|
|
FAQs on Acclimation Chemicals
Related Articles: Acclimation,
Acclimating Invertebrates, Acclimating
Symbiotic Reef Invertebrates to Captive Lighting, Methylene
Blue, Related FAQs: Acclimation
1, Acclimation 2,
Acclimation 3, & FAQs on Acclimation:
Rationale/Use, Tools/Gear,
Methods, Controversies,
Troubles/fixing, & Acclimating
Invertebrates,
Acclimation of Livestock in the Business,
Dips/Baths 1,
Best Quarantine FAQs,
Quarantine, |
Some ref.s, some places, folks suggest different adjuncts... do read
thoroughly re specific uses, cautionary remarks |
Colloidal Silver?
On another board someone recommends over and
over putting a few drops of colloidal silver into the bag new fish come
in, while acclimating them, as a way of preventing/eliminating disease,
etc. Claims always has healthy fish, never introduces disease.
Can
anyone at WWM confirm this? Has anyone done it? Just curious.
<There were some fish medications that used to contain silver salts...
there is need to be within a narrow margin of concentration of actual
silver ions... so, no to "putting a few drops" into a "bag". Some folks
still use Methylene blue (mainly for freshwater) or furan compounds in
their shipping water... these are safe, effective. Bob Fenner>
Treating new fish 6/18/03
Hello Anthony,
<cheers, mate>
I
thought about Formalin, but was worried about its effects on the filter
(which is biological)?
<valid... but not so severe as many other meds
(like copper, Methylene blue, erythromycin, etc)>
I will consider a
formalin dip, the MelaFix was added because i had some and i thought it
would be fine with the shark.
<agreed... I do believe it is safe for
the shark... and safe for the parasites too <G>>
how lo would you say
to lower the salinity by (if the shark was removed)?
<1.018>
I am
completely struck on transshipped marines and i am due a list from
Hawaii. Can you suggest any thing from there that is really good or
worth having?
<many fine wrasses, a few dwarf angels... beautiful
triggers and Tobies (dwarf puffers)...>
in my mind i am thinking
flame angels, potters angel, Lemonpeel angels, yellow Sailfin tangs,
chevron tangs - common but sought after!
<the tangs yes... very much.
Great fishes and hardy. The Potters... no way. They are so delicate that
many don't even make it to the US mainland. Not a strong fish under any
circumstance... lets leave those beauties in the sea. Lemonpeels and
Flames can be quite hardy once established though. Very fine.>
Regards, Sam
<best regards, Anthony>
Medication for adding fish 9/13/05
Bob, can you take
a look at this message regarding the "secret formula". Do you know
of any such thing?
Regards,
Salty
<I also know of no such
"magic herbal remedy"... RMF>
Medication for adding fish
Hello:
About 6 years ago I started in the hobby of keeping a fish
only marine aquarium.
Like most beginners, my luck with keeping
the fish alive for an extended period of time (more than 1 year) was
severely limited.
I never had any luck with certain species,
specifically the Blue (Hippo) Tang... and not quite sure why.
I
have a 125 gallon tank. With around 250lbs of live rock. Water
quality was "theoretically" perfect, yet the Blue Tangs I would keep
would perish within a few weeks or couple of months.
Anyway,
about 3 years ago, I visited a local fish store and I was discussing
this problem with the owner of the store and he sold me a
"medication" to add to the tank when the fish were showing signs of
stress or when I was adding a new fish to the tank. This
"medication" was contained in 2 small (5 ml.) dropper bottles,
labeled "Part A" and "Part B" - and was sold in a small clear
plastic box. I was informed that this product was only available to
the trade to assist in reducing stress on the fish after
transportation. I have no idea what this product was (it was
explained as a herbal-based medication)
The store owner said he
wasn't supposed to sell this medication... although I'm not sure why
- but it worked absolute wonders.
Anyway - to cut a long story
short, I purchased another Blue Tang and used this medication when
adding the fish to my tank. The fish showed absolutely no signs of
stress (which is very rare for Blue Tangs). A couple of drops (of
each part) of this medicine on day one, and another drop of each 4
days later helped this Tang tremendously. Also, a couple of other
fish that were rather lethargic, were revitalized - especially a
Harlequin Tuskfish.
The entire tank thrived for about 2 and a
half years... until a "bad accident" that occurred when we had our
house redecorated, wiped out the entire tank - which was, at the
time, rather annoying and disappointing.
