Is Velvet the Problem, or What? Will the Real Problem Please Stand Up?
My tank was doing wonderfully. No algae and I had 5 fish - a royal Gramma, a true clown...
<<As opposed to a fake clown? Aren't they *all* clowns..?? Clowns creep me out, as do monkeys, but hey..>>
...a red-headed solar wrasse, and 2 Klein's Butterflies. I had been having a lot of fish die in my quarantine tank and I told that to the people in the two LFSs. They all said "I don't believe in quarantine - I think it's a real stressor on the fish and causes more harm than good". 
<<Yep, that's why you'll find NO public zoo or aquarium that skips quarantine. Because it does no good. Oh yeah, sage words. And people wonder why some of us have problems with the information coming out of local shops.>>
Another thing that was said over and over was "Ich is always in the water - the only time your fish get ich is when they're stressed". Is this true?
<<It IS debatable, to be honest. I, personally, am of the opinion that a whole lot of bad things are present, just as in the ocean. I also believe that it is external stressors that allow diseases to take hold. However, there are some diseases that I would assert that, if always present, would always kill. Let's see where this one's going.>>
Having said that, I wanted a flame angel and from everything I'd read, it would not be a problem having those 6 fish in my 75 gallon tank. 
<<Not so much the number of fish as the biological load they place on the system. Given your list, I tend to agree, six smaller fishes *should* be no problem.. except for the fact that you haven't quite got the quarantine thing down, that's a problem (and not a small one).>>
I bought the first flame angel and he died in my quarantine tank - don't know why. 
<<This is a problem. It's important to know why.>>
I thought he had something on his fins but was not sure. 
<<Fish don't die from "something on the fins". That "something" is an indicator of a larger problem. Think "globally" here, think husbandry, environment, nutrition, sourcing, original fish health. All avenues must be explored.>>
On March 13th I purchased another Flame from the other store in town and put him directly into the main tank without quarantine.
<<I cannot recommend strongly enough against this practice. For instance, let's say that you did indeed introduce a fish with marine velvet (Amyloodinium/Oodinium). This parasite is EXCEEDINGLY virulent. So much so that you cannot hope to re-use a *thing* without using extreme disinfection procedures.>>
As of April 8th five of the six fish had died. I believe it was velvet. 
<<Why do you believe this?>>
The red-headed solar wrasse did not die and looks perfectly healthy. Today is April 16th and he appears to be doing great. All my snails, hermit and 2 emerald crabs are also doing great.  Now for the questions. Did the velvet come from the Flame Angel or is it "always in the water anyway"? 
<<I don't know. You haven't described a single symptom that would even begin to lead me in the direction of velvet. As for "omnipresence", re: specifically velvet, my experience has been that if it's present at all, it's going to show up FAST KILL FAST MOVE FASTFASTFAST. As in "You better have your nuts together little squirrel 'cause we've got some rough riding ahead." This stuff is BAD. Brooklynellosis is another one that leaves little time for action, tends to be virulent (though often we'll see one or three fishes affected, and others showing nothing). This is about the best reason I can see to quarantine for a FULL four weeks (and this next bit is really important) Disease Free. If they show signs of illness, that clock starts all over again. I think it's time to examine more closely your quarantine procedures/husbandry.>>
Is it true that Ich is always in the water? 
<<Do a search on the many reefing bulletin boards, search Terry Bartelme, Steven Pro, et al. You will find that there is some debate regarding this assertion. However, a different take on my own stance: If one ASSUMES omnipresence, then one is more likely to act accordingly, yes? This means utility of hyposalinity, freshwater dipping, and proper quarantine/hospital housing at the ready. Make yourself ready as a Marine, and it will stand you in good stead. However, we really need to sort out the original troubles with your quarantine, no fish should be dying so readily in a good set-up.>>
Was it possible that it was a really bad case of Ich? Did the fish get sick because the Flame Angel introduced a parasite or because the last fish was one fish too many, slightly aggressive, and I stressed out my fish and made them susceptible to infection? 
<<Not a one of these questions can be answered intelligently with the dearth of information you've provided. However, if I assume that you had live rock only for filtration in that tank, and if I assume that those butterflies weren't more than 6" in length, I would have to say that, no, I don't think it was just one fish too many that pushed it over the edge. However, I can't really make ANY assumptions that would allow me to be more definitive for you.>>
Did they sick because I added one too many fish (the butterflies were pretty active)? What should I do now - is there a period of time I must wait before introducing new fish into the tank (the LFSs say 1 month)? 
<<It's time you search our site on marine parasitic diseases, including but not limited to Cryptocaryon irritans, Amyloodinium/Oodinium, and Brooklynellosis. I can't even begin to offer a guess as to what's going on here without any identifying information.>>
The wrasse did not get sick but how do I know that he's not just one incredibly immune fellow and any other fish I put in there will get velvet? 
<<Cannot answer.>>
How long does the parasite stay alive in the substrate? Toni
<<Depends on certain conditions, really, starting with temperature, and the availability of host organisms. I'm sure you've heard of people carrying diseases that they don't show symptoms of, but can give to others. I believe that it is *generally* safe to say the same is true of fish. However, there really is no way I can really help you at this point. Water parameters (as well as age and brand of test kit) are the beginning here. If you used hyposalinity, how low, and how did you measure (yes, what tool you used is really important). How big is your Q/T system? Is it filtered? How so? What test parameters have you found in your quarantine? Observation is the keystone of science and good husbandry of ALL animals/children, etc. Please, do start with our Google search tool using the keywords mentioned above, you have a LOT of reading to do, my friend. Marina>>

