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Naso tang floating at surface after transport and freshwater
dip 6/22/17
sudden loss of Naso; Siganid comp.?
3/6/14
Naso death 10/14/10 Vlamingi Tang: HLLE\Lateral Line Disease.
10/6/2009 Plump, puking Naso 03/11/09 Sick Tang 7/4/08 Hi Bob. I have emailed you guys before with no response so hopefully my luck will be better this time. I have a Vlamingi tang in my 150g and she has developed some sort of parasite or is getting HLLE. Honestly it's hard for me to tell. My tank parameters are in the ok range ammonia-0 nitrite-0 nitrate- about 10ppm PH- a little low at 8.1 salinity- a little high at 1.027. <This is fine> Here is when it started. You can see she has some ich and also the two small bumps under her eye. Here you can see that the ich has cleared up, but the bumps are spreading and becoming worse. About one to two weeks later is has progressed into this. All the way around her eye and in the pic you can even see something small and pink coming out of one of the bumps. She has a good all around diet which consists of algae sheets, frozen Mysis, frozen brine w/Spirulina, all soaked in garlic. She is still eating frequently. The only thing I can think of is to try a freshwater dip, but I wanted an experts opinion. Thank you for your time. -Chad <Likely this Acanthurus had/has some protozoan parasite fauna from the wild... I'd try bolstering its immune system via the foods. See WWM re. Bob Fenner>
Marine Question, Naso death... 7/22/07 Further to this, I wanted to add the Naso turned totally black and hid before he died, very strange looking! <Mmm, just looking at the info. below... a seventy gallon is too small for a Tang of this genus (as posted on WWM), and the Boxfish (as you seem to state) is mis-placed here...> And I plan to setup a QT this weekend. I have a 10 gallon that till be perfect. I did not know about this till I read your site. Great idea! <Mmm... I do wish we had more input to help you before this incident. Bob Fenner>
Naso Tang - all but gone 6/5/07 I tried to register on your website, but there seems to be a problem with the site. Hopefully you can give me some much needed advice to save my tang! <The Forum, WetWebFotos is controlled by Zo... who is obviously elsewhere> State of the tank: 150gl tank, all levels are spot on and the tank is lightly loaded as we're growing it slowly. Currently we only have the 1 Naso (4"- that's in big trouble), 1 Hippo (4"), 1 banana wrasse & 1 Christmas wrasse (both about 4"), 2- 3striped, 2 - yellow tail, 1 - solid blue all between 1 - 2" (these are what's left of the 9 starter fish from a little of a year ago). All of these fish have been cohabitating nicely for over a year, with the exception of the Hippo which we just added within the last month. I noticed approximate 1 week ago that the yellow portion on the back of the Naso's tail fin was starting to have some discoloration (brown areas). Yesterday, I notice that the yellow portion of the forehead was also getting some very small brown dots (not bumps - just color change). This morning I found him all but dead on the bottom of the tank (already in the "C" form, nose & tail touching bottom with body arched). <Very bad...> I instantly moved him into QT, added stress coat and Maracyn Plus Anti bacteria. The QT was only set up this morning and I used the water from the main tank so the water temp, salinity, etc. was the same. The only change (since adding the Hippo), is that we have increased the frequency of feeding seaweed clips. I ran out of the green so he's been taking in more purple this past week. He was eating well up until 2 days ago when I noticed he wasn't eating up the Mysis as he typically does. He's barely hanging on, and I appreciate any assistance you can offer. Warm aloha and Mahalo nui loa, (thank you very much) Sandy Tichy <How long have you had this Naso lituratus? It may be that it "came with" an internal complaint... Otherwise, there may be a nutritional (deficiency) issue here... there are some other much more minor possibilities... You have read here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/naso_lituratus.htm and the linked files above? Bob Fenner> Ich help...maybe... Naso... hlth... 2/28/07 Hello All, <Kesha> I just wanted to let you know that your site is the most informative site that I have ever come across and I've been in the hobby since 2001. <Ahh!> I just have a few questions that I cannot get answered anywhere else. I have been running this tank since August 2005. It is a 75g all glass aquarium with 260w pc lighting and a moonlight 120lbs of LR, 60lbs of LS. ProClear wet/dry filter system with 3 add'l power heads for water movement. 4 domino damsels <Yikes! Biters!> 3 striped damsels 3 clownfish (2 false & 1 pink skunk) 1 tang 2 Hawaiian feather dusters 4 huge turbo snails & quite a few hermit crabs Water Parameters before putting Tang & feather duster in tank Ammonia 0 Nitrite 0 Nitrate 0 Ph 8.2 Done a 30% water change on Monday with distilled water and used 6 gallons of premixed seawater from LFS. I recently bought a Naso Tang <Mmm... needs more room than this> & feather duster about 4 days ago and since then the ammonia is at 0.25ppm & nitrate is at 20ppm. Ph is still the same as well as nitrite. 2 days after getting it, a white spot appeared on the fin near the end of it, has not been rubbing up against any of the rocks and no other spots has appeared. Was a bit worried about his color because it looks as if you can see through his body. Went to LFS and they said its probably cauliflower and antibiotics will help it! (WHAT???) <... I don't know what they're referring to either here... A viral issue like Lymphocystis... as "Cauliflower?"... Antibiotics won't cure this... and I do NOT encourage you to put them in your main display at any length> I researched it and cannot find anything on it. <Mmm... well... might be "just a dot"... from stress, getting whacked by a net... If only one, discrete... no other indications... I would not panic> As for the color I was told to get a ground probe, because the electrical currents running through the tank was causing this to happen. <... no... dismal> None of the other fish in the aquarium seem to have anything wrong with them and just wondered if this is the start of a disease problem? <Not likely... however... You are playing a sort of Russian Roulette by not adhering to some sort of quarantine... at least dip/bath procedure...> Please HELP. Also, do tangs normally try to eat the feather dusters? <Some can, do, yes> My tang is going to town on the ends of the dusters. Thanks so much, Kesha <... Quarantine... Observation for now... a much larger... at least six foot long systems... for the genus Naso... Bob Fenner> Naso Tang.. Acclimation.. Environment 2/27/07 Hope you can provide some direction. <Should be no problem.> This is my second attempt at acclimating a Naso. First Naso lasted 5 days (ate Mysis shrimp for 1st 3 days then ate nothing). I prepared to try again. I am waiting to see if the Naso at my LFS will take flake food (something I did not do the first time around). <Flake food alone is not going to do it.> Do you know of any "must-do's" that I should be concerned with to make sure the acclimation process goes smoothly. Specifically around best types of "veggie" foods to start the new Naso off with. I have a 55 gal tank with good water quality with one exception. <Off to a bad start with a 55. Tangs are grazers and constantly swim in search of food. Your tank is much too small for keeping such in a healthy state.