Fancy Goldfish and lighting 9/6/09
Hello Crew
<Hello,>
I have two goldfish in a 20 gallon tank, one fantail and one black moor. I have some questions about lighting. I have no live plants in the tank.
After reading your site and FAQs, it seems like there is a consensus that when it comes to fancy goldfish and lighting that as long as they have a day night cycle going, that what kind of light you use (general
fluorescent, Grolux pink, actinic, or 50/50) is more a matter of the owners taste and not the fishes.
<Pretty much, except to say that all fish prefer shade, and bright lights coupled with a bright (e.g., coloured gravel) substrate will tend to stress most types of fish.>
However, in 'Googling' in general I read from time to time that they will be happier in one light, or breed better in another, or maybe even live a little less depending on the light chosen. I got a Grolux pink light
because it looked cool, but I later saw some studies on the web that said that freshwater fancy goldfish don't do as well in pink light.
<Never heard of this. Gro-Lux lights have been used over aquaria for decades, and with no problems I'm aware of.>
Could you 1) let me know your thoughts on what kind of light from the ones I listed above are best for goldfish, and 2) for the lights above, can you tell me why they are generally chosen (even if those reasons have nothing to do with goldfish). It would appear they are for coral, plants, etc., but I haven't been able to find anything comprehensive enough to satisfy my curiousity.
<All depends on what you want. Gro-Lux lights do a good job of highlighting the orange colours on Goldfish, so if those work for you, then stick with them. Adding some floating plants, such as Indian Ferns, will offer the fish some shade, and that's to be recommended.>
Cheerio!
<Cheers, Neale.>

Goldfish Questions (Black moor), sys., fdg.    5/27/07 Hello Again! <<Hi, Megan. Tom here.>> After enjoying the company of my new black moors (had them for approximately four weeks), I have come up with several questions. <<Okay.>> 1. What is the reason for having the timed light source?  What happens if it is on 24/7?  (Other than wasting electricity!) <<Fish, like people, need down time, i.e. sleep/rest. Leaving the lights on 24/7, for example, doesnt replicate a normal day/night evolution for them. They can become sleep deprived, in a way. Stressful, to say the least. Since most all homes/dwellings will receive at least some daylight, it would be better to leave the tank lights off all the time rather than the other way around. (Still not a good idea but I think you can see my point.) In addition, limiting the amount of light that the tank is exposed to helps to keep algae growth contained. Many folks who just cant seem to get this under control are successful once they learn to limit the period of time that the lights are on for the tank.>> 2.  Of the two fish, one tends to stare into a plant for approximately 1/2 hour intervals.  The other fish will sometimes brush against him, or nudge him (no more aggressive behavior since the introduction of silk plants!), and then he will act like a normal goldfish, but he seems to just "zone out" in the same spot with this plant.  Is this something to be concerned about?  The other fish seems extremely happy, and has not shown any behavior like this.  Could it be an eye problem?  (Eyes appear clear from a side view, with yellow/white irises.)  He can easily locate food - in comparison to the unaffected fish - and swims with no difficulty.  What could it be? <<He may be doing exactly what you suggest, zoning out. Kind of a fish version of a cat nap. I wouldnt be concerned about this unless he starts hiding or locating himself at the top or bottom of the tank. He may just be tired and finds this restful.>> 3.  Finally - food!  I have been feeding them a variety of spinach, peas, and the general flake goldfish food, and I have tried not to overfeed them, however, how much do you feed a goldfish with large eyes?  According to the rule, feed a goldfish the amount equivalent to his eye - but the volume, or surface area? <<Heres where we could end up with fat Black Moors or Bubble Eye Goldfish! This rule of thumb references the volume of the eyeball, not the entire anatomical structure around it. Keep in mind that Goldfish, in the wild, are constantly looking for greenery, such as algae, to feed on so this admonition isnt so much directed at how much theyll consume (provided its appropriate food) as how much theyll miss. Goldfish will certainly scavenge for morsels that got away but are, generally, pretty messy eaters. What gets missed when theyre fed too much will only contribute to the overall messiness of these animals. Keeping their diets well-regulated will go a long way toward controlling eliminated waste, uneaten food and the amount of ammonia excreted through their gills, which is how they get rid of it rather than through their waste.>>   Again, thanks for the help!   Megan <<Youre more than welcome. Tom>>

