Gill Bubbles Thompson Tang 3/12/2009
Thank for all your help in past questions.
<Welcome>
I asked a question regarding lack of information on Thompson Tangs that Mr. Fenner helped me out with last year and now have another question pertaining to my 5" Thompson Tang. I've had him for about 7 months and ever since moving him to my newly setup 110G (5'long) tank (7weeks old), I noticed that my Thompson Tang often after eating, and maybe even at other times swims to the surface and apparently is breathing in or sucking up air/oxygen for a moment.
<Yes... like most Tangs... this fish needs high dissolved oxygen... esp. in times of higher activity, feeding...>
I only know he is doing this cause I will see bubbles exiting his gills for a couple seconds after the incident. I've noticed him doing this ever since putting him in this tank 5 weeks ago. I see him doing this at least 6+ times each day during my viewing. Prior to this, he was in a temporary 29G tank as it took me 3months to build my 110G tank/stand. In that time I didn't pay too much attention to know if he was doing this in that tank. Is this activity any cause for concern?
<Can be... low DO can contribute to, even cause death>
He is very active, and healthy looking. He is also a very heavy eater. I am pretty sure this does not have anything to do with oxygen levels in the tank
<Mmm, how is it you're sure? Is your DO 7-8 ppm?>
and there should be plenty as my filter is a wet/dry trickle filter with two added air pumps with air stones near the pump intakes. He gets along very well with the other fish that include, false percula, gold-stripped maroon clownfish, clown goby, neon goby, purple Firefish, royal gramma, blue yellow-tail damsel and a 5" Naso who is basically his best friend as they swim in tandem all time. Thanks for all your help.
Frank
<Mmm, the Naso should be similarly "afflicted"... might be that the Acanthurus has some other issue... at any length though, I might well arrange to have a lower temperature regimen, more surface agitation, less dissolved organics, and consider modifications that will remove surface film... Please read here: http://wetwebmedia.com/d_o_faqsmarine.htm
Bob Fenner>

Complications arising from treatment for Ich on a Acanthurus achilles   9/1/06
Hi Bob,
<Matt>
Firstly thank you so much for taking the time to read and reply.
About seven weeks ago I purchased an Achilles tang after years of wanting one I finally felt I had the system capable of supporting one.
He initially went into my refugium for a month and proceeded to do very well with no signs of ill health and eating voraciously, after being introduced into the display he showed a few spots for about 10 days before he worsened considerably.
I made the decision to remove him to Hypo at that point. I lowered him to what I thought was 1.009 however later discovered it to be 1.012 due to a faulty hydrometer. Whilst in hypo he degraded into the worst case of Ich I have ever seen. The fish was totally listless and unable to move effectively. I was concerned that I may have a strain resistant to Hypo so decided to administer a half dose of Cupramine.
Within three days all signs of Ich had abated, and with the specific gravity being maintained at 1.010 I decided to replace the carbon and remove the Cupramine. Now five days later the Ich has not returned, respiratory rate is normal.
<Good>
My problem is the fish is still very listless, unable to control his orientation and is not eating.
<Not too surprising>
Could I have somehow poisoned him with Cupramine or would a massive Ich infection cause enough electrolyte imbalance to cause these ongoing symptoms?
<Perhaps a bit of both>
I am at a loss, I don't know whether to slowly raise the salinity once more in the hope that may help or whether to wait it out.
<I would raise the spg... a thousandth per day or so>
It has been about a week now since he last ate and I am concerned that he will become to weak to recover.
<Me too>
Thank you in advance for your reply
Matt
<Life to you my friend. Bob Fenner>

<Not so> Weird Death of Achilles Tang   7/26/06
Hey Crew,
<Jeremy>
About a week ago, I decided to purchase an Achilles Tang (3.5"-4").  I researched the species for about 3-5 months reading whatever I could find on it.  Well, my LFS owner and I worked on a shipment of them for about two weeks in the store's medic tanks because they had an ick infection.
<Common>
Mine had what looked to be a secondary infection of fungus around the mouth area when it was in my tank.  
<Not fungal... bacterial>
I didn't QT him for my system as I had him QT'd in the LFS
<Not usually a good practice to rely on anyone else...>
and I thought the ick was over. Like I said, I checked in on him at the LFS, so I saw first hand that he was being taken care of and was well. I thought so anyway.
<Very easy for "cross-contamination" to occur in commercial settings... nets, other gear, water, livestock getting mixed...>
The tank was small for the species (55g), but a much bigger tank is scheduled to be setup in the house around the end of September (130g).
The tank had a good amount of current and had a heavy amount of dissolved Oxygen in the water.  I have had a blue tang (hippo) for a little over a year so I would think I would know how to take care of a tang...  Especially since I nursed the blue one back after feeling sorry for the pathetic look it had in a bad LFS.  I did read how hard the Achilles could be and I knew I was up for a challenge to say the least. The water parameters were spg:1.025, ph:8.4, temp:78F, Amm:0, Nitrite:0 and Nitrate:10.  
I set my medic tank up (29g) using water mostly from my main tank (about 75%) and some newly made water that set for about 36 hours.  The Achilles tang was doing ok and I was just starting to get him to eat prepared foods that the other fishes ate.  Meanwhile, he was making quick work of my Live Rock.  Not that I cared, I was happy to see him eat anything.  He was full bodied, almost all black with vibrant, bright orange markings, swam around normally, even sociable to me and others.
Not near the schizo that the blue one is. I would imagine everything sounds ok up to this point doesn't it?  Despite the tank size...  
The only thing wrong that I saw was the little bit of mouth fungus.  I went back to the LFS and he said Maracyn was probably the best idea.  I read that on the FAQ's too.  I noticed the remaining Achilles Tang's looked ok (in the mouth area) and that I wasn't overreacting.  I figured I would have a tough time getting him to eat if his mouth was hurting him so I wanted to get his mouth healed ASAP.
I waited until it was dark (less stress) to move the fish into the QT. I gave him a FW dip and then into the QT.  At first he swam around a little, and then he was laying on his side breathing heavily.  My blue tang does this when stressed (mostly during water changes) and I decided best to just leave it alone and let it recover.  I got up early the next morning to check on him and he was dead as a doornail.  
Any thoughts?  Could a fish go from doing "ok" to dead in a matter of hours with little change in the biological environment?
<Can/does happen... "just stress"...>
Was it doomed from the beginning?  An anomaly? I don't know what to think.
Thanks again,
Jeremy
<A percentage risk... Your reactions, plans were not "off"... I would likely have done what you state. Bob Fenner>