> I recently had a nitrate spike (up to 20 PPM) potentially due to over use of phytoplankton. I perform regular (weekly) water changes and have been doing 2 water changes (5 gal each) twice a week since discovering the elevated nitrates. At what level of nitrates should I be concerned with when acclimated a new fish like a Naso Tang. In other words is 20 PPM too much for acclimation? <Tangs enjoy pristine water quality, so, the lower the nitrate level, the better. Do read here and related links for the info you seek. http://www.wetwebmedia.com/naso.htm http://www.wetwebmedia.com/acclimat.htm> Thanks for the advice. <You're welcome. James (Salty Dog) GJB Anemone sting on Blonde Naso? Velvet? Fungus? - Urgent 12/5/06 Dear Bob and Friends, <Oh, yes> I have a question about my 7" Blonde Naso Tang. I noticed a patch of white/grey discoloration and fuzziness with at least one tiny "fuzz ball" attached, right next to the spines on his right side. The patch is about a square inch in size. I would've sent a picture but he moves to quickly to get a good shot. He's had a very slight cloudiness on his right eye for several weeks. He had a rough time getting from the ocean to my tank, <Common with this genus of fast-moving, some almost-pelagic fishes> a case of ich accompanied by a hunger strike that lasted almost 3 weeks (the ich lasted only one week). He's been eating ferociously ever since he got healthy (about 3 weeks ago) but was left with what I'd describe as scars or small (about an 1/8th of an inch) lighter patches on his skin. Like I said he's eating like crazy, has regained all the wait he lost, seems "happy" regardless of the new patch. No scratching, no heavy breathing, pretty much the king of the tank. <A good position> I also noticed my small (about 2 inches) Bubble Tip Anemone sitting about a foot and a half from where he's been happily living for 2 months. He was deflated and did not look good. Through research on your sight I've come to the hopeful conclusion that my Naso may have accidentally whipped the Anemone with his tale <tail> , causing the Anemone to become dislodged and leaving a fuzzy patch on his skin. Can an Anemone do this? <Mmm, yes> I hope this is what happened because I had a case of Velvet wipe out my entire tank 6 months ago resulting in a total overhaul and rebuild (added a refugium with green Caulerpa, increased flow 3 fold, added a chiller and UV sterilizer). This doesn't look like Velvet but I could easily be wrong, we'll see if it's grown in size tomorrow. Other possibilities are bacterial or fungal infection. <I do doubt that this is Velvet/Amyloodinium... if so, most likely all your fishes would be languishing or dead at this point> Regardless, I'm not sure what to do. Medicating him would mean medicating the entire tank, live rock, live sand, cleaner shrimp, hermit crabs, snails, and 8 other fishes. There's no way I'm getting him out without pulling out 200 pounds of rock (that took me 8 hours to set up..). <Mmm... not necessarily... the type/kind of "medicating" I would do is through this and the other fish's foods... soaking and/or coating them in mainly a vitamin supplement product at this point... Very likely (along with good husbandry period) this will "do it"... the observed markings could in all likelihood be resultant from stress, troubles from three weeks plus back...> I did add a large Maroon Clown 4 days ago with no quarantine (my bad). I know I shouldn't assume any fish is healthy but he's been in my LFS's Coral system for at least 3 months. I'd been trying to get them to catch him for a month and a half and they finally succeeded (don't ever let a fish store tell you a fish isn't for sale! hehe). Well he looked healthy then, and looks healthy now, He's the only addition I've had for the last few weeks. I think my water quality is good. I've been doing 10% weekly water changes with R/O water, specific gravity is 1.019, <This needs to be higher... esp. for the anemone's sake... 1.025... Raise the Spg slowly> ammonia 0, Nitrite 0, nitrate 5-10 ppm, PH 8.3, temperature never goes beyond 77-79 degrees. Tons of purple coralline algae growing. I feed a combo of Angel formula, Mysis shrimp, Brine shrimp, squid, chopped krill, Spirulina flakes, brown and green seaweed on clips. Tank is six feet long, <A good absolute minimum for a Naso sp.> 135 gallons (I know its a bit small for this fish but I aquascaped the rock to create a lot of open space and plan on upgrading to a 300 gallon tank in a year or two), sump and refugium are each 30 gallons. All other fish look and are acting healthy and normal. So what should I do? 20% Water change and wait it out? Anything I can do? I'll try to take a picture if it will help, although I'm not sure how it'll come out. <The supplementation of foods mentioned is what/all I would do> On a side note, I can't seem to control the brown algae growing on the fine grain 4" deep sand bed. I stir it up and it grows back within 2 hours. I have about 450 watts of daylight and actinic light bulbs on for 6 hours a day. Any suggestions? <Read here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/brownalgcontfaqs.htm and the linked files above...> I want to thank you so much for your help. I read through your web site constantly and have found it to be EXTREMELY helpful. I must spend an hour a day on your site. I am very grateful for the wealth of information you provide. I'd love to meet you guys out in Hawaii one of these days. Thanks again for your help! Chad D. <Am out on the Big Island esp. ever few to handful of months... w/ some of the WWM Crew generally. BobF> Problems with Naso tang 10/26/06 Hi, Good afternoon everyone! In my tank with a flame Angel, a Yellow Tang, a Naso tang, two domino damsels, <Can be quite territorial to downright mean> two Bubbletip anemones, <Not usually compatible unless clones or in very large systems> a finger leather coral...up to yesterday night I had a clarkii clown in it but took it out because he was chasing the flame angel and I didn't want to lose my flame angel (clarkii clown is in another tank). This process of taking him out was very difficult (he was very fast swimming and hiding in all the rocks) therefore it took us 30 minutes to get him out... we also rearranged the rocks after that. We have a protein skimmer and a UV sterilizer and a power filter and we constantly check the water and its always perfect. We ended up going to bed at about 4:30 am and it was perfect all the fishes were doing fine, even the clarkii in the other tank. When I woke up this morning everyone was fine but I couldn't seem to find my Naso tang... when I finally did he was in a corner in a posing position hardly moving its fins, he is usually a light gray but today he was very dark gray almost black.. he had white spots all over his body (he have had this before usually when he gets scared) <Yes... is likely still upset re the commotion yesterday, early morning> but the neon blue in his eyelids, top of his top fin and bottom one disappeared like faded into white and almost all the other color faded... the only remaining color is the dark gray of his body and the yellow that on top of his eyes... Could all this be stress or he might have gotten some kind of parasite? <Just the former> All the other fishes are doing fine if not better than yesterday but he is not doing well... he is my favorite fish and I am very worried... please help me! I really don't know what to do.. I also have had him for like two months and has always done great.. he was very healthy , ate everything, very playful and peaceful... thanks you! Christina Ruales <Mmm, Naso species need systems of at least six feet in length... Please read here: http://wetwebmedia.com/nasosysfaqs.htm and the linked files above. Bob Fenner> A Tale of Two Dead Naso Tangs - 09/17/06 Hello, <<Good
Morning>> I am writing you and talking to anyone else I could
think off. <<Wise not to limit yourself to a single source of
information/advice/opinion>> This past week I lost a pair of Naso
tangs. <<Sorry to hear...>> I am devastated over this for a
number of reasons, but mostly because I can't find an answer to why
they died. Before I ask you to give some thoughts on what you think
might of happened let me give you as many details and variables I can.
<<Thank you…always helpful>> The tank is a 350 gallon
fish/reef tank. I keep a variety of angels and tangs, clowns and
damsels. There are also inverts like shrimp, snails and crabs. There
are not a lot of corals at this time but the idea for the tank is to
keep a number of corals with larger variety of fish not usually kept in
a reef. <<I see...and researching re to assure/maintain
compatibility I'll assume...>> There are a few LPS and SPS
corals along with a few soft leathers. <<Mmm...with "variety
of angels"?>> I do have to be very careful in what corals I
choose because of the types of fish. <<Ah yes!>> The larger
of the tangs was a Hawaiian Naso the other was a smaller Red Sea
blonde. <<Hmm...ever considered a "biotope"
display?>> I know typically these species are not kept together
but they have done very well often swimming side by side and staying
together at night. The tank has ample swimming room and the aquascaping
is such it gives the fish room to swim in a big circle.
<<Excellent>> The tank has been established for 4 years.
Only up until last year I started to get into corals having spent the
money to have a dedicated electrical circuit for the lights and pumps.