I am in the process of
re-establishing the tank, and have had it set up for 6 weeks without
adding any fish yet.
Do you have any idea what this "medication"
was and where I can get it from - it really worked miracles.
Also, I plan to do fish-only again and want to select colorful fish
that are quite hardy... in this case what would you recommend.
Any info you could provide is greatly appreciated. <Jeff, I know of
no "secret" formula for stressed out fish. Will run this by Mr.
Fenner for his input. As far as starting over, I suggest you search
our WWM site, keywords, "startup" and "quarantine". If things are
done properly, no special medication should ever be needed. As to
fish, clowns, Dottybacks and wrasses are all quite colorful and
hardy. James (Salty Dog)>
Thanks,
JeffMedication for
adding fish 9/16/05
Would the product name "Reef
Remedy" possibly be the product I'm looking for? <I've never heard
of the product.>
I think this might have been the name of the
product, since I found a piece of paper in my cabinet that had this
name written on it.
Are you familiar with such a product? <No>
I just remember it working wonders for the fish, especially
when acclimating.
Finally, do you have any comments or opinions
on the products Bio-Spira Marine (for saltwater) and Purigen (by
Seachem) filter absorbent for organics and nitrogenous waste
removal. Both of these products have come highly recommended by my
local FSH. <I prefer Chemi-Pure myself. I've heard Purigen works
well also, but never used Spira Marine and have heard nothing about
the product. James (Salty Dog)>
Thanks,
Jeff |
Medication for adding fish 9/13/05
Bob, can you take a
look at this message regarding the "secret formula". Do you know of any
such thing?
Regards,
Salty
<I also know of no such "magic
herbal remedy"... RMF>
Medication for adding fish
Hello:
About
6 years ago I started in the hobby of keeping a fish only marine
aquarium.
Like most beginners, my luck with keeping the fish alive
for an extended period of time (more than 1 year) was severely limited.
I never had any luck with certain species, specifically the Blue (Hippo)
Tang... and not quite sure why.
I have a 125 gallon tank. With around
250lbs of live rock. Water quality was "theoretically" perfect, yet the
Blue Tangs I would keep would perish within a few weeks or couple of
months.
Anyway, about 3 years ago, I visited a local fish store and I
was discussing this problem with the owner of the store and he sold me a
"medication" to add to the tank when the fish were showing signs of
stress or when I was adding a new fish to the tank. This "medication"
was contained in 2 small (5 ml.) dropper bottles, labeled "Part A" and
"Part B" - and was sold in a small clear plastic box. I was informed
that this product was only available to the trade to assist in reducing
stress on the fish after transportation. I have no idea what this
product was (it was explained as a herbal-based medication)
The store
owner said he wasn't supposed to sell this medication... although I'm
not sure why - but it worked absolute wonders.
Anyway - to cut a long
story short, I purchased another Blue Tang and used this medication when
adding the fish to my tank. The fish showed absolutely no signs of
stress (which is very rare for Blue Tangs). A couple of drops (of each
part) of this medicine on day one, and another drop of each 4 days later
helped this Tang tremendously. Also, a couple of other fish that were
rather lethargic, were revitalized - especially a Harlequin Tuskfish.
The entire tank thrived for about 2 and a half years... until a "bad
accident" that occurred when we had our house redecorated, wiped out the
entire tank - which was, at the time, rather annoying and disappointing.
I am in the process of re-establishing the tank, and have had it set up
for 6 weeks without adding any fish yet.
Do you have any idea what
this "medication" was and where I can get it from - it really worked
miracles.
Also, I plan to do fish-only again and want to select
colorful fish that are quite hardy... in this case what would you
recommend.
Any info you could provide is greatly appreciated. <Jeff,
I know of no "secret" formula for stressed out fish. Will run this by
Mr. Fenner for his input. As far as starting over, I suggest you search
our WWM site, keywords, "startup" and "quarantine". If things are done
properly, no special medication should ever be needed. As to fish,
clowns, Dottybacks and wrasses are all quite colorful and hardy. James
(Salty Dog)>
Thanks,
Jeff Medication for adding fish
9/16/05
Would the product name "Reef Remedy" possibly be the
product I'm looking for? <I've never heard of the product.>
I think
this might have been the name of the product, since I found a piece of
paper in my cabinet that had this name written on it.