Re: Crypt in a big reef... Quarantine!  Be Human - Learn From Others' Experience
How do I feel about quarantining all incoming livestock now?
<Yeah, tell us all about it!>
Well I guess that when I kept tropical fish and got white spot it was a whole lot easier to treat it but getting white spot in a 130 gallon reef tank with corals inverts and a lot of money spent on it all is a nightmare world!
From now on nothing gets in my tank without going through the quarantine tank I can now see why having a quarantine tank set up is so important. If my first purchase had been a hospital tank and I had seen it as being more important then the latest skimmer or wizard gizmo my fish would all be ok and I wouldn’t be spending more money on salt for all the water changes I'm having to do now not to mention the hours I have spent worrying about my fish surviving all this. So if I was telling others about keeping marine fish I would say this..
Get a quarantine tank set it up and DO NOT I repeat DO NOT! Let any fish in your tank with out passing the quarantine period first.
I would then add to that.. ok you're not taking me seriously are you your thinking no I will be ok... Well your wrong you won't be ok the dreaded white spot will come after you and when your up to your neck in ick infested water and your fish look like salted kippers you will remember my words...USE A QUARANTINE TANK!
<Thank you! Bob Fenner>  

Ich and Quarantine (the next Tarantino film) 10/7/05
Hi
<<Hi.>>
Yesterday my sixline wrasse had two white specs on it. I removed all three fish to quarantine tanks last night assuming they were all infected.
<<A partially correct assumption, and likely what I may have done in the same situation. Sixlines, in my own experience, are not very susceptible to C. irritans, but such a small fish can be overwhelmed easily.>>
No other fish were displaying symptoms.
<<As you've probably surmised, they don't need to be displaying symptoms to be under attack.>>
My question is since the severity of this ich outbreak is so small how long do I have to keep my display tank fallow? I have read on your web site a minimum of six weeks, but with my quick action I am hoping to only leave the tank fallow for 2-4 weeks.
<<The reason for this length of time fallowing is because of the life-cycle and lifespan of the protozoa in question. This can be speeded up by raising the tank temperature.>>
My problem with leaving the display tank empty for 6 weeks is my yellow tang, which is 4-5 inches long really pollutes the water fast.
<<Ah, indeed. Yet that's the fish most likely to completely succumb. Have you considered going with large tubs or trash cans? I, and others, have posted on this sort of "tank-in-a-pinch" methodology. Also, lowering the salinity is helpful in ensuring better O2 saturation. Again, search via our Google bar, on hyposalinity.>>
I had a really hard time keeping the yellow tang in the initial quarantine period and had to move her to the display tank a few days early when she was first introduced. The wrasse and the damsel are receiving a copper treatment, but I would rather not treat the yellow tang with copper so I could place a piece of live rock in the quarantine tank and help with biological filtration, or should I just treat the tank with copper?
<<My personal preference is to start with hyposalinity. However, I've not had problems treating most tangs (especially Z. flavescens) with copper, either. Again, consider hitting one of the "Marts" (Wal, K) and getting a larger plastic tub for her. 30-40 gallons should allow enough room for swimming, etc.>>
Also, would it be safe to take a piece of live rock from the infected tank and place it in the quarantine tank without copper, or would it be best to go buy a new piece of live rock from the LFS to place in the quarantine tank?
<<Don't transfer any live/porous material into Q/T. That will just transfer the disease. Also, if you're treating with copper, it's pointless to put *any* live rock in there, as it will quickly become both dead and saturated with copper. Just don't put anything porous in a tank that's being treated with copper. Again, do use our Google bar, as you'll find a WHOLE lot of information previously posted - more than I could add here.>>
This is my first experience with a disease, so any help would be appreciated.
Thanks for everything, Jed
<<You're welcome. You've acted and read, now just read some more and see about getting the tang some larger temporary digs. Marina>> 

Ich (prevention)
Bob, this is not really a question but I hope you post it anyway. I know thousands of aquarist read your wonderful site and FAQ's column daily. 
<Yes>
You have indicated many times on the benefits of quarantine. I would just like to reiterate on this subject for many newbies and the hordes of impatient Wet Pet keepers. Quarantine is one of the most important tools an aquarist can use. PERIOD!!!
I have always been one to follow this procedure religiously. Until three weeks ago that is.
<Uh oh>
I bought two more Green Chromis to add to my small school to finish of my livestock purchases. They came from a visually clean tank that I had been observing for a week. I dipped them and placed them in a 20
gallon quarantine tank. After a week they looked and acted like they were the healthiest fish in all the world. So in my impatience, I took them out and dipped them again. Yep, you guessed it, I put them in my display tank
feeling very confident. One week later, Hello Ich city! You all now know
what I am going through and will be going through for the next month or so.
An infested reef is something that takes time to rid (or at least reduce the numbers) of those little pest called Cryptocaryon.
<Yes my friend>
Fellow aquarist, please head Bob's advice, my advice and the advice of
the millions who have learned the "HARD WAY". Quarantine all of your animals and please be patient. Your animals beg you. Zimmy
<Thank you... you have likely saved thousands of organisms, hundreds of aquarists... Be chatting. Bob Fenner>