<<Reef setups are indeed "power hungry">> Prior,
the power options didn't allow me to have the right lighting. I now
run 3 10K 250watt HQI de's with PC actinics. The tank gets a weekly
water change from RO/DI water and top-off is from the same unit. I dose
manually calcium and dKH supplement as needed, parameters are checked
weekly. <<Very good>> The only issue I have which is not
serious is slightly elevated nitrates. <<...! I don't know
your definition of "slightly", but even so, chronically
elevated nitrate can/will have effect on your livestock (and what about
ammonia/nitrite?...these were/are checked as well?). This may be a clue
to the two Naso tang's demise>> I use a refugium with grape
<Caulerpa> and Chaetomorpha macro algae. <<Mmm, another
issue (clue?) here in my opinion. Grape Caulerpa is very noxious, even
toxic to fish (many herbivorous fishes won't eat it for this
reason). Combining it with Chaetomorpha in a refugium means the alga
are constantly waging war (alga compete just as corals do for space on
the reef), releasing chemicals/toxins to inhibit and/or kill each
other. Such constant and powerful chemical warfare (Alga rates at the
top of the list with some of the nastiest corals for
aggression/noxiousness) can't be "good" for a system. Not
to mention the loss of usefulness/processes for having the algae in the
refugium in the first place due to the "energy" expended on
warfare>> The Chaeto is fed to the tank where the angels and
tangs feast. <<Hmm...wonder the possibility of the Chaetomorpha
being "tainted" from close exposure/battle with the grape
Caulerpa...>> The nitrate levels are elevated, but don't
cause any issues with nuisance algae, the Acropora and Montipora orange
cup coral are growing and doing well so I use that as a measure since
the nitrates don't seem to cause any other problem. <<I agree
it would seem the corals you mention would show deleterious affects
from elevated nitrate before the fish would...but I'm still very
curious as to your actual nitrate reading(s)>> I do understand
the bio load may be a little high causing the elevated nitrates,
however I go to great lengths to make sure the water quality and
environment stay optimal. Of course the tank has a large skimmer on it
which is cleaned 1-2 times per week. Ok, with that overview here is
what happened over the last few weeks. About three weeks ago I noticed
the RO unit was not producing any RO for the top-off. <<Raw RO
water for top-off? Not recommended...>> The unit being in place a
little over 6 months I thought it might just need to be cleaned and
didn't need new filters or membrane replacement. <<Not
likely, no..."should" get a couple to several years out of
the membrane, even with this size tank...life of the filter cartridges
will depend mainly on your source water/how often they are rinsed
clean>> The water source is well water. After rinsing the filters
in tap water and putting the unit back together it did start to produce
some RO however the TDS was > then 0 and could not produce enough
for a water change. <<Again... I need specific measurements to
really be of much help>> At this point I called the company to
discuss my options. <<A good move>> They agreed that the
membrane should not have to be replaced but agreed to send me a filter
kit and new membrane anyway. The unit is a 100gpd. <<As is
mine...>> I skipped my weekly water change that week waiting for
the filters. <<Um...not seasoning/maturing/buffering your water
before "and" after mixing the salt?>> I received the
filters and they forgot to ship the membrane. <<Mmm...>> I
waited until that weekend to install the filters. After the filters
were installed, the unit still didn't make RO for my water change.
<<Strange...perhaps you should remove/gently rinse the
membrane...install a "flush" kit>> Bottom line, by the
time I got RO back online it was almost 3 weeks without a water change.
<<Shouldn't have been a problem>> I didn't think
this was that critical as I checked param.s and everything seemed to be
ok. <<Would agree>> I started to cut back on feeding
slightly which is usually done twice a day, every other day. <<I
don't agree with this, fish should be fed daily...preferably
multiple small feedings. If feeding daily causes secondary issues with
your tank then reevaluate your maintenance/husbandry practices/stocking
levels...but don't jeopardize the fishes long-term health by
"cutting back" on proper and adequate nutrition>> I
target feed the fish to make sure everybody gets enough without over
feeding the tank. They get mostly pellets soaked with Vita-Chem.
<<A good product...and New Life Spectrum pellets I hope!>>
That is supplemented with frozen Mysis and the macro algae. <<Ah
good, variety is key...and the more the better>> During this 3
week period, I added 2 fish to the tank one of the fish was a
replacement for a small saddle back puffer that jumped out the tank
some time ago, <<Jumped!...? Was this fish stressed/harassed by
other fish? Perhaps another clue here as well. Could be the puffer was
stressed to the point of releasing toxins (jumped to escape its own
poison?) and the tangs are merely victims of the long-term affect...and
hopefully the "only" victims>> and the other was a
mandarin dragonet. This is my first time keeping a mandarin but given
the size of the tank and amount of pods I see I thought I would try to
keep one. <<Sounds reasonable to me as well considering the
"mature" nature of this tank>> During this time I also
took a handful of the spaghetti algae about baseball size and tossed it
in the main tank during the lower feeding period. Also something I have
done many times before. Now the blur of events I have been going over
and over in my mind trying to figure out what happened. I can't say
exactly when during this period but, I did notice the larger Naso
hiding a little bit. He was still feeding and there were no other signs
of problems. I kept an eye on him and noticed during the last week that
he had seemed to have a sunken stomach, stopped feeding and was staying
at the top of the tank in a vertical position. Shortly after the larger
Naso started to exhibit this behavior I noticed the smaller Naso also
with a sunken stomach. <<Were these fish treated with a
copper-based medication at any point prior to this? Tangs treated in
this manner will sometimes suffer from loss of digestive microbes in
their gut, preventing them from digesting food/assimilating nutrients.
Another thought is the behavior of these two fish is similar to those
afflicted with internal parasites, though many times such afflicted
fish show absolutely "no interest" in food>> I began to
feed the tank everyday in the morning and later in the day, both tangs
showed interest and slightly picked but were not near their normally
aggressive feeding behavior. Their breathing also seemed slightly
labored. The large Naso was the first to die, the smaller died
yesterday. Neither fish showed any signs of marks, spots, no physical
changes outside of the sunken stomachs. Before disposing of the smaller
tang I lifted the gill flap and used a bright light to examine the
gill. The gill was bright red and showed nothing abnormal. Both fish
had labored breathing towards the end but again didn't have any
other visual indications. <<May have been secondary to the stress
of/weakening by malnutrition>> No other fish in the tank
currently show any signs of abnormal behavior and continue to feed
normally. I have done 2 water changes last week once the RO produced
enough water hoping to save a least one of the tangs. <<Not
likely the issue...and possibly an additional stressor (bouncing water
parameters), especially if the new salt mix is not allowed to
mature/complete its chemical processes before adding to the
tank>> The smaller did appear to be swimming around better the
day before but refused to eat. <<Never good>> As of now I
am suspecting the following; The RO unit; is it possible the filters
contaminated the water some how, either the exhausted filters or the
new filters? <<I'm doubtful of this>> Did adding the
puffer or mandarin bring something in the tank? <<More of a
possibility, yes>> BTW all my fish come from 2 places that I
trust and know. I never have any problems with their fish or corals.
<<Fortunate>> Did the puffer release toxins in the water?
<<Possibly>> The previous saddle back was there for a year
and never had any issues. Is it possible that something was in the
macro algae the tangs ate? <<Another possibility I think,
yes>> Again, the Nasos eat this algae all the time and can eat a
baseball size amount in a day. <<Possibly a matter of toxic
accumulation>> Lastly, I dose the tank weekly with only Kent dKH
supplement. The product is added to my sump which is connected to the
refugium. <<If tested/added as needed this should not be a
problem>> I was thinking maybe the macro algae could have
contained concentrated levels of this? <<I don't think
so>> Other fish ate the algae, but mostly the Nasos.
<<Could be telling>> Lastly, the tank has Euro-bracing and
is open. The stand is over 4 feet high, the tank total height is around
7-8 feet. <<Cool>> This was done because of the kids and
placement of the tank. It is of perfect viewing in a standing position.
<<Indeed>> I thought I'd mention this in the event
something got into the tank that's unknown? <<Anyone been
"cleaning" around the tank?>> I do find bugs every now
and again in the sump that must be attracted to the lights.
<<Yes>> The only other thing that I thought of was this
past weekend my wife had some people over to clean the house. I was not
around but always give my wife strict instructions that the cleaners
stay away from the tank. They were new people, so I don't know if
something was introduce through their cleaning? <<Weren't the
tangs displaying symptoms before this?>> Sorry for the long
email, <<No worries my friend, I appreciate the detailed
explanation (hmm...wonder if I can make an article out of this some
how?)>> <Likely so. RMF> but I am at my wits end on this
and can't begin to explain how I feel. I have been in the hobby a
very long time and have never seen anything like this before. Please
help... <<Well Patrick, I have been in the hobby more than 30
years myself, and "have" seen this before. Unfortunately,
knowing the exact cause is usually very difficult without a necropsy of
the fish. I do have some thoughts/theories as I've stated>>
Thanks and regards, Patrick Mundt <<My pleasure to assist. Do
give thought to separating/choosing a single macro-algae (my vote goes
to the Chaetomorpha) for the refugium...and do take a look on our site
re using RO water for top-off as well as making/mixing with salt for
water changes. Cheers, Eric Russell>> Blonde Naso Tang problem
9/2/06 Hello, I hope you can give me some advice. I have a blonde
Naso tang that I've cared for since April 2000. He is about 25 cm
long, full-bodied, and up until this morning, healthy.
