there are bits of shredded newspaper all about my tank from covering the rock.. it was damp so it is mixed about the bottom and I've had to clean off my sponge prefilter for the overflow hourly since.. <hehe...trials and tribulations> Will the paper hurt at all? I used the NY times as it's printed w/ non toxic ink (I've used this for my parrot's cage for the same reason.) <unlikely harm... you were going to need to apply heavy carbon/chemical filtration and water changes for the first weeks after the move with or without the newspaper "contamination" anyway> The fish seem happy, alert. The only thing I fear will die is my Platygyra (sp) coral. It has come detached from its skeleton on about 40% of the coral. <indeed a bad sign...quite stressed> Any ideas what I can do to help this? <assuming physical parameters are similar to what had kept it healthy before the move (similar light and water motion)... focus on water quality and do not manipulate the animal. Perhaps apply a small daily iodine dose rather than the sum total amount weekly (antiseptic and RedOx boosting).It seems likely that it may lose significant tissue if it survives. Bt a good job overall on the move!> Thanks so much to Anthony and the rest of the team for the moving advice, it was great to have responses to about 10 emails in an hour, it made the move so much easier. Bill Hammond Re: more help please (moving a system) i just thought i would drop u a line. i moved the tank on Saturday and everything went well thankfully everything survived and all is well in the tank the regal tang looks better now than what he looked like in the guys tank he is almost fully blue again he went white at his house and had been like that for a few months. i would like to say thanks to u for all your help. <You're welcome> the trickle filter was fine and the nitrate, nitrite and ammonia are registering 0 so the filter was fine, i moved everything and got it all set up in less than 6 hours which was hard work for a 100+ imp. gallon tank so i think that helped keep everything down to a minimum. <Wow, that's quick. You must have been quite organized> i am very grateful for your help i don't think i could have done it without u so cheers. also i feel that keeping a lot of the original water helped i kept about 3/4 of it. u can pass this message on if u please as am sure it will help others who have to move their tanks. <Thank you, will do so. Be chatting. Bob Fenner> cheers again Alex Tank Move Hi Bob! As an update, I moved my 115 gallon system on Sunday. I had 5 other people helping--while I was draining water and moving LR and livestock, my helpers were having a cookout on the deck and having a brew or two and coming in to help when needed. No casualties at this point (either my helpers or my livestock). <Good to have help, fun in planned process> I did a full range of water tests last night, as expected, I am getting a small cycle. Ammonia was around 0.2 and nitrite <0.2. Since both of these levels are very low simultaneously, this would suggest to me that I'm not going to have a significant spike, and that the post-moving cycle is almost complete. (I would be much more concerned if I had ammonia at 0.5 and no nitrite. . .) Does this seem like a reasonable interpretation of these readings? <Yes> Nitrate are still testing zero. I've ordered Salifert test kits for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate, as I've never had the nitrates test above zero with my current kit. Since I've got some Cyano bloom right now, that leads me to believe that there must be some nitrates in there, and the Aquarium Systems "FasTest" I'm using isn't giving me true results. <Likely... and various BGA are able to very quickly assimilate nutrient> For the move, I put system water and as much LR as I could fit into 36 gallon Rubbermaid tubs, with heaters and powerheads. Fish livestock went into these tubs. I put the corals in 5 gallon buckets with system water. I didn't have heaters or powerheads for these buckets, but believe it or not, the bubble and moon corals extended fully in the buckets, and the red brain coral was inflated as big as I'd ever seen it. The only specimen that seems to be still "recovering" is the toadstool leather. However, that coral is my tried and true "water tester," being the first to show any signs of stress in response to any deterioration in water quality. It was looking much better this morning, so that leads me to believe that the ammonia and nitrite are quickly being consumed. The purple tang turned lavender during the process, almost a pastel purple. About an hour after he went back into the tank, he regained his full coloration. It's amazing how fish can change color so rapidly in response to stress. A good lesson here. <Indeed> Thought I'd give you a brief update on how things were going. I'm certain now I NEVER want to be in the service business! :) (Although I'm sure it would