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Red Sea Biotope Questions 10/8/09
Howdy Ladies and Gents.
<Hello Erik!>
My 135gal Red Sea biotope is coming along nicely. I have 0 ammonia, 0
nitrite, less than 10 nitrate, calcium around 400, and ph 8.3. I have
several questions. Seems like they never stop.
Stocking
- I have 5 Chromis viridis - doing well
- 10 hermits
- 4 turbo
- 10 other small snails
- Coral - Paly's, Duncanopsammia axifuga, poly coral, Xenia, long
tentacle plate, Zoa's, Tubastrea aurea
Looking to add additional fish over the next 6 months (in order)
1. Lawnmower Blenny (pretty quick to take care of hair algae)
2. Flavissimus
<Forcipiger I'll take it>
3. Semilarvatus
<One... better by far in pairs... if one has the room>
4. 2 Bictinus Clownfish
<Bicinctus>
5. Long Nosed Hawkfish
6. Six-Lined Wrasse (is this fish too aggressive for this tank?)
7. Zebrasoma xanthurus
8. Genicanthus caudovittatus
Do you think these fish are all compatible? Would this be overstocked?
Should I let the corals grow for a few months before stocking the fish?
<Yes, no, and I would>
I am also having a large amount of red carpet algae, not slimy, but
hairy on the coral sand. Should this be removed as part of nutrient
export? Not sure where it is getting its nutrients as I use RO water. It
has stopped growing, so maybe it used what nutrients were in the system
and ran out.
<Likely so times two>
Thanks for all the help.
Erik C. Hayes
<Thank you for sharing. Bob Fenner>
Re: compatibility (RMF, second opinion on Zebrasoma
xanthurum/Pygoplites diacanthus compat.) 7/6/09
Thank you for your quick response!!
<Happy to help.>
Instead of the trigger do you think that I could add a Regal Angelfish
from the Red Sea?
<Assuming you can get a Red Sea specimen -- a major challenge in itself
-- then this would be quite a good choice, though your tank is, in my
opinion, at the low end of what's viable for non-dwarf Angels.
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marine/fishes/angels/pygoplites/
I do wonder if Zebrasoma xanthurum might be just similar enough in
colouration the two species might not get along? It's the blue body and
yellow tail that worries me. Introduce the Tang first, and then the
Angel, and keep an eye on them.
Cheers, Neale.>
<<S/b okay if there is sufficient psychological space/room. RMF>>
Re: compatibility (RMF,
second opinion on Zebrasoma xanthurum/Pygoplites diacanthus compat.)
Hi Bob,
Thanks for your comment on the query; in this case, the tank was 90
gallons I think, which to me (as a very limited marine aquarist!) seems
at the low end of what a non-dwarf pomacanthid is likely to "share
nicely" with something else. Am I being overly cautious here?
Cheers, Neale
<This is way too small for just a Pygoplites itself... Even though
specimens from the Red Sea are exemplary (relative to the species
elsewhere), this would be too limiting a world. Cheers, BobF>
Re: compatibility (RMF,
second opinion on Zebrasoma xanthurum/Pygoplites diacanthus compat.)
7/7/09
Looks like I will wait a while and save for an upgrade. What would be
the recommended aquarium size for a Regal Angel from the Red Sea? I read
over the FAQ's on the Regal Angel and it said was a minimum 4 feet when
young.
Since I am going to save for the upgrade
<And at least six foot long as an adult... eight plus is better... A few
hundred gallons>
What size would you suggest for an Emperor with a Regal? Or am I just
getting greedy here?
<See WWM re the Pomacanthus>
Thanks for your patience with all my questions!
<And you for your interest, reading. BobF>
Red Sea Books 2/209
Hi Crew hope you are all spiffingly well
today, we have snow here in England!
<Brrrr! And it's so cold here in
S. Cal., I've had to put on a long-sleeve tee!>
After perusing your
biotope pages, I have decided to design a Red Sea biotope aquarium for
my next project and would like some advice on which book/s I should
purchase to help me. There are three that I have found, Debelius, Myers
and Harrison. I am happy with the fishes (which ones are and are not
available to me) but what I really need is a book that has lots of
detailed descriptions and pictures of the corals and landscapes so that
I can plan my aquascape/ biota. Which of these would be the best for
that and are there any other books available that might be of help as
well?
Thanks very much,
Simon Trippick
<Mmm, yes... I have a
few ed.s of Helmut Debelius Dive/Reef Guide for the Red Sea... I further
suggest Peter Vine's work on Red Sea Invertebrates and John Randall's
"Red Sea Fishes"... And a go at the Net... reading, saving sites that
show substantial depth in writing, images... to gain ideas, insight. Oh,
and also writing us back re your plans, discoveries.. for inter-rator
discussion and agreement. Bob Fenner>
Re: Red Sea Books/ habitat 2/3/09
Thanks a lot Bob
I'll look those up. England has ground to a halt today because of a
minute amount of snow falling on the ground. The miracles of modern
living!
<Ah yes... have heard re the snow there... Friend/roommate
Peter (of the last 15 years) mum's couldn't get out her door in York>
Thanks for your offer of 'crew' help with this, I already have some
preliminary plans that I've put on a spreadsheet, and have listed the
basics below (I've just looked back through this message and even the
'basics' require a lot of typing, sorry!). I'd appreciate your thoughts,
The tank is 10ft x 5ft x 2.5ft (about 800g).