"Blondie" usually eats from my hand, however today will not
eat anything. He has a bulge about half way down his right side.
<One sided I'll take it> There is no outward ulceration,
however he does have several little nips on his underbelly, I presume
from the engineer gobies at feeding time. These little markings have
been around for quite some time. He has no outward signs of disease (no
redness on gills, no torn fins, his eyes seem clear, etc.), except
he's acting different. Instead of eating, he swims up to the glass
with his bulge towards me and works his mouth, almost as if he is
gasping. Blondie shares a 75 gal. <Too small> tank with a brown
Sailfin tang, 2 engineer gobies (about 20cm each), 2 clown fish, 2
cleaner shrimp and a brittle star fish. Everyone else seems fine. Thank
you for your time; I really hope you can help me. Best regards, Sue
Kavelman <Mmm... it may be that this Naso has "just"
swallowed too much gravel (they do this, analogous to the
"crop" of chickens) and is suffering some sort of gut
blockage... Perhaps addition of Epsom Salt (see WWM re) will help move
this. Otherwise, offering of algae (on a feeding clip is best, so you
can monitor, keep it from the Pholodichthys...). In the longer term (if
there is one), this fish needs much larger quarters... at least a six
foot length run/world. Bob Fenner> Not quite psychic yet...more info please! (Naso Tang) 7/2/06 Good morning Bob I have a few question. <Actually this is Adam J with you today...hello.> I have a Naso Tang and in the last couple of days have noticed her acting funny. <Not "Ha-Ha" funny I presume.> It's eye's has a cloud coating. <An indication of declining water quality or something environmental here.> It has also started to turn really dark and not moving as much as it did at one time. <Hmm, see above...to help further I need to know more about the system the animal is in, water quality? Tankmates? Diet?> It also developed a purple color and started to bump into things like it can't see. It has stop eating and this morning she had a whole lot of little white spots all over it. <See my above comment/questions and start with some water changes.> what could be going on with it and how can I treat the problem. <See above...Adam J.>
Re: Naso Tang ... dis. 3/16/06 I just have a question about the Quick Cure product I'm using. You stated I needed to treat the tank for 20 more days to ensure that all the cysts have hatched and are killed. Do I treat for 20 consecutive days or should I alternate days? How long can I treat with this product without harming my fish? <Donna, first off, 20 days would be the minimum duration of treatment. To be effective, a copper test kit should be used to ensure a copper level of 0.20 is maintained on a daily basis for the duration of the treatment. Do read here. http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ichartmar.htm James (Salty Dog)> <<James... QuickCure has no copper in it... RMF>> Lipstick tang health, sel. 3/15/06 Hi I would like to know if you have any ideas on why our lipstick tang died. We've had the tank 5ft- 380litres) for 3 months. We have a blue damsel, 2 coral banded shrimp, Fijian damsel, 2 clownfish and a coral beauty (all small specimens). We test regularly, everything stays relatively the same, and I tested again after the tang died. Ph-8.4, ammonia 0.1, <Should be zip> nitrate 20ppm. <Borderline high> We had the tang 9 days, when we first got it there was a small amount of tail fighting with the coral beauty, but after this all seemed harmonious. The tang ate well each feed either brine shrimp or vege cubes and we also added seaweed which it grazed on. The night before it fed well and seemed happy. Dead as a door nail the next morning! Shop said maybe stress but that it would have white spots if this was the case. I examines the tang, there were no marks at all, it looked perfectly healthy, other than being dead obviously. Any ideas would be appreciated Cheers Megan <Naso species do often "just die" shortly after arrival/collection from the wild. Likely "cumulative stress" could sum up the "cause" here. Buying a specimen that has been "on hand" for a few weeks will likely assure its survival in your setting. Bob Fenner> Naso Tang ... selection? - 2/11/2006 I bought a Blonde Naso Tang last week. I bought him because the "expert" at the LFS said these were hardy fish and not particularly disease prone. <He's also a comedian too?> He also tested my water and told me it was fine, but I didn't ask the specific parameters. He told me that he had been quarantining using a UV sterilizer for approximately 1 month. The Naso has been in my tank for 4.5 days. I noticed two days ago that he has white spots on his fins. The same "expert" at the LFS advised me to give him a bath in 2.5 gals of fresh water and 11 drops of formalin with an antibiotic in the water. Is this the way to treat that? <I'd like to ask you a question first. Why didn't you quarantine the fish before placing it in your tank? This makes an effective treatment much easier. Freshwater dips are usually the first stage in treatment. Do Google search our Wet Web site, keyword "freshwater dip". You will find your info there. I'm also hoping you have at least a 70 gallon tank for that guy for starters as they can attain a length of up to 8 inches and do require plenty of swimming room. James (Salty Dog)> Donna Naso tang, dieting issues 2/6/06 Hello crew, First I would like to thank all of you for the invaluable service you provide to everyone in the hobby. I have a 4" Naso tang in a 110 tall FOWLR. The tank is 1 yr old with appx 60 lbs of live rock on a 30 gal wet dry setup skimmed and UV sterilized. his tank mated are a (and I know your going to hate me for this, but I was an ignorant consumer at the time) Moorish idol, and a regal angelfish (red sea). everyone has been doing very well and is fat and happy. Appx. one week ago the Naso tang developed a small pinch but with no change in eating habits. The pinch became progressively worse up until yesterday still no change in eating habits. today he is literally a skeleton and is lethargic and it appears he hasn't eaten for months. the attitude has changed overnight. His diet has consisted of brown and green macro, Kent marine flakes, ghost shrimp, brine shrimp, frozen zoo, Mysis shrimp, formula 2, and shrimp pellets, all alternating and all enriched with Zo? Zoecon, omega lipids, garlic, and vitamin c, (also alternating). They obviously all eat better then I do, good water parameters, and is feces is of normal coloration. The tank is cycled appx 16x per hour and I do religious water changes. I am completely stumped. Any help would be a blessing . thank you, Ed <Likely a persistent internal fauna issue. Please read here: Google: Naso, skinny, disease: http://www.google.com/custom?q=Naso%2C+skinny%2C+disease&sitesearch=wetwebmedia.com If the animal is still eating, a treatment with Flagyl/Metronidazole may save it. Bob Fenner> Naso Tang Trouble - 02/03/2006 Hello WWM: <Hi John.> I appreciate your assistance in helping me diagnose a problem with a Naso Tang. <I'll try.> I have asked purported experts at 2 reputable fish stores to provide some guidance and each provided little or no assistance. <OK...No pressure.> THE ENVIRONMENT *100 Gallon Tank *100 Pounds of Tonga Rock *Established 1 Year *Temperature 84 Degrees <I'd lower this to about 78-80 if possible.> *Salinity - 1.023 *Ph - 7.9 <Try to get this up to about 8.3.> *P04 - 0 *N03 - 30 <Ouch. 10 or less would be much better.> *4 Clownfish *1 Sailfin Tang *1 Hippo Tang *1 Flame Angel *1 Royal Gramma *1 Goby THE PROBLEM I purchased the Naso approximately 2 weeks ago. He appeared healthy and reasonably active in a relatively small store tank. <Hmm...Reasonably?> After we purchased the fish we acclimated him to the water temperature and did a fresh water dip prior to releasing him into the display tank. <No QT I see. Only acclimated to temp.?> We noticed with 1-2 days that one of his eyes appeared to be injured and we were told it was most likely an injury and not eye cloud or Popeye. The water quality is perfect and I just recently had the tank serviced. <I wouldn't quite say perfect, but is mostly acceptable.> That problem seems to be improving. <Good.> The second problem is that the tang also eats very little. <Uh-Oh...> Flake and pellet food are not of particular interest though he did at times eat the seaweed. <Not good. Have you tried soaking these in a vitamin prep. or appetite stimulant?> The real problem now is that for the past 2-3 days he has been moving erratically. He generally is inactive is often seen at the bottom of the tank or on an angle against the rock or, at times, flat on the crushed coral. <Sounds like stress. The filtration seems inadequate with the nitrate levels, and Tangs need an environment with low metabolic wastes and high dissolved oxygen. It sounds like these are the problems as well as a lack of personal space for this fish.