Quarantining - use for cured live rock, corals, anemones?
Bob,
I know that when we introduce new organisms, we should ALWAYS quarantine them before introducing them to our home tank but is this also true for cured live rock, corals, and anemones? 
<No, not always best/better to quarantine... many organisms can/should be simply dipped, others acclimated and introduced directly... Depends on several standard (like what species) and variable (like apparent condition) and your designs... as in what else is in the system, what you have to risk. I give my opinions per group (sometimes per species) on the coverage on WetWebMedia.com, books, articles...>
Are there any diseases or pests that they could introduce that we could avoid introducing to our home tank by quarantining? 
<Many... most notably the scourges which are external parasites of many species of fishes: ich/Cryptocaryoniasis, velvet/Amyloodiniumiasis (Costia, Trichodina...).>
Could dormant stages of ick or Vibrio live in corals or LR?
<Wowzah! Yes, they can...>
How long would they need to stay in the quarantine tank?
<About two weeks>
If we wanted to introduce a clown fish and an anemone. Would it be a bad
idea to copper the clown in the quarantine tank and introduce the anemone
separately, first, to the main tank.
<Actually not a good idea to "copper" Clowns... they're quite sensitive to this exposure... and the complaints that it might help with can be dispensed with via simple pH adjusted freshwater dips... Now, Brooklynellosis on the other hand (if you're dealing with wild-collected stocks) can't be treated with copper at any length... please see the "Clownfish Disease" section on the WetWebMedia.com site re this>
My favorite RI fireworks were in Roger Williams park when I was growing up in RI. Things seem SO much bigger when you're small...Happy July 4th!
<Wowzah times two! Need to get back to that small State of my origins. Bob Fenner>
Allyson

Next Time- Quarantine!
First off...this is the best online place for fish info. Thank you so much for what you do. I am sure you save many (fish) lives. Now the problem.
<Lay it on me!>
I have a dogface puffer and a green bird wrasse. Like a fool I did not quarantine then when I got them. (bet you know what is coming next)
<It can't be....can it?>
I believe they may have ICK. The puffer started with white specks not really large enough to be considered salt grain size. I saw this and panicked promptly set up a quarantine tank and freshwater dipped him. This was a bad idea because he swallowed air and was VERY mad at me for 2 days. (He burped it out) I have decided not to FW dip him anymore even though I know how good of an idea it is.
<Well, there are other medications that are equally, if not more, effective>
He was too stressed. He is in the QT tank now and was being given Rid Ick and Melafix but same spots still there.
<I'd really avoid mixing two medications together...all kinds of potentially bad interactions are possible...I wouldn't use the Melafix for ich. It's supposed to be used for healing wounds, etc., and is allegedly an anti-bacterial treatment. Ich, as you know, is a parasite, so this stuff is not needed at this juncture, IMO.>
It has been a week. I have decided to use copper instead.
<That's what I would have used in the first place. However, you might want to do some water changes, and use some medication-removing filtration media, such as PolyFilter for a few days prior to starting the copper treatment. This fish has been exposed to a lot of different medications in the last week, so adding another medication without a "break", IMO, could create more stress. Copper will definitely work, but it needs to be administered properly>
I was starting to think it was stress but in a span of 24 hours
or so the wrasse got the specks too. He has been not just rubbing against things but RAMMING against them. He is very active and eats like a teen aged boy. I netted him and preceded to FW dip him but 30 seconds after he hit the water he flopped on his side. I freaked and took this as a sign he was not handling the FW dip well and pulled him out and into the QT. Did I jump the gun?
<no- sounds like good judgment to me! In my experience, wrasses tend to not take kindly to the dipping process. I recall a Flame Wrasse of mine that did an amazing ICBM impression during the dip, launching himself about 3 feet from the dipping bucket! He's still with me, but I always cover the bucket after that experience!>
I have decided to just let my tank go fallow for a month.
<Excellent!>
What about my hermit and horse shoe crab? Can I keep them in the system? Also have snails.
<In a fallow tank, I'd leave the inverts in. Keep up regular maintenance (i.e.; water changes, skimmer maintenance, media replacement, etc) during the fallow period>
When I first noticed the specks I read how you advocate the use of neon gobies and cleaner shrimps. After deciding the cleaner shrimp would be an expensive dinner for "Puffy" I decided to get the Goby which comes in tomorrow. I cant put him the main tank but can I add him to the QT?
<Yep- quarantine. I am personally skeptical about the effectiveness of using gobies to "cure" ich. Yes, they will nip some cysts, but I think it is unrealistic to expect the gobies (or goby) to get them all. I prefer the old-fashioned, unpopular way- medication!>
Thanks and to all reading this...PLEASE TAKE THE TIME TO QUARANTINE NEW FISH.
<Could not have said it any better myself! Good luck! You can beat this thing! Regards, Scott F>

Here's Why We Quarantine!
Dear WetWeb Crew,
I have 2 blue Chromis, from the Caribbean, that have some type of infection and was wondering if you could give me some advice.  I have read through various FAQs but either missed something or could not find anything that matched their condition.  I purchased the Chromis about 3 weeks ago and placed them in a bare-bottomed 10 gal qt tank.
<Excellent!>
About a 1 1/2 weeks ago, one of them started to develop a small white patch on the tip of its anal fin. A few days later, it disappeared but showed up on in the anterior end of the lateral line.  Initially, it was visible on one side of the fish, but now it seems to be on both sides and there is also now a small white lump on the head of the fish, just behind the eye.  The other Chromis is now just starting to exhibit the same white area on its lateral line.  The white areas don't look like the salt grains as seen with ich.  Both fish act normal: no scratching, heavy breathing, or listlessness, and both eat well. Also noticed one of the fishes excretes white colored fecal matter. Was wondering if these fish have some type of bacterial infection, perhaps internal as well as external?
<That's kind of what I was thinking. Some of the symptoms you're describing sound like a parasitic problem, and others a bacterial (fungal) issue. I'd take "the high road", and consider a broad spectrum antibiotic, such as Maracyn, to deal with it. Follow the manufacturer's instructions carefully concerning its use.>
Not sure that it is ich. As of yet, I have not treated the tank with any medication as the fish are otherwise healthy. Any recommendations on a medicine?  I perform weekly 10-20% water changes. Any advice or insight would be greatly appreciated.   
Sincerely, Jason
<Well, Jason- as outlined above, I'd consider the use of Maracyn, perhaps in conjunction with a few freshwater dips (to tackle any possible parasitic problem in a gentle manner...Take it slow and careful. But give yourself a pat on the back for using a quarantine tank! A disease that shows up during the quarantine period is EXACTLY why everyone should utilize this technique! Keep up the good work! Good luck! Scott F>