<Neat! In fact... a
further offer/encouragement for you to "get out there", visit the Red
Sea... Is a literal hop-skip from the U.K., with fab deals for
travel/stay/diving on offer... You are welcome to haul out with us
even... I have gone every other year to more frequently to the Sinai and
further down for the last 28 years... Usually in May...>
The biotope
I am looking at is a (sandy?) reef slope habitat dominated by a couple
of islands of tabletop Acropora, plating and encrusting Montipora,
Pocillipora, Seriatopora, etc. perhaps with some Xeniids lower down.
<Ah yes! I can visualize this as well. You may be familiar with my
effort at writing/posting a "version" of dividing most-commonly
encountered life per general habitat on WWM... and sending same to
friend Helmut Debelius for his consideration...>
I have attached a
word doc with photo that I have found on the net of the sort of thing I
am looking at for my structures, (this probably has copyright on by the
way).
<Will read, not post. Perhaps you could provide the URL where
you found this for others perusal in future>
I will be also looking
at these more 'brownish' colours on the corals as well, as this
represents what I have seen myself on dives and seems a more natural
looking scene. This will also highlight the fishes as the focal points.
I am hoping to incorporate some of my existing corals as well -
Turbinaria, Goniopora, Plerogyra, Rugosa, Pavona. This is where my
questions are. Which of these would fit into this biotope and how?
<Ahh! Have you read here:
http://wetwebmedia.com/marine/setup/marsetupindex1.htm
the second to
last lines... Particularly here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/rsbiotopes.htm
and the linked files in the
series?>
I have already resigned myself to giving away a lot of my
present 'reef garden'. This is why I need the book/s.
<I see... and
agree with your direction, sensibilities here>
Fish-wise my list is:
Angels:
1 x Emperor Angelfish - I already have this fish (he's from
the Red Sea), he will be the central character
1 x Pygoplites
Diacanthus Butterfly(flie?)s:
3? (2?) x Addis Butterfly fish - I'm
not sure how many, I'd like at least a pair, but would love three.
<Mmm... I'd stick with the two>
1 x Chaetodon Fasciatus - I already
have this fish and he eats Aiptasia, but will he get on with the
Semilarvatus?
<Yes, enough room here for all>
Rabbitfish/ Tangs:
1 X Z. Xanthurum
1 x Paracanthurus Hepatus - The odd one out - My
wife flatly refuses to let our 'Dory' go anywhere!
<I see>
1 X
Acanthurus Nigrofuscus
1 x Rabbitfish (I have yet to decide on this -
I need something that eats Bryopsis and have not found it yet.
<Look
to Siganus stellatus... not a great beauty, more subtle... but greatly
desirous as a pest algae consumer>
I may have to compromise and go
for something not from the Red Sea to get the Bryopsis eater I need. I'm
considering Diadema's as a possible alternative, but I'm worried about
compatibility with the fishes)
<Not much of a worry>
1 x
Melichthys Indicus Triggerfish - I already have this fish
2? (3?) x
Radiata Lions - I have one of these already.
2 x Zebra Morays - I
already have one of these.
<Mmm, also non-indigenous>
I'm
wondering if I am overstocked here.
<Mmm, no. Assuredly not>
I
intend to double at least the water volume of the main system with
multiple refugiums in a back room/ garage set up, so I'm happy I can
support these animals water quality wise. What I am most worried about
is the maximum sizes of these fish. Obviously I need to be careful with
fish sizes, as fish that are too small will end up as meals for the
Lions, but I want to stay away from 18-inchers, and after watching
first-hand in the Red Sea, I believe that even a tank this size is
really too small for active fish like Sohal/ Lituratus.
<Mmm... am
so sorely tempted... If it were me, mine, I'd likely add some Naso
lituratus here (along with Jake Adams' circulation designs with Vortech
gear for such shape, length systems as yours)... but leave out the
Acanthurus... too likely to have territorial issues>
I want the fish
to be comfortable into old age so don't mind losing a couple from the
list, and would probably sacrifice the other two tangs over the rest if
I had to. What would you do?
<Add the nominatives of Publius Ovidius
(Naso)... Will be spectacular in their movement, color, expressed joy in
your setting... particularly as I state, with the circulation proposed.
Am going to BCC JakeA here... in the hopes he has his circulation input
posted/linked on the Net for further referral>
On a similar note to
the previous one (books), I have been trying to procure a copy of Fossa/
Nilsens 'The most beautiful aquariums in the world' as this tank will be
an on-site build, and the aesthetics in the lounge is what my wife is
most interested in! The book is out of stock everywhere I try, and there
don't seem to be any plans for people to
re-stock. Have you any idea
where I might get a copy?
<Mmm. Amazon.com.uk has three:
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss_b?url=search-alias%3Dstripbooks&field-keywords=svein+fossa>
I have Paletta's (Ultimate aquariums) but this does not show the
aquariums in their surroundings, if you get my meaning.
<I do>
Thanks again,
Simon Trippick
<Do send along notes of your
progress Simon. Bob Fenner>
Re: Red Sea Books/ habitat... Jake Adams... circ. input 2/3/09
Thanks Bob,
<Welcome Simon>
So I'll stick to two Semilarvatus,
and go with three Radiata Lions (spectacular!).