> The gills are moving rapidly and the fish appears to be in severe stress. The service person said that everything is fine and further that Naso Tangs in particular tend to behave that way and will rest on the bottom of the tank and against rock and I should not be concerned. <What!? This is definitely something to be concerned with.> The fish will sporadically swim for short periods then will again rest at the bottom of the tank. When sporadically bothered by the other tangs the fish will tail whack and defend itself. The situation looks grim. Any suggestions? <I don't think this tank is big enough for all these fish. This is probably a combination of environmental and psychological stress. I'd start with a good 25-30% water change to lower those nitrates. Given the mix of fish, I'd say you dissolved oxygen is low also, so I'd add an airstone or other means of aeration. How's the flow in your tank? Vigorous circulation is also necessary. Skimmer? Don't see one listed. As far as the mix you've got, review on WWM re, and consider reducing this load.> Thank you. John <You're welcome. - Josh> Naso tang sudden death 1/7/06 Aloha WWM Crew,<And a lei for you> I will get straight to the point. I have had a Naso Tang in a 75G FOWLR for about 10 months. The Tang has been healthy up until yesterday when I noticed it would not eat. It actually went over to it's feeding rock where I put the Nori, but would not eat any. The following hours he got progressively worse and died the next day. My water parameters are these: Nitrite-0, PH- 8.6, Nitrate- 40 ppm, Ammonia-0, water temp-81, SG 1.020. Tankmates are 2 yellow tangs and 1 small clown. <SG is a little low John.> Equipment is an Eheim 2213 canister filter, an Aqua Clear 300 power filter, 2 Rio 600 power heads, and an Aquarium Systems skimmer. These water parameters have been stable since I started the tank about 1 year ago (except the nitrates). I noticed two things I think may have contributed to his demise but am puzzled as to why he went so quickly. First: his back fin looked like it had been bitten a few times by a tankmate. Can an aggressive tankmate cause a healthy fish to die that quick? (He hadn't shown any signs of tension before) Second: just before the holidays, I lost my air pump. In the confusion that is Christmas and New Years, I completely forgot to replace the pump. As I was thinking about what to do to remedy my sick Tang, I remembered reading how these fish need a lot of dissolved oxygen. After kicking myself I tried feverishly to fix the torn bellows in my pump but was unsuccessful. So, my question is, wouldn't lack of dissolved oxygen make the fish a little lethargic weeks before he passed? <<James... this is a question... respond. The answer is yes. RMF>> I really appreciate your insight as I am truly puzzled by this "sudden death". <John, first off, your tank isn't large enough for these fish. I suggest at least a 5 to 6 foot long tank. Your present filtering devices are not going to give you the pristine water quality that these fish require (by pristine I don't mean parameters). A sump/wet dry which will provide near saturation levels of O2 is one requirement. A good protein skimmer is a must. The skimmer you are using <my opinion> is really not efficient enough in removing dissolved protein to help in lowering your nitrate level. A vitamin enriched algae diet is another requirement. Please do read articles here. http://www.wetwebmedia.com/tangs,.htm> Mahalo,<And to you. James (Salty Dog)> John Torn Between two tangs 10-12-05 Dear Crew, <<Hello>> I have a 180 g FOWLR that had been a closed system for quite some time until this summer when after a 4 wk quarantine I added an adult emperor angel. <<QT should always be a minimum of 4 weeks and I personally suggest a minimum of 6 weeks on tangs and angels as they like to harbor "nasties".>> The 180 had a powder blue and a Naso tang, both beautiful fish. A purple tang and Foxface that I have had for 8-9 years were looking like they were on their last leg ( probably old age , I guess ) and I decided to open the system to new inhabitants. Unfortunately, despite using a QT the tangs look like they came down with crypt. I pulled all fish from the system, treated then in QT's with copper for 3 weeks and let the display lie fallow for 5 weeks. <<Again as a general rule, a tank should be left fallow for 6-8 weeks and temp. should be raised as high as tolerable for current inhabitants to increase the rate of the parasite life cycle.>> I have since re-introduced all of the fish except for the tangs. For 4 weeks since the 180 has been with fish the system looks great. My tangs are also doing well while still in the QT except for some HLLE that they acquired while copper treated. The Naso has a few scattered papules on the face and head and body that copper had no effect on ( ? HLLE ) but is otherwise doing great. The Naso and powder blue are in a 55 g tank together. The papules on the Naso are whitish and much 4-5 times larger than what is seen with crypt, this has been a chronic condition for this fish but it has not been that noticeable nor has it affected the fish's activity eating etc. Now I am faced with a dilemma : Should I dare re-introduce the tangs into the display. I fear that tangs are very "parasite prone" Currently the 180 has an adult emperor 6". a majestic 4-5" Foxface 5" Heniochus 4" a couple of clowns and one damsel, 250lbs of LR with plenty of hiding places. Probably no good answer to this question, but I thought I would try asking. <<The best answer I can give is; if you don't feel comfortable doing it, then don't do it. You are correct in your thinking that tangs are prone to infection. My advice would be to pick one and give the other to a friend or set up the 55 for the outsider.>> Jimmy <<TravisM>><<<I actually am going to make a comment... both species listed here are unsuitable for a four foot long system (should be in six foot minimum)... the mucus marks on the Naso are likely "just" resultant from stress... RMF>>> Sick fish floating - emergency 8/8/05
Please Help! I tried and looked for an answer on your site but I am a
little flustered at the moment. I just came home to my healthy Naso
Tang floating on the top of the aquarium on his side gasping. The water
quality is fine, all the other fish are fine. I did a complete tank
change from a 75 to a 150 last Sunday, and everyone was fine. Do you
think this could be stress? <Not likely> If so is it possible for
the stress to hit him a week later? What should I do? I put stress coat
in the tank the day of the change, and just now again. The tank has
plenty of o2 as I have a sump in my basement the water crashes into.
Please advise! I am freaking out and do not know what to do!!! Thank
you Jack B. Schimpf <We need more info on symptoms than simply
floating. Is it closing or favoring one gill over another, and color
changes, what is the diet, how old is the fish, etc. In the meantime,
I'd suggest you get the fish into a QT tank with some aged aquarium
water and some aged/mature filter media or live rock from the tank. Add
1 TBN of Epsom salt per 5 gallons and then repeat the dose after a
water change 3 days later. You might add B12 and/or Beta Glucan to the
water or feed for appetite/immunity boosting. And please do read
through our archives at wetwebmedia.com to see if any other symptoms
look familiar and treatments if necessary. Best of luck,
Anthony> The death of my Naso My silver Naso was so happy and I cut his romaine back to once a week because he was neglecting the algae that was his normal dinner. I came home one night to find my wife in tears and my little boy dead in a bowl dead. He gave me no signs that he was sick and it was 4 days prior that I went into my 85 gallon reef tank <Too small> and cleaned all of the glass with a blade and I even cleaned my rocks and my wet dry pumps. The tang had small white worm like parasites coming from his gills I saw 2 when he was in the bowl. I was too upset to cut him up to see the extent of the parasites. Have you seen this before? <Mmm, yes, but rarely...> My coral are healthy and happy and my mean black damsel is fine. Please advise me so I can know what to do when I get another. I never knew I could become so attached to a fish. Thank you for your time Jerry Fogle <... There are a few worm phyla parasitic groups that this could be... and generally they present no problems as you experienced... they can be virtually eliminated in going through your quarantine procedure with new fishes with the use of Praziquantel or similar... (PraziPro...). The fishes of this genus need at least a six foot long tank to adjust well, live generally in captivity. Bob Fenner> Needing help about lipstick tang, illiteracy Hi just
wondering we had a lipstick tang and it was fine and then a couple of
weeks down the track we brought a blue tang and put it in the tank and
then the lipstick tang started acting funny our blue tang died and then
a couple of days later our lipstick tang turned a really dark grey
colour and stopped eating. I just wanted to know what does it mean when
the lipstick tang turns a really dark grey colour is it because it has
a disease. thanks Semiany please reply I would really like to know.