Oranda goldfish, sys.     2/23/07 I got my 1st fish today and its <it's> in a 10 gal aquarium. The fish seems to just hang out in the bottom of tank and seems scared when I turn on the light. <Mmm, better to have some light on outside the tank first... and to impose a regularity to light/dark periods... perhaps with a timer>   Is that normal, is it just getting used to things? When should I turn on the light and for how long? <Mmm, eight-ten hours per day... whatever time schedule suits your presence really. Bob Fenner>

Kamikaze Goldfish - 11/15/2005 We had three fish in an 11 gallon tank until recently, one goldfish and two Shubunkin; we renamed the goldfish 'Kamikaze' after he jumped out of the tank four times over a fortnightly period, <Wow.> the last time spending half the night under the sofa. He was dry to the touch when we found him and only the slightest movement of his gill cover stopped us from just chucking him in the bin. <WOW. Close call for him.> Jumping out of the tank? What the hell's that all about? <It could very well be that his water quality has become poor or even toxic; fish will sometimes jump out of a tank in hopes of a cleaner environment. They don't know there's no water to land in.> He now only has about half his tail because of the damage he did the last time and big patches where his scales came off.  <Yeowch.> We then bought a tank which is roughly two-and-a-half times bigger, <So, about 25 gallons or so, yes?> put Tails (3 years old), Gorazilla (2 1/2 years old) and Kamikaze (2 years old) in it (using old water, old gravel, letting it mature) plus two new lemon goldfish (Honey and Pumpkin), a kind of Dalmatian effect Shubunkin with red gill covers (Patches) and a tiny goldfish (Fatty), <So, we're looking at seven goldfish in a roughly 25 gallon tank? This is far too much fish and too little "space" for maintaining safe, good water quality.... Please read here for more about goldfish systems: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/gldfshsystems.htm .> which our eldest son's best friend had been keeping in a green plastic box in his drawer. <Ohhhhhhhh my. A major improvement for THAT fish, to be sure.> So far so good. New tank has under-gravel filtration and a big pump, also there is a range of live plants in the water (two got eaten). Tank left with pump working for a week before fish put in, using old water, old pump and filter, three old fish put in a week later and left for a week, new fish added after that and have been in for two weeks. Water tests fine.  <Fine being....? Be testing for ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate - ammonia and nitrite must be ZERO, nitrate less than 20ppm. If it is not, do water changes to fix.> Yesterday we realized that Tails, the oldest, had lost half his tail and his fins and tail are full of microscopic bubbles (*not* white spot, I'm sure); I watched as Patches zoomed round nipping at Tails' tail and just about everybody else's, took him out and isolated him (after Kamikaze leapt out the back of the new tank in a new bid for martyrdom), <Wow. Just wow. Please consider a very close-fitting lid on this tank; Kami's bound and determined, it seems.> put in a load of anti-disease tonic in the tank <Mm, this, perhaps, is a bad idea.... Never medicate unless you know what you're treating FOR and WITH, or you can actually end up causing more problems when all you're trying to do is help - it can get quite frustrating.> plus a bit of stress enzyme, then gave him back to the shop. Again, what's with the tail-nipping stuff?  <Could just be an amorous male.> Everything we've done has been on the advice of the shop, and they should know given they've got a full-scale tropical reef going in their shop. <Mm, it can be very, very tough to expect any one person to be extremely well-versed in all aspects of fishkeeping.... Understand that the folks at the shop need to know a little bit about everything - most every shop employee will have areas in which they are "weak".> Is it my imagination or do goldfish just sit in the tank thinking up weird things to do? <HAH! I do think you are onto something, here!> New diseases to manifest? <Hoo! May be.> Or am I just crap at this?  <Nope. You'll get there. I do heartily recommend reading that link above....> The new tank should be paradise for them, all checks out, plants to wreck, <I do bet the plants are going over VERY well for these animals' pleasure.> loads of nice oxygen in the water, all feeding fine, loads of gravel to chew on and things to hide under - are they just ungrateful or what?  <Mm, perhaps just a little unruly? Actually, I don't think they really have the capacity to be grateful or ungrateful, and I think you're on the right track with the right questions and the right attitude to learn their needs.> Jon <Wishing you well, -Sabrina>