be a lot less stressful to move someone else's livestock and tank as opposed to your own. . . ) <Still stressful> One other question. I've read several more negative accounts regarding the Rio2100 pumps this week. I purchased the Turboflotor1000 skimmer for the new system, and it came with a Rio 2100. I'd really like to replace that Rio with a Mag 7 and use the Rio just for water changes and mixing salt mix, but the MO outfit that I bought the TF1000 from said that the needle wheel impeller that comes with the skimmer will only fit the Rio pumps. Is that so? <Yes... but there are other pumps, w/ and w/o needle-like impellers that will work> Do you know of a pump that I can use in place of the Rio that the needle wheel impeller will fit? (I posted this to the NG and haven't gotten any responses. . .) <Keep looking... as there are others... including the Mag line and Eheim that folks use...> One other note for you. When I read a message from a "newbie" on the NG who is just getting started and has lots of very broad questions, I've been directing them to your website. And you'll be pleased to know that I have had many replies to those posts from very experienced aquarists to the effect of "Amen to that one." Just thought you'd like to know that your work is respected and appreciated at all levels within the hobby! <Yes, thank you> Hope you're having a good week! James A. Deets <Life to you my friend. Bob Fenner> Marine Tank Disaster! Hello Robert! I've corresponded with you in the past regarding my 55 gallon marine tank. I am very new to the Marine Aquarium Hobby, and after receiving and acting upon your previous advice, my tank was healthy as could be, that is, until, the BIG DISASTER! Please bear with me, as it may be a bit lengthy, but I think that it's a pretty good story. I think it is also pretty inspiring for the new marine aquarist, such as myself. At the end, I'll be looking for anything I could've done differently, if this ever happens again. 11:30pm, the night before I was to leave for the Canary Islands, my husband was playing with our dog, and accidentally threw her bone through the side of our 55 gallon tank. <Wow, that's some toss! Maybe sign him up for tryouts with the Major League? Fifty fives are generally made of 3/8 or 1/2" plate glass.> Baseball sized hole, about 5 inches from the bottom - you can guess how fast the water emptied out! <Very quickly, or for Mac/Apple types, "very quick"> Once the water drained below the hole, it was seeping out slowly through cracks, and I had to decide what to do. I had 1 blue damsel, 3 fire fish, and 1 red pencil anemone in my tank, and all were still inside. Against all advice, I had not yet set up a nursing tank, but I had a spare 30 gallon sitting in my workshop. <Ahh, very fortuitous> I had my husband pull out the fish and put them in a large plastic bowl filled with water remaining in the tank. I cleaned the 30 gallon as best as I could (it once housed Oscars), salvaged all of the rock, decor from the 55 gallon and loaded it into the 30 gallon, salvaged about 5 gallons of water from it, and a small amount of substrate that was "glass free". I then filled the rest of the 30 gallon tank with distilled water and well water, added Tap Water Conditioner, BioZyme, StressCoat, Stresszyme, pH 8.2, salt to Specific Gravity of 1.023, and dropped in my Fluval Filter. I added my heater and brought the temperature up to 78, the released the fish. The next day, I fed them and left for vacation. The surprise if it is, after 9 days of my not being there, ALL OF THE FISH LIVED! My biggest problem at this point is that the water got cloudy from feeding pyramids which I had put in (never again will I use them, I've bought an automatic feeder). <Very good...> So, I've now purchased a new 55 gallon tank, am in the process of setting it up, and am about to move my fish out of their temporary housing. Though all worked out well for me, I'm pretty sure that it was 99% luck that caused it. Other than keeping a nursing tank (which my 30 gallon will now become), what should I have done differently? <Shades of Deuce Bigelow (one of my fave films natch)... Nothing comes to mind...> Thankfully, the Fluval filters are, essentially, portable biological filters, so that helped, but I'm sure that I missed a few things on this. Any advice you could give would be wonderful. Both you and your publications have been a great source of assistance to me during my introduction to marine aquarium keeping. Thanks again! Deborah H. Colella <Thank you for your relating this debacle and triumph... Obviously, your livestock were in good shape and your system well maintained before the "bone toss" incident (another Anne Rice title?), and all's well that ends well. You may quote me. Bob Fenner, who will post your amazing tale on the www.WetWebMedia.com site for others edification> |
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