Are you
familiar with such a product? <No>
I just remember it working
wonders for the fish, especially when acclimating.
Finally, do you
have any comments or opinions on the products Bio-Spira Marine (for
saltwater) and Purigen (by Seachem) filter absorbent for organics and
nitrogenous waste removal. Both of these products have come highly
recommended by my local FSH. <I prefer Chemi-Pure myself. I've heard
Purigen works well also, but never used Spira Marine and have heard
nothing about the product. James (Salty Dog)>
Thanks,
Jeff
Emperor Angel, Breathing and Vertical - 5/11/06
Hi
All,
<Dave>
I am a long time reader, first time writer who
is (or more accurately, whose fish is) potentially quickly running
out of options.
I purchased a changing Emperor Angel
from saltwaterfish.com. I have never before had any troubles with
them other than this. I followed my usual acclimation procedure. I
opened the bag and dripped for four hours to acclimate him to my QT
system. The acclimation container was dosed with Para Guard. This
took place last night.
<... four hours? ParaGuard
has a toxic component>
Since I opened the bag and first looked
at him, he has been breathing very heavily and bobbing in a vertical
position, head down.
<Did you match the pH of the drip water
with that in the shipping bag?>
The vendor assured me that the
fish is merely in shock from the stress of shipping and that he
would calm down.
<Something to hope for>
I don't believe
that; I have seen this sort of thing happen before and an shocked
fish usually comes around
within 12 hours. This fish has been
in the tank now for over 24 hours and has shown no signs whatsoever
of improvement.
<No quarantine?>
He continues to breathe
at give or take 170 gill movements/minute, and bob head down,
<Very bad signs>
usually at the top of the tank but will
occasionally move down some.
The current seems to toss him
around and when it gets him completely upside down he rights himself
only to resume his vertical position. He is refusing food. He is
sharing the QT system with an Assasi Trigger (separated by eggcrate,
of course) who is eating fine and seems to be in perfect health.
<Oh! Good>
I am worried that I am dealing with disease, possibly
the early stages of Marine Velvet.
<Mmm, not likely>
The
fish has shown no physical signs other than what I described though;
no spots, no off colors, no scratching. I don't
want to dip him
if unnecessary as I don't want to stress the fish any further. I
have not seen any feces to know if internal bacterial may be
to
blame.
What action would you recommend, if any?
Thanks in advance,
Dave
<Is a bit late, but to have matched
the pH... Please see here:
http://wetwebmedia.com/acclimat.htm
Particularly the
Guerilla piece below... This is highly likely the root cause of
trouble here... shock, hemolysis from pH shift, endogenous
ammonia... perhaps with a Malachite burn to boot:
http://seachem.com/products/product_pages/ParaGuard.html
...
I would try to stabilize this animal, leave the lights off... and
add a pentose or hexose sugar as proscribed on WWM. Bob Fenner>
Re: Emperor Angel, Breathing and Vertical - 5/11/06
Bob,
<Dave>
Thanks for your quick reply. I might not have
been completely clear in my message, but wanted to address your
concerns to clarify if I had done something wrong.
<Let's do... am a bit blurry from travel/ing>
Unfortunately, the
fish died overnight. I am working with the vendor.
However, I
think it prudent to do a "post-mortem" on my acclimation procedure
to make sure I did what I should have done.
<Good
idea>
First, I acclimated over four hours, but only introduced
Para Guard during the last hour of the acclimation. I followed the
directions on the bottle to the letter.
<Mmm, am
still (as you will find... from long practice) not a fan of using
Malachite... the principal ingredient, other than "aldehydes" in
this fine SeaChem product... in dips for newly arrived marine
fishes>
Second, the drip water was from the quarantine tank
which had in turn come from the main tank, which was already at
8.3. You are correct in
assuming that I did not test the PH of
the bag water and match it to the tank water.
<You will find as
well that this is an incredibly important step in moving marines
around in "long time" conditions... bringing livestock from one
system quickly (let's say an hour or so) from/to another is a very
different matter>
I have never performed that step, but after
perusing the acclimation guide (quickly) it looks like you are
talking about a FW dip.
<Mmm, no... this is a different
concept/idea... protocol>
That is not a step I performed. I
acclimated him to the QT tank's seawater.