Quarantine Clams
Good morning/evening Steven,
<Good afternoon.>
If I was only to keep one clam, would that reduce the need for quarantine?
<Reduce but not eliminate. Always best to follow good husbandry practices.>
Does this creature carry organisms which may also be dangerous for fish/corals?
<Possible infectious agents in the shipping water.>
Having read quite a bit about clams/care/diseases and predators on your site and others, how would I know if some predator snail/worms which are not commonly visible (remain hidden in attached rock) were present, short of seeing the clam die?
<See if you cannot find Daniel Knop's excellent book "Giant Clams". He has written an extensive section on identifying and treating various "diseases" of clams. -Steven Pro>

Snail Quarantine?
You guys are the best. Thanks so much for all your information. A couple questions... I've read conflicting info about whether or not to quarantine snails prior to adding them to a tank. We want to get about a half dozen turbo snails from our LFS who has them in established reef tanks. Is a quarantine or some sort of dip necessary before placing them in our FOWLR tank? 
<Ideally, yes quarantine. Also a good idea to not put outside water (from the LFS) into your tanks.> 
Also, how concerned should I be about the copper pipes in our house? <Minimal for most.> 
Will R/O remove any copper that may leach into the water? 
<Yes with many other things.> 
Thanks again. Karen 
<You are welcome. -Steven Pro>

Water Changes And Quarantine -QT worth the trouble 
Hey all,
<Hey! Scott F. here!>
I have a few questions regarding tank maintenance.  First off, I'm glad I found your website, otherwise I would not have known anything about QT's or fresh water dips etc.
<Glad that it is so helpful for you! Lots to learn!>
But all this info leads me to some questions about water changes both in the main and hospital tank. Being a 29 gallon, I've read where smaller, frequent changes are best.
<Yep- I'm a full-on water change "junkie"! I advocate small (5% of tank volume) water changes twice a week...really work well to help dilute organics before they get a chance to accumulate>
I was initially gonna use treated tap water for water changes, but I took a visit to the pet store last night that offered RO water in 5 gallon and 1 gallon jugs.  The dude said all I had to do is add salt to this stuff?
<Well, not really. With RO water, you need to do a little prep work before it's ready to go. Be sure to aerate it for about 24 hours prior to use. This will help drive off excess carbonic acid present in the water. Remember, RO water has little, if any hardness, and should be buffered before mixing with salt. There are a number of buffering and "reconstituting" products out there to do the job.>
I figured if I bought the five gallon jugs, then it would be easy to keep consistent, making maybe 2.5 gallon changes every two weeks (5 gallons / month). Is this enough for a tank that will have roughly 15 or 20 lbs of live rock, 15 hermits, 3 crabs and 5 shrimps some snails and one fish (flame angel)?  I'm trying to get up some kind of schedule here to start with.
<That's a decent schedule, but I'd try to go for those 5% changes twice a week. The labor involved would be minimal...I don't think it would be too costly, either...Consider it, okay?>
About the QT.  I have an old ten gallon, heater, and the
filter that used to be on my 29 gallon (some kind of whisper), but I haven't set it up yet. What is required as far as maintenance goes for this tank? (If all is going well in the main tank).  I didn't initially plan on having a QT, and still aren't really sure if I need it being that I'm only planning on having 1 fish or any fish at all.  The thing is, I know it's a good idea, but the wife isn't too thrilled about the main tank being in the dining room in the first place, which is the only place suitable in the house, and I have no place to put the QT. How important is one if you mainly have inverts and not any fish......we'll maybe one!  Thx in advance!
<I can understand your wife's concern! However, you do need a quarantine tank, even for inverts, IMO. The good news: A quarantine tank is not a permanent feature! You simply set it up when you need it, with water from your main tank, and break it down when the 3-4 week quarantine period is up. Easy! As far as the filter and cycling are concerned, just keep the filter media in the sump or somewhere else in the main system, where it will constantly be colonizing beneficial bacteria. Then- when you need the quarantine tank- just fill it up (with some water from those frequent water changes..) and you're ready to go in hours! Great for those "impulse buys" that always seem to arise when we visit the LFS! Use water from your changes in the main tank to replace water changed in the quarantine tank. Don't neglect the quarantine process- it's so easy to do, and it can really make a huge difference in the long-term success in the hobby! Good luck! Regards, Scott F>

QT of new macrophytes
Follow-up question if I may
I am getting some Halimedas from same supplier-should plants be freshwater rinsed, drugged or quarantined before going into main tank?
<Just rinsed (in seawater) on removal from the shipping water, and quarantined for a few days. Bob Fenner>
Thanks again!

