fluke update; plus Prazi, Pomacanthid dis f's     5/13/14
Hi Bob
<Robert>
I believe it is about a week since we last spoke. Since then, about 8 days ago, I have used Prazi pro on my tank, turning off my skimmer and uv light.
Both angelfish, the blue face, and French angel, whom each had one clouded eye, have improved 100 percent. Both eyes are now clear, and they are both eating.
<Ahh!>
So I believe it is safe to say, I did have a fluke infestation,
<VERY common w/ wild-caught angels... Should ALWAYS be treated prophylactically by importers... The better wholesalers do this... sometimes a few of the collectors>
that probably killed the last 4 angelfish I had in the last 8 weeks. My plan is to run it a few more days, totaling ten days, and then pulling it out getting skimmer and bio pellet reactor back online.
My question is, the blueface, although he is eating, and both of his eyes are now clear, looks to have some type of abrasion under his pectoral fins.
Looks kind of like someone took a scalpel, and removed about a 1/2 inch by 1/2 portion of his skin.
<Perhaps residual... from the Flukes and/or treatment>
My first guess was the flukes ate away at that area, but in reality this pretty much happened after 2-3 days of treating the tank. My next guess was some type of secondary bacterial infection. After scrolling the web a couple of days, I really do not know, and therefore I am unsure if I let it go, or pull him out and use some type of antibiotic on him.
<I'd leave off on further med.s>
Is this common with flukes, especially after treatment has already commenced?
Thanks
<Not uncommon. BobF>
Re: fluke update      5/13/14
Bob,
Glad to hear that. From what I understand, they were from QM, however, all they need is to come to my local lfs, go in same tank with someone who has flukes.
<Yes>
I am not one to believe in coincidences, so I have a hard time thinking the eyes just happen to clear up simultaneously, just 48 hours after Prazi pro.
I suppose its bad new and good news, knowing I treated it, but also bad knowing I lost quite a few fish most likely because of flukes, and I didn't treat properly then.
I have another question, different topic, so I will send it in a different email.
<Real good>
Thank you

help-angelfish. Using WWM; SW, hlth., flukes      5/4/14
Hey Bob-
A week or two ago I had emailed you about my continuous issue with keeping angelfish. Well after all my other fish were doing great, I decided to pick up a blue face angel (4 inches) and a 5 inch French angel. They were voracious eaters the first week, everything from PE Mysis, clam, krill, Nori, spectrum pellets and squid.
Well the last two days, each one of these angel fish has one cloudy eye. If I look super close at the eye, I can see little objects on eye that look like miniature contact lenses.
<... put in the WWM search tool: Angel cloudy eye.>
I am almost positive this is eye flukes (Neobenedenia?). I am also pretty sure this is what took over on my previous angelfish I have had.
<Possibly>
I did a PH, temp adjusted freshwater dip, for about 8 minutes, but it appears that wasn't enough.
Rather than lose a now 3rd batch of expensive angelfish, I am contemplating using Prazi pro on the tank. From what I have read, people have used it in reef tanks safely, and this is a fish only tank.
My question is, I just started using bio pellets about 2 weeks ago to help nitrates. Occasionally since using them, I have gotten mild bacterial blooms, where my ph fell from 7.9 to 7.7 (most likely due to oxygen being used by bacteria). The Prazi says to turn skimmer off, however, I feel I need that, certainly now for increased oxygen. Do you think I can leave skimmer on, and to just take cup off to allow bubbling water to return to sump?
Thanks
<And the two words: Eye Flukes. B>
Re: help-angelfish      5/4/14
Hey Bob-
<Rob>
Typically before I email you anything, I spend at least two days reading WWM and other various sources. I then think hard and through, and if I still am left guessing, that is when I break out the email.
<Oh? Oh.>
I see in most cases, with one cloudy eye, it is best left alone, and to improve on its own.
<Yes>
I would love to do that, but my recent track history shows these fish succumb to whatever it is in my tank, rather than improve. Perhaps I am just no good at keeping angelfish.