<Ah yes>
I had to
Google 'Publius Ovidius' - it seems he was a roman poet of love!
<Yes... Ovid penned "The Amores"...>
Are you trying to tell me that
you are in love with the Naso Lituratus?
<Heee! Not quite... just an
archaic note re the genus of Tangs name and this Roman man of letters
prominent nose-naming>
If I swapped a Naso Lituratus for the A.
Nigrofuscus would he grow to the full 18 inches in this sized system?
<Not quite... and this would take a few years... again... my personal
choosing>
I was under the impression from your FAQ that Zebra morays
could be found in the red sea -
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/redseafwgv1.htm 'The Zebra Moray,
Gymnomuraena zebra (1) and Snowflake Moray, Echidna nebulosa (1), are
more crustacean than fish eaters, having crushing knob-like teeth.
Another Pebblemouth Moray of many common names, Banded, Ringed or
Barred, E. polyzona (1), is occasionally caught in the R.S. as well. The
last two stay small, about 2', but the Zebra can get large (up to 5')'.
Fishbase
also shows it occurring although not frequently.
http://www.aquamaps.org/receive.php
<Echidna polyzona yes, but not
Gymnomuraena... I have never seen it there>
We were actually planning
to holiday in Egypt this year round, probably Sharm, and would love to
take up your invitation,
<Certainly!>
should you be going at a
similar time! Please let me know if you plan anything concrete and I'll
see if I can get it past Bomber Command! Be warned we are both novice
divers however, having only a couple of dives after passing our Open
Water, so you might want to renege on the invite!
Cheers,
Simon
Trippick
<Will be a fabulous time for you both... Do plan on
ignoring the boorishness of the too-common "Russkies" there nowadays.
Cheers, BobF> Re:
Red Sea Books/ habitat... Jake Adams... circ. input 2/5/09
Hi Bob,
<Simon>
Snowflake Morays are also listed in your FAQ as
coming from the Red Sea - would you suggest that I swap the pair of
Zebras out for a pair of Snowflakes instead for this Biotope?
<Mmm,
no...>
The trip to Egypt has been sanctioned by the way! It was the
possibility of seeing either/ or Whale Sharks/ Mantas that did the
trick!
Cheers,
Simon Trippick
<Heeee! Have been quite a few
times, never seen these there... Shhhh!
BobF>
Re: Red Sea Books/ habitat...
Jake Adams... circ. input 3/21/08
Hi Bob,
<Simon>
Still at work and still a little bored.
<Just "having" a job would be exciting it seems to me>
It's Saturday morning you see, and not much going on! I took your advice
on the Red Sea books and purchased the Peter Vine one and the Debelius
one.
I am particularly pleased with the Peter Vine one, this is a great book
and has a few fantastic pictures of the landscapes and coral placements
with regards to each other. In fact two of the pictures I am going to
use to design my aquascape. One shows green Turbinaria reniformis
growing together with Seriatopora hystrix on a boulder-like structure -
Both of these are corals that I already own, so this one I'm going to
start on right away in my existing tank!
<Nice>
The second shows a canyon-type environment with Hystrix, Porites,
Goniopora, (also corals I already own) with an essential tabletop
Acropora at the top - just what I was looking for, so thanks for the
recommendation!
<Welcome... I have this work as well. The taxonomy is a bit wanky, but
as you say, the work has many "hidden" uses>
I am definitely sticking to the Red Sea Biotope theme for the corals and
aquascape. For the fishes, I have to use a little 'artistic' license
with 'Dory' anyway, and I have come to the conclusion that it is not
right for me to take back fishes that I have had for a while and that
are very happy to replace them with others just because they do not
'fit' into an idealized 'dream'. Any new purchases that I make I will
try to get Red Sea species if I can, and not get too hung up on the
fishes I already have.
<Okay... look to special ordering...>
I never heard from Jake Adams,
<Mmm, I will see him in a couple of weeks at MAX... ask re his
articles... did you check through CORALIdea (.com)? I don't see his
articles posted there...>
but I will be using Vortechs on this system - I already own one, and
despite the expense, they are definitely worth it. I will use them to
create the 'wave', and I will probably utilise some kind of DIY flush
device as well (possibly the Borneman one). I have heard of these being
used in conjunction with ATS's, so I might incorporate that. Any
thoughts on this/ these?
<Are workable>
The Naso lituratus is a definite now by the way, If you're not in love
with this fish I think I am (Shhhh.. Don't tell the wife!)
<Are great attractions, given adequate circumstances. Cheers, BobF>
Simon
Re: Red Sea Books/ habitat...
Jake Adams... circ. Input/ now 3/23/09
Blundell
Hi Bob,
<Simon>
I have checked on CORALIdea and there are FAQs on corals, but nothing
else.
<Do check out SaraM's ASIRA.com as well>
Water flow wise, though, I have been using Blundell's articles on
Advanced Aquarist: http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2008/1/lines which I
thought were excellent, and It was the reviews of the Vortech on there
that persuaded me to purchase one.
Cheers,
Simon Trippick
<Ahh! BobF>
G. zebra, Red Sea Books/ habitat... Jake Adams... circ. input
Gymnomuraena zebra does indeed occur in the Red Sea. 2/5/09
The first reports are by Klunzinger (1871) from Quseir, then Fowler
(1945) from the Sudan coast and Clark et al. (1966) from Dahlak. Another
specimen I know of is from Ras Muhammad, Sinai and was confirmed by
Randall and Golani in 1995. The USNM also has two from the Red Sea.