Coral Eating Flatworms and need for QT 3/25/03
Dear WWM crew-
<cheers, mate>
For the last year my Acropora sp. corals have been ravaged by coral eating flatworms (see picture in Julian Sprung's Invertebrates book or The Modern Coral Reef Aquarium).  
<yes... quite familiar with it. It is an aquarists penitence for not properly using a QT tank for all new livestock. Its a dreadful lesson to learn the hard way. Please be sure to QT all (algae, plants, fish, live rock, coral... everything) for a simple 4 weeks first. There are several very good articles here on WWM for guidance on the topic from Fellman>
I first noticed that areas of my corals were bleaching usually underneath in low flow areas.  Upon closer inspection I noted masses of <1 mm golden brown eggs next to the areas of bleaching.  The worms themselves are cream colored and blend in with the coral quite well.  In their wake they leave a pock-marked appearance to the tissue of the coral and eventual bleaching.  My control methods so far have been to scrub the eggs off (although they can be in rather inaccessible areas) and blast the corals with a powerhead so that the worms come off.  This seems to work better after the coral has been taken out of the water for 2-3 min.  By the way, my Anthias have learned to love eating the flatworms and don't usually miss a single one.
<yes... but labor intensive especially for a pest that has direct development (on its prey)>
My question is do you know of any other method of control or better eradication?  
<nothing surefire... although many have been suggested. Anampses sp. (delicate) perhaps, but only if your tank is large (over 100 gallons), peaceful (fishes), mature (over 1 year old) and preferably with a fishless refugium to support it. These "Tamarin" wrasses have thick rasping lips... advantage over other wrasses>
The worms seem to prefer my Acropora valida type corals (aka "tricolor").  They recover after my removal method but within 1 month are back in the same situation.  Halichoeres wrasses seem to ignore the worms (hard to see) and I can't imagine that a Nudibranch would climb on to a coral to get them.  Know anything about "Flatworm Exit"?  
<"Coming to a Theater Near You!">
Thanks, John Boe
<best of luck, John. Anthony>

Tangling With Quarantine
Hello;
<Hi there! Scott F. here today>
Just wondering what your take is on quarantining  hippo tangs. I want to buy one and plan on quarantining it for a couple of weeks. A friend of mine read here that you people don't believe in quarantining this particular fish and I would like to know the reasons for that. Want to make the right decision.              Thank you. Craig
<Well, Craig- I'd have to disagree with whoever suggested that you should not quarantine this fish. The Hippo Tang is notorious as an "ich magnet", and tends to be particularly prone to acquiring this disease. It is for that very reason that it should be quarantined. I suppose the school of thought which suggests not quarantining this, and other species of tangs assumes that they are more stressed out by the quarantine process. Again- I tend to disagree. It seems to me that a fish which is easily stressed should be a prime candidate for quarantine. I would not, however, use medications, such as copper, with this or any fish, unless the appearance of disease dictates. Tangs have digestive bacteria that can be easily damaged by prolonged exposure to copper. In the end, though- quarantine all new fishes a minimum of three weeks. Good luck! Regards, Scott F>

Quarantine Is A Beautiful Thing!
Hi Guys
<Scott F. your guy today!>
I have a recently purchased Majestic Angel. In QT for the past week.
<Excellent procedure! Glad that you're quarantining your new fishes! Ya hear that, everyone?>
Since I have no biological filtration (currently running the display tank fallow so I can't run a sponge filter through it) I do about 30% water changes a day (1/2 in the AM and 1/2 in the PM).  Today I noticed a white spot on the bottom of it's belly.  It's too large for ich and yet does not look like cotton (yet since it's only been there for a day).  Any ideas as to what it could be and the possible treatment?
<Well, it's really tough to say from here, but it may simply be a spot of fungus from a minor scrape or injury to the skin. Could even be a parasite of some sort... I'd keep up the high water quality, and observe carefully. If the fish shows any additional symptoms, such as scratching, heavy breathing, etc.- take appropriate actions (Medication, freshwater dips, etc.) for a parasitic illness. Also, be sure to congratulate yourself on having the foresight to quarantine! So much easier to address potential problems in the quarantine tank than in the main system! Keep observing, stay calm, and move as required.>
Thanks, Joe
<And thank you for stopping by, Joe! Hang in there with this gorgeous fish, and you'll be fine! Regards, Scott F>

QT or not, part.. III?
>Well, it at this time is mild and I understand that it will always be in there to some degree no matter the water changes and maintenance I do.
>>This is actually up for much debate.  However, you seem to be well aware of how ich is handled.
>I have read all thru WWM and know what has to be done. 30 day qt, fallow tank etc. I am going to wait at this point a little bit.  I have to wait regardless to cycle the qt tank(s).
>>Understood.  Best of luck.  Marina

Mysterious Fish Deaths...
Hi guys!!!
<Scott F. your guy today!>
My boyfriend emailed you a question concerning our Volitans lion's death about a week or two ago.  The Foxface Rabbitfish we had added the day before is still doing just fine.  However, we decided to add a Coris Wrasse juvenile (from the same LFS as the Rabbitfish) approximately two days ago.  He just died, inexplicably, after swimming around all morning and spending the last two days hiding.  It was kind of a shock, because we have a white Turbo Snail, Green Brittle Star, Emerald Crab, and a Foxface Rabbitfish, all doing fine.  Our water keeps testing just fine and we did a small 5 gallon water change last night (we had the water sitting in a bucket with a powerhead running and the water tested fine before addition).
<Well, I see no mention of any quarantine procedure used here...In addition to helping keep diseases out of your display tank, this process helps "harden" newly-received animals by providing them with a quiet, secure place to recover from the rigors of collection, shipping and other stresses. Quarantine is a simple, yet vital process that can really improve your chances of success with fishes. Do read about the process and principles on the WWM site>
tank parameters and inhabitants:
125g
2 AquaC remora pro HOT skimmers w/ mag3 pumps
4 1200 Maxijet powerheads
99 lbs LR with lots of little things living happily (including two largish bristle worms that we find fascinating, a money plant growing insanely fast, and kelp everywhere)
1 Foxface Rabbitfish
1 white turbo snail
1 emerald crab
1 10" green brittle star (who leaves our rabbit alone)
We haven't sprayed anything in the room (not even hairspray), nor have we put any metal of any kind in the tank. When our lion died, we thought it was because we were having problems with the temperature of the tank.  We had since resolved that problem so have no clue why the wrasse would have died like that.  Please help!!!! <:( Thanks! Carole
<Well, Carole, it sounds to me to be a problem with the selection and/or acclimation process. In addition to embracing quarantine, you should really read up on the WWM site about selecting healthy animals for your system. It's also possible that your LFS is not carrying the highest quality livestock... Perhaps you need to check out the way he handles his livestock...Lots of possibilities. Hang in there! Regards, Scott F>