<Mmm; I don't believe in such notions>
So this was more of me reading on RC, TRT, etc, of people experiencing the same issue, using Prazi, and happy with the results.
<Yes...>
In hindsight, I strongly regret acquiring these fish. If my lfs would even take them back for free, let along, say 10 percent store credit, I would jump all over that. But he doesn't, so I want to try and make it work.
All said and done, I feel this is my best plan. However, with the implementation of the bio pellets, that I felt would help me long term, I know am having some bacterial blooms, which rob o2 levels.
The thing I am unsure of what to do is, leaving skimmer on, just pouring out of neck, to ensure better o2 levels.
<A good idea; adjunct to any treatment mode>
And now that I write this, in observing the tank, I can also tell you the blue face has one frayed fin. I have never seen anyone harass the fish, and it was not there last night before the lights went out, and I manually
turned them on this morning.
Again, I would love to have it take care of itself, but for some reason that notion in the past 12 weeks cost me >$1000
<Yeeikes!>
Thanks again, sorry for the frustration.
<Take your time... B>
Re: help-angelfish      5/5/14
Sounds good, Robby.
I will leave skimmer on, just open the gate valve wide open and have it circulate back into sump.
Once in, how long before the flukes start to pop off would you guess?
<... depends on species and treatment. Immediately to a few days>
If a few days (day, hours?) go by, and they are still there, than would it be safe to assume the cause is not flukes, or perhaps the product is defective?
<Good question (as I don't know a/the answer). I would assume either the product is defective, OR the test manner, OR that these were not Trematodes, OR whatever was there was not treat-able per the first and
second stmt. B>

Angelfish ; stkg. mortalities      4/17/14
Hey Bob,
<Robert>
Emailed you before about various topics. This next question is more of your opinion than an black or white matter.
In my FO system of 155 gallons, I successfully keep an Achilles tang, Powder Blue tang, Aussie Tusk, Sailfin Tang, Green Bird wrasse and a Maculiceps. My parameters are good (1.022 sg, 79 degrees F, Nitrite 0, Amm. 0, and Nitrates 40. I have in my opinion plenty of flow (2 return pumps @ 600 gph after head pressure, and an MP40 wavemaker) I use a UV light and oversized Protein skimmer. I also use only RO water.
For some reason, I can not keep angelfish alive. In the past month, I have tried a Queen Angel, Koran Angel, French Angel, and a Scribbled angel (albeit at different times) and have lost them all within a week. The seem to follow the same fate, they eat really good, and slowly develop cloudy eyes, random body spots (not Ich) and surely after die.
<Strange>
My only guesses as to why are 1. overcrowding, 2. Source of these angel fish. However, they all come in looking fine and eating.
<Mmm; and the other fishes listed... would not likely harass these Pomacanthids>
In your opinion, are angel fish just so hit or miss, that anything happens, or is there something I am missing? I feed Nori, 2 full sheets daily,
<Not much food value; good for filler for tangs>
Spectrum Thera Pellets, and frozen once a day. This consist of PE Mysis, squid, krill, clams and frozen angel and butterfly formula (san fran brand). I also soak frozen in Selcon twice a week. I do 15 percent water changes weekly, and have about 70 lbs of live rock.
Any suggestions or thoughts would be invaluable.
Thanks
<I'd try a better source... maybe even mail-order (Dr.s F & S)... and quarantine the new Angel for a week or two. BobF>
Re: Angelfish     4/17/14
Thank you, Bob.
<Welcome>
One minor detail I did leave out, is upon death of the Angel fish, I removed them at once, and placed in fresh RO water, (more so to preserve fish until I find suitable grave, as opposed to letting them rot in the open) and have discovered some fluke like objects popping off.
<Likely are/were Trematodes... easily defeated/removed via pH adjusted FW (plus formalin if I were doing it) dips...>
Not many, I have seen much heavier infestations in fish that are alive.
However they are there, and I do not see them on my other fish, even while FW dipping. Are flukes always present in the fish, and that is normal, or could this have been the silent killer.
<... there are some flukes that are more family, genus, even species specific. I'd be reading on WWM re... perhaps the use of cleaner organisms.
B>