Cheers. Marco.
<Well I'll be. Thank you for this Marco. Bob Fenner,
who has never seen this species in the Gulf of Aqaba... but...>
Red Sea Butterfly Biotope ~ 01/12/09
Good afternoon.
<<Greetings>>
I have been diligently reading and enjoying your site
for several months.
<<Ah! Excellent…>>
I have owned aquariums for
30+ years,
<<Me too!>>
but have recently decided to get into
saltwater.
<<Ah well, got ya there…[grin] I set up my first SW tank
in 1977… My first reef tank in 1989… You’re gonna LOVE saltwater…>>
I
want to create a specific biotope
<<Best way to go…>>
from the Red
Sea,
<<If you haven’t already, do check out these links:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/rsbiotopes.htm
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/redseafwgv1.htm >>
primarily with
butterflies.
<<And this one: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/bstbfsrs.htm
>>
This tank will be a FOWLR or at least I believe it will be.
<<Indeed… Butterflies are not good candidates for a reef system>>
I
have been told, but have yet to confirm, that a good butterfly tank
should have a fairly large amount of live corals to keep the fish
healthy.
<<That depends…and isn’t really practical in most
hobbyist-size systems. If the species in question are obligate
corallivores you won’t be able to provide what they need to keep them
healthy/alive, regardless>>
The information I received is that the
types of butterflies I want to place in the tank will only nip at the
corals and consume the liquid which is excreted by the damaged coral.
<<Mmm, no… These fishes will consume coral polyps/flesh>>
I plan on
having 1 Raccoon, 3 Banner, and 1 Semilarvatus.
<<All excellent
choices for captive care>>
The tank is a 135 with a sump.
<<Hmm… I
think “ultimately” this will be too small for this mix. These are not
“small” fishes. The Banners have the potential to reach 8-inches, with
the Raccoon and Semilarvatus going for a couple more. If nothing else,
there will likely be social/aggression issues…sooner or later>>
Live
rock will be around 100lbs. There are two large Protein skimmers built
into the sump and a DSB. Do you have any experience which supports the
claim that the fish need to consume this liquid from the coral to be at
their best health?
<<Have never heard such… But have certainly seen
and heard of them consuming coral polyps/flesh>>
If so, can you tell
me the best types of corals for this purpose?
<<Some species can be
very specific as to which corals they will dine upon while others will
eat most any they come across. But what you propose is not necessary (or
practical) with the fish choices listed here. Fortunately, the species
you have chosen most always take well to prepared foods. And even if you
could afford to keep up a ready supply of “food” corals, the money would
be better spent on a larger tank/system here>>
Will the fish
ultimately kill the coral?
<<In the confines of a home aquarium, yes…
If the fish take to the coral as food, they will generally consume all,
or at least to the point of the coral’s demise>>
Another question has
arisen during my planning of the tank. I plan on keeping the tank at a
higher salinity, due to the regional requirements of the biotope.
<<That’s fine… And unless endemics, do also ensure your fish come from
that region>>
However, recently I have been reading the benefits of
Hypersaline for initial fish introduction and other benefits.
<<Hmm,
I think you mean the other way around…Hyposalinity. And in my opinion
not to be used on a continuous basis for the unnatural state/induced
stresses re. Best to simply provide a pH adjusted freshwater dip and
then quarantine at NSW levels>>
Could I start the tank in this mode,
then slowly move to the appropriate salinity, or is it better to start
these fish at the Red Sea salinity level?
<<The latter, for sure>>
Thank you so much for your assistance.
Erik
<<Happy to share.
EricR>> Asfur Size
question, and comp. 10/1/08
Hello,
<Mornin'
Ross>
I've enjoyed your site for several years now. I have a question
that seems simple, but I've had a hard time finding answers in the
literature.
I have an Asfur Angel. He's been in my one year old
fish-only, resin insert 500 gal tank (+180 gal sump with AquaC EV1000)
since the start. He survived the Ich that killed a lot of his friends.
He's bossy, but tolerated 2 other angels (a smaller Asfur and a
Majestic), before the ich got them. The tank is stable now that I've
gotten a temperature controller. He shares it with 3 chromis, 2 fairy
wrasses, a Lyretail Anthias, Lawnmower Blenny, and 2 Heniochus
Butterflies. It's pretty empty for a tank that size.
<I can imagine>
My question: How big will he get? He has grown from 6" when I got him to
9" now. The books say he can hit 15", but I have searched everywhere for
an aquarium reference. No one seems to really know how big he'll get in
the
aquarium.
<Mmm, can make a good guess... would grow to an
overall length of 15" or so over a number of years, but will be slower
as time goes by... Likely an inch or so a year till about a foot... then
more like half an inch more in successive years>
The reason I ask, is
I am considering adding fish now that the tank is stable. I am curious
about a queen angel.
<Mmm, I would look to other families of fishes
other than Pomacanthids... perhaps a leaning toward a biotopic
arrangement (other Red Sea life)... Do give a look here:
http://wetwebmedia.com/redseafwgv1.htm
and the linked files above...