Another Convert To Quarantine!
Scott,
Thank you kindly for the response and a push in the right direction. From your response it looks as though I better start quarantining the long nose butterfly while the live rock is curing.
<Good idea! The quarantine technique is so essential that it should simply become part of the basic practices of all hobbyists...>
(I went with the Fiji LR, based
upon what I read in Reef Invert, great book!!! Figure that would be better as a base and maybe some Caribbean added later). That way when I rearrange the tank the yellow damsel may be a good host. (if not the children will allow me to return to LPS)
<Breaking up territories is a great way to help diffuse potential aggression...Good idea!>
I read the articles on QT and FW dips and have a few questions. I'm a bit concerned dipping the long nose. (It would be my first time dipping a fish) I think I read in Bob's CMA to be careful with using a net for fear of harming the nose.
<Yes, you should. Plus, the fish can damage the nose/mouthparts by thrashing about in a small area. Best is to employ "net less" capture: Use a specimen container to scoop the fish out of the tank, then gently place it in the dip...A bit tricky- but a potential "nose saver">
I will be setting up a 10 gal tank, (all I have) with water from the 75 gal. I have a old whisper 2000 filter, Which I plan on running in the 75 for a week then putting that on the 10. The LPS carries Methylene Blue, which claims it can be added to the tank.
<I'd save the Meth for dipping- it shouldn't be used in the tank unless it's for treating a malady of some sort...>
I thought about just acclimating the long nose to the QT tank with the Methylene Blue added, or would a quick dip still be better than none?
<I think so, if done carefully>
Also the Methylene Blue claims not to affect the biological filtration bed, is this something that I should/can add to the display?
<Nope- It is not  recommended...And it is "Tidy Bowl Blue!"...not something you want to see in the display!>
Currently all in the 75 are fine and I haven't had problems with disease in a long time. (5 years)
Also, is the Methylene Blue all that would be required, unless the fish is sick?
<It's what I use in my dip for all new fishes...Nothing else needed for a dip, IMO>
LPS is about an hour away and figure I'd pick up all I need at once. Another LPS (40 min away), that I went to this weekend to observe had an outbreak of Ich. The butterfly was a mess and since it was setup central filtration, there were a lot of sick fish for sale.
<Yep- an unfortunate occurrence...>
It only reassured the point to Quarantine.
<Absolutely! It only takes one round of ich to convince most people of the value of quarantine!>
The 10 gal is currently set up as a tad pole tank.  Seven tadpoles slowly becoming frogs.
<Lots of fun to watch! A great way to study biology!>
I'll be converting them over to a rubber made tank, any special way to clean the 10 gal? Or just rinse out
with clean water?
<And baking soda. Give it a really good scrub. Some people use bleach, then refill the tank with water and "Dechlor" to help rid the tank of excess chlorine...>
I want to use the 10 gal for the QT so I can better watch the fish. Since it will require a lot of small water changes would it be better to add the water from the 75 and put the new mixed saltwater in the 75 or maybe do a 50/50 split. Again thanks for all your help! DaveK
<I like to use water from the display and nothing else! You can read more about the technique in this link: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/QuarMarFishes.htm>   Good luck! Regards, Scott F.>

Quarantine Story...
Hi - Story and question: I quarantined a juvenile Coral Beauty for 14 days. During this time it apparently thrived, showing no signs of illness or disease or weaknesses of any kind. On day 15 it became pale, lethargic and disoriented, keeling over within about 12 hours of first showing these symptoms. I noticed as it was dying that it had a small incision under it's right front fin, where three half-rice-grain sized white specks appeared to
poke out from. Upon its death, the specks had disappeared but the incision remained. The moral of the story is that QTing a fish for more than 2 weeks is a good idea,
<YES!!! That's what I'm talking about! You heard it hear first, folks....That is why we stress quarantine so much. I've had fishes get sick on day 19 and 20 of a 30 day quarantine period. Don't gamble with fate...>
and the question I have, is : what do you think killed it?
<Well, it sounds to me like it was some kind of internal parasite (a rather large one, at that). Could have been with the fish all along, or it could have been acquired during it's time at the LFS, or even in your quarantine tank, if you use live rock in there (Not recommended)...Hard to be sure without dissection, but that's my guess>
The QT tank had its bottom vacuumed spotless daily, which resulted in about a 33% water change per day to replace this water. Perhaps the constant water changes? Or were those 3 white specs some kind of parasite? I don't think marine ich would kill a fish so quickly, especially if it had only manifested itself in 3 or so trophonts?
<I doubt it, too. Your water change routine is fine for a quarantine system, IMO...Again- I favor the internal parasite theory>
Salinity was at 1.024, temp at 78, all bad nitrogen-related measurements at 0ppm ...
<Doesn't sound like H20 quality was a factor here...>
Thanks, SLC
<Well, SLC- sounds like you did everything right, but the cards just didn't fall in your favor. I commend you nonetheless on your use of quarantine! Thanks for sharing this experience with your fellow hobbyists. As I only have jokingly say about use of quarantine- "Spread the word- not disease"- corny, but true! Good luck, and don't be discouraged...Regards, Scott F.>