Third, the
fish exhibited this behavior even before I removed him from the
bag. Nothing changed about his behavior at any time, what I saw
when I peered into the bag even before cutting it open is what I
described, ergo he did not take on this behavior during the
procedure, but rather he arrived this way.
<Yes...
not unusual for marine angels, most marine fish groups to exhibit
this sort of behavior... indicative of "shipping stress"... low pH,
coupled with low dissolved oxygen, likely high CO2/carbonic acid
concentration...>
Fourth, when I say the fish has been in the
tank for 24 hours I mean the quarantine tank, but I think you
realized that further on in my message.
<Yes>
Given these
clarifications, would you still say something was wrong with the way
I did things, or was the fish doomed from the start?
Thanks again for your help so far!
Dave
<Mmm, a
matter of speculation/s and a few possible inputs, but if you had a
hundred, a thousand such fishes to process, you'd find that using
Methylene Blue, eschewing the use of Malachite Green, and especially
adjusting/matching the shipping water pH to the acclimation/dip
water would save a significant number of animals... this has become
an "industry practice" of high regard... largely due to the efforts
of Phil Shane/Quality Marine and the fine folks at TMC in the UK...
to give credit where it's due. Bob Fenner> |
Freshwater bath add-ons ... good ideas 5/26/06
Hello,
<Jonathan>
A strange thought occurred to me today. I was
remembering that marine fish 'drink water' to maintain their osmotic
balance, thus you can use a vitamin supplement in their water and they
will passively absorb some. And fish often times initially come in
underfed / malnourished.
<This is so>
Do you think it would
worth it if a put some VitaChem or liquid gold in their freshwater bath?
<Can help... though minimally due to the short duration of such
dips/baths>
Its usually only a bath for about 7 minutes duration,
but in that time I can see their gills are really pumping and their
probably taking in water faster than normal, being that their stressed /
surprised.
Also I'm thinking that besides the load parasites that
meet their doom in the freshwater, a fish also sheds off some of its
slime coat while in the freshwater bath.
<Yes>
Do you think wise
to place the fish in a bucket of tank water with NovAqua or any other
artificial slime coat product?
<As a S.O.P. I have done this for
decades in commercial settings, yes>
I ask to place in a separate
bucket afterwards because I assume if I take a squirt of NovAqua while a
begin the bath it will negate some of bath, the artificial slime coat
benefiting the parasites as they hide beneath it.
<Mmm, no... For
the most part all get sloughed off...>
I suppose I could squirt in
a little NovAqua toward then end of the bath. What do you think?
<Is what I do, endorse... Please read here:
http://wetwebmedia.com/acclimat.htm>
[p.s. Do you respond in
email to questions or do I look them up on the site?]
<Both. Cheers,
Bob Fenner> Guerilla
Acclimation Techniques 7/5/08
Does this page exist anymore?
<Mmm, yes... renamed: http://wetwebmedia.com/acclimat.htm >
I have
read the acclimation page, but in the FAQs people seem to reference
another method (guerilla) and several chemicals not used in the
acclimation technique on the current acclimation article page. Thanks
Matthew Harless
<Re-named Commercial instead of Guerilla... more PC?
Bob Fenner>
Shipment coming tomorrow... acclimation question
Hi Jason,
(or Bob if you're back).
Thanks for being there with all the
great assistance!
<You are welcome by both of us>
Tomorrow I
will receive my first shipment of mail-order livestock, (from
FFExpress) and I think I'm ready. I have read and re-read your page
on acclimation (www.wetwebmedia.com/acclimat.htm), and am all set up
to follow the saltwater fish "guerilla" acclimation technique.
I
have just a couple small questions:
#1 Using the kitty litter
boxes, is it safe to acclimate several fish in the same container at
the same time (as long as they are not the types to be aggressive
towards each other)?
<Yes, quite safe... In wholesale practice we
often separate venomous fishes (e.g. Scorpionfishes, plotosid
catfishes...) and larger, very aggressive fishes (e.g. triggers),
but otherwise, most often mix together as bags are opened/processed>
#2 Though it indicates that inverts, etc "merit a separate
discussion",
I couldn't find anything, so maybe you could give me
counsel on the few non-fish I'm getting:
a. 3 cleaner shrimp
b. 3 peppermint shrimp
c. 1 fire cleaner shrimp
d. 1 green
bubble anemone
e. 1 Indonesian red Ricordea
<I would place all
of the shrimps together for acclimation, and the two cnidarians
together... but do "drain" (I strain with hand movement) the
anemone's shipping water in moving it to the acclimation tray>
Thanks So Much!