I'd be asking about for some of the species of Wrasses, Tangs... found
here>
I am interested to hear what you think.
Ross Kaplan
<You
have. Bob Fenner> Re:
Asfur Size question 10/5/08
Bob
Thank your for your
response. I looked at the link, and really appreciate your suggestion.
It wasn't my plan, but now I think setting up as a "Red Sea Tank" is a
great idea! My own dives in the Red Sea were fantastic. I remember
seeing schools of Anthias surrounding us. I have been reading your link
with great interest.
<Ahh! Am sure we could share many anecdotes re
visits there>
If I go with all Red Sea endemics, should I raise the
salinity slightly? Lower the temp? (currently 1.020, and avg. 80F)?
Ross
<I would raise the spg, at least to 1.025-6, the temp. I'd leave
as is. It's actually cooler than this almost year round in the Red Sea.
Bob Fenner>
Red Sea aquarium fish selection – 06/28/08
I'm thinking I'd
like to go with a Red Sea aquarium, basically having only fish from
the Red Sea. Could you please let me know if these are compatible?
I've read and read and read WWM but I'd like one final opinion on
this stocking plan.
<Ok>
Every fish will be fresh water dipped
and then placed in quarantine for a month before placement into the
main tank. Quick side question, should I fresh water dip going from
the quarantine to the main tank after the month?
<On the way into
quarantine>
I thought the idea was all the time in the quarantine
is where you make sure there are no signs of disease or any other
problems, so what would be the point of a second fresh water dip.
However, I've seen posted on WWM a couple times now that dipping
after quarantine isn't a bad idea... and others have said no need
for it. So what is your opinion on the subject :)
<Can be done...
usually superfluous as you state to do the second>
180g tank,
6x2x2. One 250w metal halide pendant over the left side of the tank.
Right side will be left "dark" so to speak, as a calmer, more hidden
side of the tank. Obviously it will have plenty of light shining
over there too, but no direct light shining straight down on it. I
figure the fish can have a little calm spot over there if needed and
I'll put more caves on that side of the tank in the rock. A 75g tank
underneath being used as a sump, about 35-40g worth of water inside
and probably 50 lbs of live rock and a 8" deep DSB about 18" wide by
18" long. Gracilaria and Chaeto in the sump. 10% water changes once
a week.
1200gph flow through the sump, 4 Koralia pumps in the
main tank, two number 3 Koralia and two number 4, so should be some
decent turbulent water. With 1200 gph return from the sump and about
4200 gph flow from the Koralia, I should be turning over the tank
volume about 25 times an hour.
<So far, so good>
First, two
Semilarvatus B/F will be going into the tank.
Second, a Raccoon
butterfly.
Third, a Harlequin tusk. (I know, not Red Sea, right?
<Correct>
Is there a similar looking/attitude species of fish
from the Red Sea that would replace the
Harlequin?)
<Oh yes...
quite a few... Do look on fishbase.org, search re country... maybe
Jordan, Egypt, Sudan... the Cheilinus genus... or on WWM>
Fourth,
a Purple tang.
Fifth, an Imperator angel.
<Mmm, this last
will need more room in time>
This would make a total of 6 fish. I
realize that this is stretching it for amount of water per fish when
they all reach their adult size, but I figure most of them I'll have
3-4 years before they hit their adult max size and by then I'll be
using my 180 as a sump to my 400 gallon tank ;)
<Oh!>
I
wouldn't mind some type of Red Sea smaller fish if you have
something you think would look good in this display.
<Got to
be... Pseudanthias squamipinnis... the definitive reef fish of the
slope here>
All of the fish I've picked out get 10" or over, so a
couple skinnier little fish might not be a bad thing, some kind of
wrasse or something. I could always do the chromis which I believe
come from the Red Sea but eh, I'd rather have something else as I've
always had chromis in all my tanks.
Any ideas are welcome :)
Grant
<You've seen this: http://wetwebmedia.com/redseafwgv1.htm
and the linked files above? Bob Fenner>
Re: Red Sea aquarium fish selection 6/30/08
Yes, I've
read through your FAQs on Anthias. I actually had 3 Pseudanthias
squamipinnis in a 75g before, and as happens to everyone else before
me and the thousands to come after me, one died, then another, and I
was left with just one. The male did really well though, I kept him
alive in my reef tank for 2 years, beautiful specimen but I
eventually traded him to a local hobbyist.
<I see>
Anyway, I'm
reluctant to go the Anthiine route... I've read too many horror
stories and experienced a small part of it myself. They are beauties
and I know what ecotype they are in the wild but I just think they
aren't really "my thing" so to speak.
<Ok>
I did read your
webpage you linked to about the Red Sea and the fishes within, I
have looked over it a couple times over the past month. I researched
goatfishes after reading it, I was thinking of maybe adding one of
those to my fish selection. I wanted some small type of sand sifter
but a goatfish is a little more interesting to me. Parupeneus
cyclostomus looked interesting, but it gets to a foot and a half...
that is a little bigger than I want in a fish.
<Not near this
large in captivity by half...>
I also like the six line wrasse,
but I'm a little worried it might pick on my butterflies... what do
you think about that?
<Not likely in this sized volume>
So
maybe I'm going to go with two Bluethroat triggerfish from the Red
Sea... I've liked them for years and just never really found a way
to work them into a tank. But I think they would do pretty good with
my present stocking plans.