Quarantine Story (Pt. 2)
Thanks Scott F.:
<You're welcome!>
I have yet to have a _single_ fish make it out alive of the intro. dip/QT procedure and into my main tank. Since I am a newbie marine aquarist, this has proved to be irritating and saddening, but not frustrating yet.
<Good...don't let it prevent you from keeping up this practice
I really recommend that you keep trying. The procedures are outlined on the WWM site, so do read up and get that confidence back!>
have no specific questions, but I wonder how many fragile yet perfectly healthy fish are killed in this hobby, simply from the stress of dips and QTing.
<Far, far fewer than the number of fishes that are saved by this procedure, I'll bet. It's an absolutely standard procedures at public aquariums and professional aquatic facilities worldwide. The procedures and equipment that the pros use for quarantine are essentially the same as those utilized by hobbyists...>
I would have dissected the CB as you mentioned below, but my feelings for this fish outweighed my forensic curiosity.
<I totally understand. And please don't get discouraged by this bad experience. I think that the Coral Beauty may have been doomed before you ever acquired it. It simply was not your fault...>
Onwards, SLC
<Absolutely! Hang in there and you'll prevail! Regards, Scott F.>

Quarantine Concepts
Hi there
<Hello! Scott F. with you tonight!>
Great site by the way! I can't believe just how much useful information there is on this site. However, I've searched high and low and I don't think this question has been answered yet...
<Well- let's give it a shot!>
I have a question re setting up a quarantine system:
I have a 150 gallon tank set up, with sump, skimmer, refugium etc and a circulation pump back up to the main tank. As the 'cleansed' water goes back into the main tank from the sump, can I take a drip-feed off the return pipe that goes into a separate tank (the quarantine tank). Once this quarantine tank is full up, it will overflow into a waste bucket which I empty every few days when it is full. The lost water from the main tank (that fed the quarantine) is replaced, just like I replace water lost through evaporation.
<Interesting...>
The advantages of this are that the quarantined fish is being quarantined in the water in which it is eventually going to live in, there is no feedback from the quarantine tank to the main tank, the water in the quarantine tank is continually being flushed through and is of the same high quality as my tank. Best of all, its cheap! Please let me know if this is possible.
<Agreed- a unique concept. However, I tend to favor a more simple concept in a quarantine setup: A separate tank, set up on a temporary, as needed basis-without any interaction whatsoever with the main system. Although your concept is novel, and the likelihood of serious malfunction is low, I'd keep it as easy as possible...Good old fashioned sponge filter with in a 10-20 gallon tank. Use water from the main tank (like what you are correctly thinking of using), and there you go! Easy>
Thanks! Gubs
<Again- I like your idea- I just like a more simple application. Good luck! Regards, Scott F>

Hindsight is 20/20
OK! I learned the hard say, should have quarantined! (As a Biology teacher, I  am ashamed!) I have two new perculas and one is not looking very good, while  both are acting withdrawn, no interest in eating flakes. I am not sure if my  percula clownfish necessarily has clownfish disease (Brooklynella sp?).  Today,  it has developed a white lesion on the body just below the dorsal fin.  It also has a ~2" long whitish/clear excrement strand hanging off of it and seems  to have a loss of appetite and equilibrium.  I have not noticed paleness of  color nor excessive slime secretion.  The other percula seems healthy.  I am  wondering if/how I should treat as well as what are possible causes of infection?
<hello, Well I am afraid to tell you it sounds like Brooklynella. The best and fastest way I have found of removing the parasite is a 15 minute freshwater dip. make sure the water is same temp and ph as tank water) I know this seems like a long time but if you do not do a full 15 minutes it will come back. Hopefully it is not to late. As for how the got it. Most likely they were infected when you got them or you did not acclimate them slow enough. Always quarantine!!!!MikeH>
(29 gal eclipse 3 system, temp ~ 76F, sal. 1.022-3, pH 8.2 Nitrate, nitrite  ammonia levels 0.  New tank, only 3 weeks with 9lbs live rock, 1 Sebae anemone,
<If the tank is only 3 weeks old you should not have put an anemone in there. To keep them alive you will need at least 4-5 watts per gallon>
3 turbo snails)  Thanks for any insight.

- Singing the Praises of Quarantine -
To All at WWM:
Actually this time I don't have a questions but a "thank you" for basically pushing the use of quarantine. I recently acquired a 5" emperor angelfish... absolutely beautiful. As most people, I wanted him in my main system immediately. However, I decided to proceed with the appropriate QT protocol. I placed him in a 29gal QT that I had already had prepared for his arrival. I thought the tank may have been too small but that was definitely not the case. A 29 gal was a good size for this fish. I have a couple of PVC pipe pieces in there and there is still plenty of room. I certainly would not recommend a QT of maybe 10 gal for this fish. Anyway, he had not eaten for almost five days and I feel if he was in my main system, with the other fish he may never have eaten. On or about the five day he ate some frozen brine shrimp. I subsequently replaced the brine with Mysis and now 2 weeks later he is eating all types of food, including taking flakes right off the water surface.  I'm going to go one more week in QT then transfer him in the main system. I guess the moral of the story here is that I feel this fish would not have recovered from the stress of transport and begin eating properly without having a chance to acclimate quietly in quarantine. <Much agreed - many folks think quarantine is only for treating disease but as you have observed, it also functions as a intermediate step and opportunity to ease the transition from the wild into captivity. I agree that this fish may have never eaten had you placed it in the main tank where it would be harassed by the existing occupants.> QT is the only way to go and if one wants to observe their new addition they can just observe them in QT for the time being. <Hallelujah!> Patience for 3 weeks will pay off for years. <Indeed, thanks for sharing.>
Thanks again to all.
Gene
<Cheers, J -- >