<The darkening is a sign of psychological and/or physiological
stress... Something/s frightening and/or challenging to the specimen.
Bob Fenner> Constipated Naso Tang? Hello.... I have an 85 gallon "fish only" tank including 1 Naso tang, 4 green Chromis, 1 maroon clown, and a Pseudochromis (sp?). Tank has been established for about 5 months and all fish are healthy and water quality is good (1.022 sp grav., 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite, 8.2 ph, and 20-40 nitrate). <I'd work to keep this below 20 ppm maximum.> My Naso tang (nicknamed "Hoover" because he normally is like a vacuum in that he eats everything) seems to have a problem. We noticed yesterday, when he didn't seem at all interested in eating that his "pooper" seemed to be plugged up. You can notice when he swims by that there is some stuff up there that seems to want to come out but isn't doing so. Normally, his poops are record breaking so the fact I haven't seen him go is a bit odd. He has lost some of his energy (he has always been very active) and he hasn't eaten in 2 days now. (My fish are normally fed 2 times a day and eat a variety of brine shrimp, Formula 1 or 2 and seaweed.) Also, I have a small fake plant in the corner of the tank that is bright pink and in the past, Hoover has nipped at the plant and taken little bits of the pink material off the plant. He then eats those bits of material and will even poop them out and eat them again. This has been going on for a month or so. Now, in the blockage seen in his "pooper," I've noticed a small strand of the pink material. Not sure if that's dangerous or not. <Good observation, description> Anyways, I'm a little worried about him and the fact that he is not eating tells me there is obviously something wrong. Is there anything I can for him or do I just need to ride this thing out? <If it were me, mine, I'd help out a bit by adding some Epsom Salt to the system... at a rate of one level teaspoon per ten gallons of actual system water> Because I can see the blockage I'm tempted to grab him and just pull it out but I really don't want to take that step. Just looking for some answers. I searched the whole site and couldn't find anything related to this exact problem. Your time and feedback is much appreciated! Thanks, Chris. <Do a search using the term Epsom... magnesium sulfate, on WWM. Bob Fenner> Sick Naso Tang Yes, I have a Naso tang. I have had it for a week. It was doing great this afternoon when I came home around midnight and it was laying on the ground in the back of my tank. My husband was able to move it and we looked to see if it had any signs of diseases, none. When it tried to swim it would do somersault so to speak, till it fell to the bottom. We checked the water quality and did the weekly test and everything was perfect. Can you help me figure what went wrong and do I have to worry about my other fish and coral? Thank you for your time. <The Naso Tang is not an easy fish to keep alive for any length of time. By your description of the Naso, I'm thinking it is no longer with us, but if he is, there is a link below on controlling this disease. All fish in the tang family are very prone to ich. If you are new at this, they are not a good choice. As far as the other fish getting the disease, you will just have to monitor them. Since you have corals, you wouldn't be able to treat the display tank unless all inverts are moved. Here is a link on controlling parasitic diseases. http://www.wetwebmedia.com/parasiti.htm. Good luck. James (Salty Dog)> Naso Tang Death Hello, <Hello Michael> This may be too vague and too many causes to answer but I'll give it a shot anyway. I came home tonight to find my Naso Tang wedged behind some rocks and barely alive. I immediately removed him from the main tank and put him in my sump so that I can keep an eye on him and gather him up if he dies. I then tested my water for anything that seemed out of whack. I can find nothing that appears to be wrong. My Nitrate, Nitrite, Ammonia are all zero. My buffer capacity was above (as far as I can determine from the color) 300ppm. My Specific Gravity is 1.021 and my pH reads 8.29. I have a RO/DI unit topping off the tank, so I don't *think* I am getting something bad from the water supply. The tang shows no signs of Ick and his eyes are clear. He does appear to be "gasping" through his mouth and his equilibrium seems to be off (i.e. he was swimming upside down a few times). I have done a couple of things over the past few weeks that I question whether or not it might have an affect. First, because of a micro bubble problem and at the LFS suggestion, I added a filter bag to the end of my overflow. This eliminated the bubbles but I question whether or not I could be suffocating the tank? Is that possible? <I don't think so> I also added a "cleaning" crew of snails, hermit crabs, peppermint shrimp, etc to the tank. They have destroyed about every bit of algae in the tank. Could I be starving the Tang? <Possibly, they do like algae in their diet.> I feed Mysis about every 5 days. The tang and 2 damsels are the only fish in the tank. I did accidentally leave the Mysis out all night and then refroze it. Could I have contaminated the food source doing this? <It's possible> I did add a pH buffer 2 days ago to raise my pH from 7.8 and it indicated that ammonia in the water could be lethal but again my ammonia level was zero. Is there something else I should look for? <Michael, the Naso, Powder Blue/Brown are all difficult tangs to keep. They do require at least 100 gallon systems as they are constantly swimming. Water quality is of the utmost importance. Normal test readings are really not an indicator of water quality. Ten percent water changes per week need to be done to maintain the quality and trace element supply. The use of a good protein skimmer adds to the quality of the water. Diet also plays an important role. Here is a link on the Naso Tang if you haven't read it already. http://www.wetwebmedia.com/naso.htm. James (Salty Dog)> Thanks so much, Michael <You're welcome> Vlamingi--Brown spots with white center that looks like air bubble Dear WWM Crew, <Joey> Thank you for the great work! I couldn't find anything references to my problem in your existing documents (which never happened before!!) so here I am writing for the first time :-) Thank you for your time. <Welcome> My young Vlamingi tang (2.5-3")... <Wow, this is small> ... has been in my system for 7-10 days. Last night I realized there are some random brown/tan/rusty color dots (1mm across) on the ventral sides of his body (belly, mostly towards the back). The strange thing about the brown/rusty dots is that they are flat against his body, but have a white center (pin-head size) that stick out from the body like bull's-eye, which reflects light like an air bubble. <Yes... these are likely "just normal coloration".... I see this on ones in the wild at times... when I can get close, the lighting's good> Moreover, the same white dots on his side fins and the dorsal side of his body (all along his back), I would have thought they are Ick, but I am not so sure after seeing the rusty outer rims. They also reflect light like air bubbles. <Yes> What should I do? Should I separate Mr. Vlamingi form the rest of his tank mates? I cannot get a picture of him, I waited for 20 minutes and the camera only stresses him out! <I would "do nothing"... very unlikely not a problem with your Naso here> Thank you so much for your time. Sincerely, Joey System set up: Main tank: 55 gal, 50lbs LS, 60lbs LR, 220 power compact, 1 rotating power head, CPR BakPak protein skimmer. Sump: 20gal, almost full, regular household fluorescent light on 24 hours) with little macroalgae. Livestock: Fishes: 1 silver hybrid tang (4.5") <Really? I wonder, what sort of cross?