Jim Raub
<Be chatting. Bob Fenner>Re:
Shipment coming tomorrow... acclimation question
Hi Guys (and
welcome back, Bob).
<Hello and thank you>
Sorry to be dense,
here, but I just want to confirm that the same fresh water,
pH-adjusted, PVP, Meth blue, Maracide, Maracyn acclimation solution
I will use on the fish is A OK for the shrimp and cnidarians.
<Mmm, not freshwater... I would use the same other components, but
with seawater of about the same density as the shipping water the
non-fishes are in>
Also, confirming that unlike with the fish,
where we keep their water and add in the acclimation solution, I
should try to drain away as much of the shipping water as possible
from the cnidarians, and basically just immerse them into the
acclimation solution.
(That hand-straining thing... should I
worry about being stung?)
<Yes to the technique and no problem
with the calloused parts of your hands... do try to keep the
stinging-celled animals off your wrist skin... and take care to wash
your hands after handling... can be a real owee on your mucus
membranes...>
Really Sincere Thanks and Appreciation for all your
help!
Jim Raub
<A pleasure my friend. Bob Fenner> |
Questions on acclimating fish for retail sales..
Hi Bob,
My
name is Leland Foley and I am starting a Marine Fish/Reef Retail store.
<Outstanding... I will gladly shake the hand of anyone who would (try
to) be self-employed. Welcome to our industry>
I have worked in many
other retail stores, including a couple of years for Inland Aquatics.
<Ahh, Morgan Lidster and I are known to each other>
Anyway, I have
been around long enough to learn a great deal about fish acclimation,
and I really like the way you suggest to acclimate marine fish, but I
have a few questions.
<Please>
1.) How do you incorporate dips
into your Guerilla Acclimation Techniques?
I believe, as I'm sure you
do as well, that the PVP based dechlorinator, in combination with the
Methylene blue really helps the fish to survive the stresses of
shipping,
<Yes>
but after this acclimation procedure, would it be
too stressful to put them into a formalin dip before putting them into
the main system tanks?
<Good question... as it has the usual (lame)
"it depends"... by and large if most all marine fish livestock is in
"good enough" shape from this point in an/the acclimation protocol, it's
"probably okay" (more beneficial than potentially detrimental) to
proceed with another dipping/bath sequence...>
I'm a strong believer
in formalin dips and freshwater dips. They are primarily what I use when
I receive a shipment of fish, because I'm sure as you know Clownfishes,
and others will die of Brooklynella or crypto quite quickly if not
treated immediately upon arrival.
<Agreed, especially with Clowns>
My acclimation procedure consists of floating the bags to equalize the
temps, and then in small batches putting the fish into a saltwater and
Formalin dip, or a straight freshwater dip with bicarbonate. I've found
that a great deal of fish will die in a freshwater dip, but do just fine
in a saltwater with formalin dip.
<As always... intelligence and
experience go into deciding/judging dip types, duration...>
Then the
fish are removed from the dip and placed into a quarantine system (500
gal.) that is run by oversized wet/dries, mild protein skimming, and
very strong U.V. sterilization. The fish are given high quality fresh
seafood (shrimp, squid, marine fish, etc..) treated with garlic and
Metronidazole for the first week then flake foods and various frozen
foods are introduced.
<Wow, quite an expensive undertaking... but
worth it>
I only use the garlic as a flavor enhancer, it might help
remove worms, but this is not the primary reason I use it.
<I
understand>
If a fish pops up with a bacterial infection we dip it
again and carefully keep it overfed. If ich pops up on 3 or more fish we
add copper to the system.
Which brings me to my last question,
2.)
What form of copper chelated or non-chelated can be used with UV
sterilizers on? Or better yet what brand do you recommend?
<In a
large operation, volume or livestock flow-wise, non-chelated like the
Kordon or Aquarium Systems product... Wouldn't, don't use chelated
varieties on sleeved or non-sleeved UVs>
Sorry for the long post, but
as you know this is what makes or breaks ones profits in this industry,
<I do know this... agree. Please make it known if I may be of
assistance. Bob Fenner>
Thanks,
-Leland Foley
|
|