<Me too>
My last question then is
if you approve of my modified stocking plan :)
First, two
Semilarvatus butterfly.
Second, a Raccoon butterfly (would I be
able to get away with 2 of these in a 180g or should I just stick
with 1?)
<Could have two... but C. fasciatus is fine solo>
Third, two blue throat triggers, definitely a pair. Quick side
question, are these born male/female or are they able to change sex?
If they can change sex, then do I just buy two 3" triggers and hope
only one of them decides to be male?
<Balistids don't
reverse/change sex as far as I'm aware>
Fourth, a Purple tang.
Fifth, an Imperator angel.
Somewhere in there, if you replied
that a 6 line wrasse was appropriate, I'd throw one of them in
there. Maybe 2?
<Okay>
Thanks for all you do, Bob. I've got
your CMA book, I just bought it about 2 months ago when I started
deciding to move from reef to FOWLR, it's been a great read. Between
the book and WWM, I feel like I'm a expert ;) I certainly know more
than most of the people at the LFS.
<Ahh, then I hope/trust you
are helping them. Cheers, BobF>
Re: Red Sea aquarium fish selection... Trigger names, Id... Goatfish
sys., - 7/2/08
I'm glad you agreed on the Blue Throat trigger idea, I think they
are cool fish. Quick question for you though, I read on WWM that
they are endemic to the Red Sea, yet sites like LiveAquaria sell
them from Hawaii. What's up with that? No need to get too technical,
I'm just curious, I want to make sure I purchase the correct
version.
<Mmm, there are two species... of different
distribution... with the same name. See here:
http://wetwebmedia.com/marine/fishes/triggers/index.htm
The
Sufflamen is the one you're looking for... from the Red Sea, western
Indian Ocean... the Xanthichthys is the Pacific... including the
Hawaiian Isles. An ex. of the difficulty, lack of clarity of common
appellations>
The goatfish I mentioned, I'm glad you replied back
positively about it, I'm looking forward to having one. Curious
though, will they be ok in about a 1 inch crushed coral substrate?
<Mmm, I encourage you to not use this type, size, depth of material
period... For the system and the mullid, look to very fine/soft
coral sand... and read re on WWM>
I don't want the real small
particle stuff because I'm afraid my water will just be too cloudy,
<Mmm, not so...>
I was thinking the next size up, the stuff that
cant really float around in the water, but not much bigger than
regular sand. If this is totally inappropriate for a goatfish I'll
probably just stick to the small sand, I'd like to do whatever I can
that will get me away from having to manually stir the sand myself
from time to time.
Quick question for you that I just want your
opinion on... regarding metal halides lighting. I'm planning on
going with a 250w 13K MegaChrome Marine, double ended metal halide.
But the more and more I read about Kelvin ratings, the more unsure I
get of what I want... Basically, what lighting temperature do you
feel looks best for a FOWLR?
<Mmm... for the Red Sea? A dear
friend, Pablo Tepoot, of New Life Enterprises, asked me for images
to make his spectacular photo montage that he has for his trade
display booth as well as a large wall in his Homestead, FLA home...
For the color of the water... Something in the 10-14k K range is
about right>
If you recall, I'm going to have 3 or so bright
yellow B/F but also a Purple tang and a Emperor angel, both of which
are not yellow and much darker, I'd like their colors to stand out
as well. I've been reading that you want low Kelvin ratings for
making yellow stand out and high Kelvin rating to make the blues
stand out, however, I'm just planning on one MH with no other light
supplementation, so what would in your opinion be the best lighting
to go with? I realize this is a topic for much debate, I'm just
looking for your personal opinion on it.
<Understood>
This is
the light I'm speaking of, by the way.
http://www.marinedepot.com/ps_ViewItem~action~view~
idProduct~MB6612~idCategory~FILTBUMHDETW~category~Saltwater_Aquarium_Supplies-
Lighting-Bulbs-Metal_Halide-Double_Ended-250_Watts~vendor~.html
<I see>
So I just finished The CMA tonight, one of the other
books I ordered was Reef Invertebrates by you and Calfo, I'll be
starting that tonight. I'm especially interested in the part
dedicated to refugiums.
<Heeee! The original idea for the work
was to promote others success in our hobby interest by encouraging
the use of these live sumps... I told Anthony (Calfo) that we'd
never sell the work with this as the focus or... title (!)... so we
settled on Reef Invertebrates (sans Cnidarians which we intend/ed to
make another volume)... but did manage to sneak in about a quarter
of the work as Refugiums... You will enjoy, gain by its reading.
Cheers, Bob Fenner>
Re: Red Sea aquarium fish selection 7/3/08
Ah good,
thanks for the clarity on the triggers. So I want the Sufflamen
albicaudatus, which stinks because I'm having a real hard time
finding one online for sale.
<Place a standing order with larger
etailers and have your LFS do the same with the larger marine
livestock wholesale/importers. These do come in...>
I only found
one site that offers it and they are out of stock + they say it is a
rare hard to find fish.
<All a matter of parties asking... being
patient... cooperating>
Local dealers are touch and go up here in
Alaska, I'm sure if I cant find it online they wont be able to get
it in. Are they typically a seasonal offering or are they really
just a rare fish?