> 1 Vlamingi tang (2.5") 1 homeless male false percula (1.5") 1 mandarin dragonet (3.5") Inverts: 1 cleaner shrimp (2") Clean up crew 1 bubble coral (2.5") 1 pulsing xenia (2.5") 1 long tentacle coral (5") <Mmm, do realize you're going to need a larger tank with the Vlamingi... at least six feet long in time. Bob Fenner> Naso Tang Hi there <Hello Jaime> Thank you so much for your website, it has been great help to us, you guys and gals are great! However I have looked over forums and articles and have had no luck with my problem. We have lost our first fish today and I have no clue why. I would be forever in your debt if someone could help me! So here we go..... We set up our first marine tank 4 months ago and all has been going swimmingly until today. All tests are normal and our water quality is high and our other fish are doing great so far (knock on wood). So here is our problem. We bought a lipstick/Naso tang about a month ago from our trusted fish store. He acclimatized well in the tank and was doing great. Then we had an unfortunate incident where he dive bombed himself into a live rock formation for no apparent reason and got himself stuck. I noticed him stuck so I freed him by moving the rocks. After that he seemed a bit freaked out, acting a little funny, his right eye looked like it had been scratched so it was a little cloudy and his left fin seemed to be bothering him, but a few hours later he seemed much better so we didn't want to stress him anymore by moving him to the quarantine tank. Over the next day he appeared to be healing fast, he was still acting a little bit weird, but he seemed ok because he was still swimming around and he was still eating. Then we came home from work today to find him lying almost dead on the bottom of the tank. His breathing was very slow, and he had turned the most horrible dark colour. So through teary eyes we moved him into the quarantine tank so that he wouldn't die in the big tank. He doesn't appear to have any strange markings or any of the symptoms of any disease I could find on the website. I am still worried that he might have something that has infected the tank, please could you help me with any clues on this strange behaviour? We loved that little guy. <Jaime, sorry to hear about your loss. The tang you selected is one of the most difficult tangs to keep in captivity. They are from the same family as the Powder Blue Tang, another almost impossible tang to keep for any length of time. I am gathering from what I read here that little or no research was done on this fish before you purchased it. I don't know what size tank you have, but they require a minimum tank size of 70 gallons. These fish can grown 20-24" in the wild. I would like you to read info on a link I'll include here. This certainly will help in any future tang purchases as there is not much we can do with the one you had. If your a newcomer to this hobby you definitely want to stay away from tangs in the Acanthuridae family which yours was a member of as they require an extreme amount of care to survive in captivity. http://www.wetwebmedia.com/naso.htm James (Salty Dog)> Naso Tang and moving tank Why does my Naso tang keep going a darker colour? I thought it may have been when he is scared but I have noticed that it does it when he's not scared. <Here is a link to a ton of FAQ's you should read about the Naso. http://www.google.com/custom?q=Naso+Tang&sitesearch=wetwebmedia.com It should provide you whatever you need to know.> I have a 50 gallon setup and a 10 gallon quarantine tank can you give me some useful information and tips on how I would go about moving the tanks to another house a street away. <And yet another link on moving. http://www.google.com/custom?q=Tank+moving&sitesearch=wetwebmedia.com Good luck in the move. James (Salty Dog)> Blonde Naso Tang Didn't Make It - Not in Vain Last night I noticed a white mucus discharge from the Tangs anus. I moved him to QT and this morning he passed on. Although I am sad to see him go and feel responsible for his passing some good will come of his death. I went up to the LFS where I purchased the fish. After a long talk they came to the conclusion that they too were responsible for the fishes stress and death as they left the fish in the bag 7 hours after they got it from their dealer. We talked about QT their fish and possibly holding their fish one week before they are offered for sale to avoid this in the future (some background I consult with the LFS on water quality issues). Their water system is being changed so every tank is on a separate system and not one large system. So if one fish gets sick, all stock does not suffer. They admit their losses are high mainly due to the customers knowing when new fish arrive and trying to buy them the same day they get to the store and have been acclimated to the store tank. I and they feel that considering the way they get their fish (from a store 80miles north by truck. Time from packing to delivery I was told is 20 hours in bag. Bag is left on dock in a packing box until truck picks them up), the stress they are under when they arrive to the LFS and the added stress of moving to the LFS tank then the customers tank seems to be just too much for some fish. So maybe some good will come of this. I have also learned for your website, that I just do not have a large enough tank for a tang, so I will wait until such time as I do before I consider purchasing another one. <Good idea. Also go to the WWM for information on selecting tangs before your next purchase. Better yet, I'll post the link here. http://www.wetwebmedia.com/tangselfaqs.htm> Thanks for your help, and the education you have provided. <Thanks for sharing. James (Salty Dog)> - Naso Tang Stress - Good evening, <Good morning.> I
have read through your site and must say it has helped me very much. I
have a question I tried to get an answer to on your site but could not
find a specific answer to (if I missed something I am sorry). In my 55
gal reef tank I purchased a Blonde Naso Tang (I plan to move him to a
135 in the next 8 months). When I got him and put him in QT he laid on
his side and looked like he was going to die. After a long night with
him he seemed to do better, but still looked stressed, also he would
not eat and I do not have any brown or red algae in the QT. So I moved
him to the ref tank where there is food for him to eat. Before I go any
farther my water is all in spec. I am a water microbiologist and take
sample to the lab to check everything using UV/ mass spec, HACH tests
and AA. <What a luxury!> Ammonia is <0.1ppm, Nitrite 0.02ppm,
Nitrate 0.12ppm, SP1.024, Ca 435pm, pH 8.45, Temp 78'F. I can give
you ORP, TDS , M Alk and P Alk, MO, and all other trace minerals,
metals etc. if you need it or think it will help. <Nah... sounds
good so far, certainly have no reason to doubt your measurements.>
Water changes are weekly at 10% made with Laboratory grade RO water
that has been run through a mixed bed DI unit. I also do a lime water
drip I make up in the lab with lab grade (Fisher Scientific) Calcium
Hydroxide (1.8gm / gal.). For the first week the Naso hid and only came
out when the room was empty, if I peeked in the room I could see him
pick at the red algae and brown algae, but if I came in the room he
hid. I can see where he picked at the algae in the tank so I am sure he
was eating. Now a week later he sits in one part of the tank and just
looks at one piece of live rock for hours at a time and won't move
or eat. He hovers at a head down position (45' angle) just looking
at this one piece of rock. I have tried to feed him algae on a clip,
marine flakes, krill, brine shrimp. He won't eat. I am afraid he
will starve. <He well may.> His color is light gray with white
blotches that come and go or get lighter and darker, but never go away.
I check the water for Ick and him, no Ick. The 2 damsels and one coral
beauty and one clown are all fine. I don't want the Naso to suffer
and want to help him, but I do not know what to do, or if there is
something I can do. <Well... it sounds to me like this fish is in
extreme stress... and may have been this way before you picked it up.
Best I can recommend is to leave the lighting out for a while, make
sure it has a place to hide, make certain there isn't stimuli in
the tank room that would keep this fish on edge, and let time takes its
course. Unfortunately, some fish don't come back from this... but
some do... need time to adjust to capture, transport, new water
chemistry... is a lot to handle for a simple fish. I wish I could offer
you more but really the best you can do is leave the algae on a clip in
the tank and leave the fish alone.> Please help I am at a loss. Jim
R., M.S. <Good luck. Cheers, J -- > Sourcing a blonde Naso Do you know where a good place to purchase a healthy blonde Naso tang? <Likely the big etailers of marine livestock... Drs. Foster & Smith, Marine Center...> I thought Hawaii would be the best place if I could order direct. <Can't as far as I know... and I am there very often> To spare the fish from being transported to more than one place. <Good thought> We also have a 10 gal QT tank and wanted to place him in it. We would cover the side of the tank to reduce stress. Is this a big enough tank? and how long should he be in it? Thank you for any help. <Only if this is a very small specimen... Naso species should be quarantined in no smaller than a two foot by one foot long/wide tank... and kept in no smaller than twice this. Bob Fenner> Lopez tang with Popeye Hi, <Hi Cindy, MacL here with you
tonight. Sorry about the delay I just got this.> We have a Lopez
Tang that has what seems to be Popeye in one eye for 3 weeks now.