Another Quarantine Convert Shares His Story!
I just wanted to write and let you guys know that you have gotten through to me finally. I am new to this hobby and I setup my tank (reef) and everything seemed to be going fine. My idea was that I was going to buy just a couple of fish and concentrate on the beautiful corals, so I didn't find it important that I should QT my fish, since it was only going to be a couple.
<I've heard that one before!>
I did, however, perform a fresh water dip my fish before putting them in the tank.
<Better than nothing!>
Well, the tank was up and running and all was great without any issues. Disease and parasite free, water great quality, corals and fish flourishing and I couldn't have been happier. I rolled the dice and it looked like Lady Luck was on my side. Well, I rolled one too many. My wife fell in love with this beautiful little fish called a Powder Blue Tang.
<Er, "Powder Blue Ich Magnet">
I looked it over, it looked healthy and was acting normal. I read a lot on Tangs but not on the Powder Blue. We decided to purchase it and took it home. I started reading on the internet (Wet Web Media  of course)  while the fish was being acclimated about the PB Tang and found that it is a very delicate fish that doesn't handle stress very well. So based on this information, and with my wallet being a lot lighter, I decided that after acclimation I would just skip the fresh water dip and put the fish directly into my main tank to try and minimize stress on the fish.
<Oops...Bad call, huh?>
Time went by and I felt like a big shot, because the fish seemed to be flourishing, eating good, swimming a lot, grazing, and over all just looking real healthy. Well I came home from work about 5 days after I bought him to find little white specs all over him so I ran to my local fish expert and talked to him about it. I started following his advise  and we fought for another two weeks but I ended up losing the fish.
<Bummer...>
Well, next thing I know I started loosing all my fish. Now I am down to two Chromis, and have lost a total of 4 other expensive fish. I was baffled and felt like I was loosing and uphill battle. So needless to say, I  have the two Chromis in my hospital tank being treated (just purchased HP tank) and I am letting my main tank go fallow for 4 weeks.
<Good strategy>
So the point that I am trying to make is I have learned my costly lesson and NOTHING will every go in my tank with out being QT and fresh water dipped first again.
<EXCELLENT!!! You are well on your way to much greater success in the future!>
I am purchasing a tank for QT before I purchase anymore fish, and I am praying that my Chromis make it. They look like they will, but I thought that before too.
<With prompt and proper medical intervention on your part, you'll save them!>
So to anyone that thinks they can roll the dice and skip the QT part remember the words of my good fish friend expert, "The only thing that every happens fast in this hobby is failure!"
<I could not have said it any better myself!>
Thanks for all the great work WWM and I enjoy reading and learning from you guys/girls everyday. Thanks again,
JB
<JB, on behalf of all of us at WWM, and on behalf of all of our many readers, I thank you for sharing your experience! Like you, we've all learned the hard way about the dangers of skipping quarantine. It is such a simple procedure that provides such significant benefits that it should be a basic part of every hobbyist's routine-just like feeding and water changes, etc. Keep spreading the word on this technique, and you'll certainly have assured that the PBT and other fishes did not die in vain. Best of luck to you in the future, my friend. Regards, Scott F>

Quarantine Query
My fish have been ich free for 30+ days. If I introduce a new fish (without first putting it in a quarantine tank for a couple of weeks), and there is suddenly an ich breakout, is it true that the new fish brought the parasites into the tank?
<In all likelihood, yes. Although, it is possible that there could be some dormant parasites which can strike when the opportunity arises (such as when fishes have their resistance compromised)>
Also, I have recently setup a 2.5 gallon hospital tank with a Millennium 1000 filter and 50 watt heater and 13watt light. Is this too small to keep small marine fish in for a 2 week period?
<Well, it depends what you mean by "small"! One or two fishes of one-to- two inches or so can be kept for the quarantine period, if attention is paid to water quality. By the way, quarantine should last at least 3 weeks for full efficiency>
What meds do the pros use in their quarantine tanks to quarantine new marine fish?
<Really, none. You don't generally need to use medications when you quarantine, unless the fishes being quarantined are sick to begin with. Sometimes, medication can cause more problems than it's worth if a fish doesn't need it>
How about inverts or corals? Should they be quarantined? Should meds be used on these?
<Yes to quarantine- No to medication>
Thanks!
<You're quite welcome! You might want to check out these articles by yours truly, which outline the quarantine process in more detail:   http://www.wetwebmedia.com/QuarMarFishes.htm
          http://www.wetwebmedia.com/quarinverts.htm
Hope this helps! Regards, Scott F>

Quarantine Question
I have never set up a quarantine tank as long as I have kept marine fish.
<Neither have I, until I unfortunately learned the hard way and introduced an "infected" fish into the main aquarium -- this was quite a hassle to deal with. I would highly recommend starting up a quarantine tank.>
I am planning on doing a large setup and thought that it would be a good idea to set up a quarantine tank.  What I don't understand is ok you put a fish in a Quarantine tank for say 3 weeks, ok the fish is showing no signs of stress.  So I put him in the main tank, this was not a stress for him and could he not introduce ich into the main tank?  I guess I am just not understanding how a Quarantine tank works.  Please explain to me the reason and logic behind these tanks.. thank you  Chris
<First off, let me state that a quarantine tank is only to help the fish already in the aquarium. By quarantining all new arrivals, you can make sure that the fish does not have any diseases that you may accidentally introduce to the fish in the main tank. By holding the fish for a period of 4-6 weeks, you can make sure that the fish is not carrying any diseases. You can also make sure to give the fish some specialized attention. It will be simple to get the fish to eat, especially when there are no competitors around waiting to get a meal. Second, if the fish does happen to get a disease, it can be easily treated. A quarantine tank can also double as a hospital tank for fish or injured fish. As an example, lets say you purchase a blue hippo tang (P. hepatus), which happens to be one of the fish which often gets ich in captivity. You then put the fish into quarantine and after several days the fish develops ich. This means that most likely the fish caught the parasites in a wholesaler or retail store. Because the fish is isolated, treating the fish is very easy when no invertebrates or other fish are involved. You then would have a variety of methods to choose from to fight the disease. I hope this answers your questions. Take Care, Graham.>