<Just rare to the "west" due to distance, air
freight connections.... and a lack of ongoing, concerted dealings>
I read through your FAQs on the species and no one else seemed to
mention much of a hard time finding them. They also aren't very
expensive, making me think they aren't really that rare of a fish.
<Ship very well, in not-too-large a volume of water, air (very
important)... The "handling and shipping" are the bulk of cost...
not the fish>
Alright, I'll go with the fine soft coral sand, I
really hope it isn't
going to make my tank perma cloudy.
<Won't; I assure you>
I have a signal goby in my 75g reef tank
and he continuously stirs my fine sand, always making a small hazy
cloud around him of coral dust, which then settles down elsewhere
and gets kicked up again later. I was trying not to replicate this
in my main tank.
<Look to "other brand"... perhaps CaribSea...>
Yes, I will have good filtration which slowly helps remove those
fine particles, but it takes a long time it seems to get the dust
out of the system. Between the sand itself dissolving and getting
smaller in particle size and the already small state of even the
biggest pieces, it seems like my signal goby never ran out of dust
like particles to cloud the water with.
I'm going to go ahead and
try that 13K MH light and see what it does. If I don't like it, in a
year when I replace it I'll get a lower Kelvin rating one I suppose.
Quick side question on the lighting, one of the main reasons I'm
placing that much light on a FOWLR is I want some natural algae
growth for the Purple tang, nothing huge and gaudy but I'm hoping
for just the small greenish tint that the tang can continually
scrape over. Is a 13K light good for algae growth or would I be
better suited going towards the 10K?
<Either is fine>
Another
quick question for you... Suppose I was going to skip the butterfly
fish entirely and the seemingly hard to find Sufflamen, and instead
go with a Purple tang, a Queen or Emperor angel and a Clown
trigger...
<... I'd skip the Queen and the Clown...>
Do you
think those 3 fish would be compatible long term in a 180g?
<No>
Considering I get a "nice" clown trigger, not one of the hellions?
I do like the B/F I listed, but at the same time I've read so much
great stuff about personality and just a huge "coolness" factor of
the Clown trigger that I'd almost rather go with just 3 larger size
fish than original stocking plan I had.
<... not from the Red
Sea>
I realize this would no longer be a Red Sea fish tank, but
I'm OK with that as long as the fish I do get are lively with lots
of personality. I've read a lot of your FAQs and your article on the
Clown, which by the way seem somewhat contradictory. The article
says keep the Clown in a tank only to itself, the FAQs all say it
does OK with aggressive angels and tangs.
<A matter of timing
mostly... eventually... almost all Clown Triggers "go bad">
Is
this simply a case of "best care scenario" would be to keep it by
itself, but since people are already writing in saying they have a
Clown trigger mixed in with other fish, you say fine but just make
sure they are also aggressive fish? And would you suggest a Queen
angel or a Emperor angel in a Clown trigger tank?
<... no>
Thanks for all you do. I read only 4 pages of Reef Invertebrates
last night before dropping off to sleep but I plan on getting in
some good reading tonight :)
Grant
<You are going about this
in a very good manner... Do keep reading, cogitating furiously for
now... Bob Fenner>
Re: Red Sea aquarium fish selection... 7/4/08
Well hopefully I can find two of the triggers. As I'm sure you've
seen, Marine Center is out of service for the moment, so that really
only leaves me LiveAquaria, a lot of the other places don't like to
ship to Alaska, heh. From what I've read on WWM and other sites,
these triggers can actually be paired up as long as you get
male/female, correct?
<... yes>
Sadly, most of my research was
on the Hawaiian version of the blue throat and there doesn't seem to
be a lot of information on the Red Sea endemic version, so I'm
hoping the two are pretty similar as far as attitude and needs go. I
really would prefer a pair of triggers to just one. And man, the
male Sufflamen albicaudatus is a beautiful fish, from the pictures
I've seen they are a really nice looking fish. Dark body scales make
that blue throat stand out nicely.
After reading lots on the
clown trigger, I really would like one. They seem like such a great
personality, I just wish they mixed better with other fish. I'd love
to have a "smart" fish, and yeah from what I hear all the triggers
are rather intelligent as far as fish go, but the clown seems to be
THE smart fish. I wouldn't mind only having one fish in a 180g tank
as long as it got large like the clown does, however the "boring"
part for me would be when it's 3 inches long and the only fish in
the tank.
As far as cogitating furiously goes, that pretty much
describes the last month or two of my life. All my spare time is
taken up by trying to decide exactly what I'm going to do
beforehand. See, I've had reef tanks in the past but they were
always a hodge podge (I have no clue how to spell that) that I just
slowly got together, I didn't really put them up "correctly". I'd
buy a part, then buy another part later that kind of worked, then
another part later that also kind of worked, and it just all kind of
worked together but nothing too well. This one I'm going to make as
perfect as I can at the beginning and not have to keep trying to get
a system limping along. I'm actually pretty much set on my hardware,
the only thing now I've got to hash out is my fish stocking.
So
hopefully this is the last thing I have to write in about... Those
triggers from the Red Sea I'm looking at, at what point of my
stocking should they be put in?
<Any time>
I was planning
doing the 3 butterfly fish first, then the triggers and a goatfish,
then the purple tang and emperor angel. Three separate instances of
introducing a total of 8 fish, and I have 2 separate quarantine
tanks so I wont have to mix any fish in quarantine except the two
Semilarvatus will be in a 30g quarantine together, otherwise they
will all be in their own tanks. Sound good?