<Poor guy> It is very large and full of bubbles. We have treated
him with Epsom salts one time. <Epsom salts work great on Popeye
when its from an injury and sometimes will sooth the eye when its a
parasite or infection but generally its not going to cure it. After a
week of treatment with no response its time to try other things.> He
is currently in a 10 gallon quarantine tank. He is getting Maracyn and
copper. <You might consider Maracyn two. Of course, ideally if you
could get medicated flakes and he would eat them that would be the
best.> He is on his fourth day and the eye doesn't seem to be
looking any better. Since in the quarantine tank he won't eat which
he was acting fine before moving him into the QT tank. <Understood,
he's probably not happy about the move!> What else can we do to
try and help his eye. The other fish in the home tank are all fine and
aren't showing any signs of Popeye. <So many things that could
have caused it, but right now the best thing is to get him healthy and
try to get him back into his groove. I know people who have had great
success with Maracyn two in these situations. Also, Cindy, is he
showing signs of parasites? Because if not you really want to dilute
that copper as much as you can. It can really effect the internal
systems of tangs. Copper can be harsh stuff! How's he doing at this
point? Are you seeing anything on him? MacL> Thanks, Cindy Naso With Balance Problems >Dear Crew, >>Hello
Allyson. You have Marina today, with my greatest apologies, I've
just received your message in my inbox today and I sincerely hope
it's not too late. >I love my Naso like a child. We've had
him a few years and we bought him when he was approximately 6 inches
long. We were stupid. It's too big a fish even for our 125 gallon
tank. He belongs in the reef. Our water parameters have been stable for
several years but tonight I'll check them again. He's just
looking out of sorts. He frequently has a little Ick in the mornings
and the cleaner shrimps jump on him and it falls off by the end of the
day. He's a fussy eater and will only eat Tetra marine flakes and
Caulerpa. He eats these like a pig and the little guy is fat as a
house. He still eats OK. There was a period a week ago when we skipped
a meal for him (were away for 1 meal-we feed him a lot twice each day
by hand). The temperature dropped 3 degrees. Our refugium where we
raise Caulerpa and other macroalgae smelled bad and we changed most of
the water. It smells fine now. I think the Caulerpa looked a bit
unstable at the time but it's not sexual. >>If in doubt,
prune it back heavily, being CERTAIN to remove by the full holdfasts,
not just breaking off 'leaves'. >During that time, for
several days, the fish's yellow face turned dark and he did not
swim as actively. He barely ate. We raised the temp to 80 and his face
got yellower and he swims and eats more. What is most disturbing is
that since that time I see that he has trouble keeping himself upright
slightly. It's very slight but he'll swim sideways at times and
I see he has his alerting colors on (he gets blotches when he's
frightened). >>It seems you're taking the best care of him
you can, but I believe he's simply outgrown the system and is
displaying the stress (you've made no mention of his current
dimensions). This could explain the little bit of ich, the stress
coloration, and possibly the 'balance' issues (swim bladder,
possibly? Fish have no inner ear). He's definitely not growing old,
these animals can live 20 years easily. >He just seems a little
clumsier. He doesn't swim as fast or as agilely lately. I'm
trying to see if it's worsening but it's inconsistent. He
doesn't have any skin lesions and the Ick is very slight and barely
and occasionally visible. I've tried hospital tanks with him but
the conditions are so unstable in such a small tank, he does worse so
I've given up trying to treat the Ick. >>Yes, also, treating
him a hospital tank will do no good whatsoever if there are still other
vertebrates in the system upon which the parasite can find a host. The
only way for hospitalization to be effective is for the main display to
go fallow for a minimum of 6 weeks, though this often proves not to be
long enough. >I've done searches here and on reef central and I
have not seen balance problems listed much. The few times it was with
new fish and they died soon after developing it. I'm hoping he gets
better and it was just a minor trauma/infection. >>You've
listed no water parameters other than the temperature drop (amount), so
I can't really offer much other than a guess and a mantra - when in
doubt, do a water change. This won't help him at all if the problem
is simply that he's outgrown this system, but it will if, in spite
of the presence of the 'fuge, there is a buildup of nitrate or
other chemicals we cannot measure without a full laboratory at our
disposal. Even then, you might want to have an idea of what you're
testing for. You haven't mentioned how big the fish is now, but
Nasos grow rather large. Water changes on a large scale will not hurt,
and can both replenish lost compounds as well as remove buildups of
others. >We've also been administering Joes Juice to kill Majano
so I wonder if that has something neurotoxic. >>Be VERY careful
with that stuff! From what I understand they do not list any
ingredients (proprietary?), and I've read many posts on reefs.org
of folks losing their shrimps after using Joe's Juice. I have no
idea of it has any neurological effect, this is such a new product and
few are regulated in any manner. If you were my customer I wouldn't
have sold you this product, and I would now suggest you stop using it
altogether. >Bottom line, what could cause this? A vitamin
deficiency (he won't eat garlic, Selcon, or any other flake or food
than that Tetra marine stuff)? >>Garlic won't provide
vitamins or nutrition to fish (think about it, how often do fish get
their nutrition from garlic in the wild?), but it has been proven to
have a slight to moderate antibiotic effect. The food he will accept
can be soaked in Selcon prior to feeding, but you MUST be persistent.
Also, Nasos do like some meaty foods, have you offered him the
irresistible krill? Variety, especially with such a fish, is KEY. He is
behaving like a pet poodle, and you'll have to stand your ground
when it comes to sampling different foodstuffs. These fish can easily
go several days without feeding - if he gets hungry enough, he WILL try
it (assuming he's not actually ill, which I don't believe is
the case at this point). >A transient parasitic infection (maybe the
Ick got in his balance system)? >>Doubtful, I've not read of
such mild infestations affecting an animal's balance. If this were
a problem you'd see flashing and rapid gilling, not just balance
problems. >What scares me is that this might be a buildup in the
Caulerpa toxins. >>Possibly, but again, I do doubt this. I
didn't have a problem feeding C. taxifolia to my Z. flavescens, Z.
scopas, or other tangs for several years. >I give him a little bit
each day as a treat. He loves it. (Won't eat any kind of Nori,
broccoli, spinach, Sprung's sea veggies, lettuce, spinach, bok choy
etc. for greens). >>Again, he will if he's hungry enough, and
again, offer him some meaty foods. >I decided to do this because
this little guy has so few pleasures in our small tank, at least he
should have that. What was the toxin in Caulerpa so I can read about
it? >>This I cannot answer, try searching Anthony Calfo's
writings (this is off the top of my head), assuming a general Google
turns up nothing. >Thanks, Allyson >>You're welcome,
Allyson. At this point, my honest assessment is that the fish is
demonstrating end result of too small a system. I'm curious as to
whether or not this animal has grown the tail 'streamers' for
which they're noted, if not, this, along with the other symptoms
you mention lead me to this initial conclusion. Marina Freshwater Dips: Blackspot disease II 12/29/04 I actually had my security settings too high and it wasn't allowing me to search the site effectively. Not only did I find the information I was looking for but resources that I will return to for years! Thanks so much for compiling and offering all of this insight. <excellent to hear! You are quite welcome> I did a freshwater dip on my Naso tang and am following up with quarantine and malachite green treatment and it already looks much better and is feeding well in the qt tank. I will continue for three weeks in the qt and will then do another dip before returning it to my display tank. Thanks Again! Elizabeth Turner <A good rule of thumb is to release the specimen from QT only after 4 weeks of disease-free symptoms. kindly, Anthony> Naso tang fin disease First,,,, I wish I had found this site sooner, truly a wonderful source of expert opinion. <Our intention> I have a juvenile Naso tang (lituratus) about 5-6 inches in length who for the past 3 months has had a frayed tail and ventral fins (fins look like they were partially eaten away and have a little bit of a rough white exudate on them). <Mmmm, should have "grown back" over this time... if suitable environment (size, tankmates...), nutrition available> He looks great otherwise and eats like a champ. <Eating what? "Breakfast of Champions?"... hopefully substantial amounts of brown, red, green algae...> My local fish store here in Hawaii recommended Melafix for the fin issue. I had stepped up water changes without any change in the fin prior to trying the Melafix. I currently am on day 5 of the MelaFix treatment and wonder if I should finish out the 7 days or stop. Does this sound like Ich and if so what treatment if any would you recommend? <This homeopathic remedy I am NOT a fan of... has a mild anti-microbial effect... NOT useful on protozoan complaints> I have a 125 gallon SW tank, which has been running for 5 months with great water quality. Fish load is light with only a white spotted puffer, squirrel fish, blue damsel, and flame angel. Everyone else looks great. Thanks, Eric <Try bolstering the Nasos diet with soaking it in a vitamin prep. (e.g. Selcon), offering soaked/dried algae with a clip at the water's surface. Bob Fenner> <<Mmm, should have suggested he go collect his own Limu, living in Hawai'i... RMF>>
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