Quentin and Light - 12/22/2005 My goldfish, Quentin, is acting very strangely and I'm afraid that it's all my fault! <Uh-oh!> I always turn their light out when I  go to sleep and on again in the morning and they seemed to be doing  really well ( "they"- I have another goldfish, Henry). Well, I made a  terrible mistake and in my rush to leave the house this morning I  forgot to turn on their light ( I left at around 8 am) and when I got  home this evening at 7:15 I noticed that Quentin was acting oddly- he  was floating on his back and the spots under his front fins and the largest slits on the side of his head <His gills?> looked pretty red inside. <This is not from a change in his lighting....> He's  swimming around a bit and he ate his dinner and Henry is doing fine-  what could this be? <Likely environmental disease.> Does it have anything to do  with them being  in the dark all day? <Nope.> Should I leave their light on all night to make up  for it or will it confuse them? <They won't much mind either way.  Best to just let them have night.> I feel terribly guilty and all I want to do is help out my little friend! I noticed that you had given some advice about adding roughage to their diet and I've been told by others to use zucchini- but when I put a slice in the tank it makes their  water very cloudy and I just can't help but think that it's not good for them!! <There is much you need to read, and soon.  Start here:   http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/gldfshsystems.htm and here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/gldfshdisease.htm and here:  http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/gldfshmalnut.htm .> Thank you! Michelle <Wishing you well,  -Sabrina>

YumpingYimmeney One more question Bob is it normal for goldfish to jump out of the water? <Yes... other than very round types, goldfish can indeed "clear the water", jump out of systems. Bob Fenner>  

Goldfish- Olympic Jumping I am wondering if you can enlighten me as to a recent event at my house.  You will be helping me in a critical determination, however, I will certainly not hold you to your answer as determinative...  I have had a goldfish (Finnegan) for 4 years, and have never seen him jump from the water.  He lives in a bowl on my kitchen counter, out of the sun and in a fairly stabile temperature area, about 3 1/2 feet off the ground.  When I got up this morning, I found him on the floor.  All of his fins were dried up and stuck together - I thought for sure he was dead, but I saw his gills move, so I put him back in the water and massaged his fins to soften them, and helped him to float upright.  I don't know if he will make it, I hope he will, but he doesn't look good.  Anyway, I am wondering how likely it is that he suddenly jumped out of the tank for no apparent reason.  We have no cats, and there were no terrifying events to my knowledge.  The bowl was fairly full, but not enough to overflow (probably 1/2 - 3/4 inch to top, and a wide lip on the bowl) - he would have had to work at getting out.  Fin is not a real big fish - his tail is bigger than he is.  He's about 3 inches long without the big fan tail.  The alternative is that my troubled step-son did this intentionally.  I don't expect you to make the call on that, but why would this fish jump out after 4 years?  I typically find Fin sleeping in the morning, waking up to eat when he hears me!  Is it common for this to happen at random?  Thanks for your input! <<All goldfish jump. In fact, all fish in general jump. Usually at night. Some just happen to do it more often than others, and there are many and various causes...hunger, bad water quality, aggression from other fish, spawning, or just for the fun of it. The amount of space between the water level and the edge of the bowl makes no real difference, most fish can easily launch themselves a few feet into the air if so inclined. One-inch long Hatchetfish, for example, can sail four feet thru the air. Athletic bunch :) If you have ever worked in retail selling fish at an LFS, you will realize just how many species can jump high and far when being hunted by a newbie fish clerk with a net. In your case, I believe it's a water quality problem. Since it's a bowl with no filtration, you should be testing your ammonia on a regular (say, weekly) basis. Chances are you are doing the same number of water changes as when he was smaller, but now he is producing more ammonia, thus it is building up more quickly to toxic levels. An ammonia reading of over .25 ppm is unacceptable, so aim for that level. That said, your fish is probably (after four years and only three inches long?) stunted. You do not say what kind of goldfish he is...a regular comet, a Sarasa, a fantail, an Oranda?? All goldfish have the potential to live 20 years, and depending on what type of goldfish they are, can grow anywhere from 6-8 inches in length to three feet, so he should be MUCH larger than three inches by now. I highly recommend you buy him a larger bowl, or even a 20 gallon tank. He needs room to move, and get some exercise, as well. Hopefully he has not been permanently stunted, he may still grow. But in general, stunted fish do not live their complete lifetimes. You may read up on goldfish care by doing a web search, or checking the goldfish FAQs here at WetWeb. Best luck, Gwen>>