Grant
<Indeed it
does. B> Re: Red Sea
aquarium fish selection... dips/baths 7/7/08
This
might be something you want to reference on your web page somewhere
or just store away in your mind for future use, but I was in contact
with All-Glass or Aqueon or whatever they are now calling
themselves, a dry 180g aquarium weights 282 lbs and a dry 210g
aquarium weighs 343 pounds. This is without glass covers or a stand
or overflows, just a plain Jane empty fish tank. Anyway, you've
helped me so much I figured I needed to give something back, I
realize that was a small thing but interesting to know and it might
help some hobbyist some day.
<Thank you>
Anyway the fish come
in tomorrow, I've already got my freshwater dip buckets (two 5g
buckets) set up, one for the two Semilarvatus and one for the
Harlequin tusk. I set the pH last night at 8.2 and I've got pumps in
there keeping the water aerated, so everything should be good to go
when the fish arrive. I haven't put the formalin in yet, I'll wait
to do that until I'm ready to dip the fish. I'm still nervous but
actually much less so after your last reply email. I think I finally
feel like I'm going to get this right! And that is a good feeling :)
<You are prepared!>
Two questions for you, both have answers that
are probably very obvious to an experienced
aquarist/genius/superhero
<Dang cape is caught on my chair...>
like yourself, but I'm not sure on them and I did read the website,
I don't see where this is specifically addressed. One, should I
acclimate both Semilarvatus B/F together in the same bucket?
<Can
be done if there's room... otherwise, one at a time>
I'm 99% sure
they wont be shipped together,
<I'm 100>
so I assume I
shouldn't need to acclimate together. My concern comes from reusing
the same bucket. For instance, I'll put one fish into the bucket,
let it sit for 5 minutes OR until it freaks out, whichever comes
first. At this point, should that water be considered "contaminated"
and not reusable for the next butterfly?
<Nope... though there
are such concerns for some (mainly freshwater) fish families>
If
so, I'll need to mix up a third bucket of water because my 2nd
bucket is going to be used by my Harlequin. Or should I just put
both B/F into the same bucket at once?
<See above>
It is 4
gallons of water and it will be well aerated and heated. Now since
they are going into the same quarantine tank together, I'm going to
assume any disease one has the other will get, my main concern is if
something toxic or for lack of a better word "bad" happens to the
water after the B/F has been in it for 5 minutes, bad enough that I
wont want to dip a 2nd fish in the same water.
<Not to worry>
And second question is my quarantine tank, it is a standard 29g
aquarium... Can two Semilarvatus B/F, around 3.5 to 4 inches in
length get along for a month or two in the same tank?
<Yes>
These aren't purchased as a pair, so they will be two strangers most
likely to each other, and definitely in a smaller water volume than
is recommended but that is only going to be about a two month
period. After two months, my newly set up 180g should be finished
cycling and have gone through a good 2 month period of letting the
live rock really come to life, I want to give the rock as much time
as possible to become very alive, so if the B/F can handle 2 months
in the same tank with each other I'd prefer to do that.
<Just
monitor metabolites...>
The other option is I could put one B/F
and the Harlequin tusk in my one 29g and then a single B/F in the
other 29. Basically, I've got two 29g tanks and 3 fish, I'm
wondering which combo will work best over the course of about a 2
month period.
<The two BFs tog.>
After that they are going
into a 180g and they should be happy as clams.
Thanks Bob!
Grant Gray
<Welcome Grant. B> |
Aquarium... Red Sea biotope! 2/5/08
Hello, I
have a 180 gallon aquarium 72x24x24. I wanted to make it a red sea
species aquarium only. I wanted to put in 1 Imperator angel,
<Mmm,
will need more room than this>
2 Golden butterflies, 1 purple tang, 1
Blonde Naso tang.
<Ditto>
My question is if this is possible?
<For a while, yes...>
Would this be overcrowded? What about long
term?
<I'd upgrade to a 300 plus gallon... look into, get some
invertebrates going as well... Maybe come on out in May this year with
us (to Jordan and Sharm/Egypt) get a good taste of what you might want,
do... You have seen my go at describing this? In "Fishwatcher's Guide to
the Tropical Marine Fishes of the World", v. 1... and my re-do of the
Red Sea section as an ex. to friend Helmut Debelius (I do hope you have
a recent ed. of his Red Sea Reef Guide...) here:
http://wetwebmedia.com/redseafwgv1.htm
and the linked files above>
Also, would this reduce the risk of infection in the aquarium because
they are all from the Red Sea?
<Good question... I don't know... but
will state that Red Sea livestock tends to be very tough, resistant, the
pinnacle in general (per geography) of all marine livestock sources>
Lastly, what should the salinity be in the aquarium?
<About 1.028>
Thank you.
<Welcome! Bob Fenner, who is not joking re joining our
itinerary, entourage in early May... about the 6th>
Re: Aquarium... Red Sea biotope! 2/6/08
Thank
you very much for your quick response! I greatly appreciate that and I
am a big fan of the website!! When you say that the fish will live
together for a while does that mean 1 year, 2 years or more?
<Depending on what size started... about this long>
I am going to buy
these fish all around 3''-4''.Once again thank you very much!!
<Welcome. BobF>
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