Re: Weird Death of Achilles Tang - 07/26/06
Thanks Bob.  Any chance you can catch me another one while diving in Hawaii?
<Do see these most days while out diving... And thanks for the chance to add a bit re their capture, husbandry... This Acanthurus species is surprisingly "soft-bodied"... and the best/better specimens are collected at night (while they're "lying" on the bottom, vs. in a barrier/mist net as most all marine fishes are captured... but where they get "beat" easily... and suffer consequently for it)>
It will be a while before I try any new fish.  I may try another Achilles, but later on.  The little monsters already swimming in my tank are a handful as it is.
One of the hardest aspects of this hobby is the planning.  You see so many fish that you would love to keep, but you can only keep so few...  
Jeremy
<I suspect this is a "adaptive behavior" of worth... and of economic principle... "Folks always want, and their wants can never be fully satisfied"... Wish you were out diving with us! BobF>

- Help with Ick on a Goldrim Achilles Tang -    6/14/06
I am interested in a Goldrim achilles hybrid at the local LFS but he has bad ich. They don't seem to know very much. I suggested vitamin C and algae to feed and Kick Ick but they don't know about any of it. <I don't know that the Kick Ich is a good idea.> Would I be better off to buy it and treat it myself or let them teat it. <Your choice - one of the two ways will cost you nothing.> I guess I should ask if the fish would be better off. <Too late for that...> I think I know more than them but do you have any tips as to aid in its survival.
<You can try but when these tangs get sick for real, they rarely make a comeback. You'd have to have a large quarantine system with excellent water quality to even begin to turn this fish around. Odds are not in your favor.>
Thanks, James G.
PS. They are only asking 40 dollars so I wouldn't be out too much...
<Or... you could save your $40 for the next one that comes in healthy. Cheers, J -- >

Achilles QT  9/21/05
<Adam J answering this evening>
I will try to be to the point.  Thank you very much for your time.
<The pleasure is mine>
I have a 125 G tank with a 75 G sump/make-shift refugium.  I have 2- 6"x6" overflows with Durso standpipes.  I would estimate about 150 lbs of live rock.  The tank was set up six months ago and I would consider it relatively
well established with copepods/amphipods/Mysis throughout.  I am using a Berlin Turbo Protein Skimmer.  My return pump is a Laguna 5000 (1100 gph).
<Cool, sounds like a nice set-up>
I regret buying that pump, but them's the breaks.  I have an auto top-off unit that is hooked into a 5 stage R/O unit.  Water parameters are always ideal, although I only test for nitrite, nitrate, and ammonia.
<This being a reef tank I would start testing calcium and alkalinity at the least.>
  pH is 8.2 and falls to about 8.05 at its lowest.  I add one cup each of A & B from Three Little Fishies daily.  Temp between 78-80 (damn Metal Halides!)
<This is an ideal temp. Nothing to be concerned over.>
Salinity is 1.023.  After some trial and error, all corals seem to be thriving.  I have a blue spotted watchman goby that sifts the sand like a champ, a fairy wrasse (rubriventralis), and a mandarin goby.
<I fear the Mandarin may have been added prematurely, keep an eye out for signs of starvation. Sadly most of them don’t live over a year in captive systems>
Various hermit crabs, snails, 3 conchs, and 2 sand sifting stars.  I needed more fish, and I bought one.  The Achilles Tang.
<Ok>
I did my research and am aware of the difficulty in keeping this beautiful fish.  He is in a 35 G QT that has been set up for over a month with rock and water from my show tank.
<I prefer bare-bottom tanks with PVC pipe for hiding rather than live rock in a quarantine tank, should you need to medicate this tank you will likely sterilize the live rock within it.>
  I have a small venturi skimmer and a emperor 400 filter on the QT.  The tang has been in the tank for three days.  He is eating anything I put in the tank and devoured the racemosa that was on the live rock as soon as he saw it.  A little early to declare victory, but I am optimistic.
<Maybe not victory yet but very encouraging nonetheless.>
How long should he stay in QT?  I would rather he be in a tank with better skimming and more rocks sooner than later.
<My recommendation is to quarantine at least 30 days.  Some diseases may not express themselves for up to 21 days, and tangs are notorious for bringing Cryptocaryon (marine ich) into a system.>
How often should I be performing water changes and how much should I change?
<Due to a quarantines water volume they tend to be unstable, many aquarists (myself included) perform small daily water changes on a quarantine tank.>
I have done one 5 G change with water from my main tank since introduction.
I am planning on doing 5 G changes with water from my main tank until the water parameters are virtually identical to help the acclimation process when the time comes.  Is this OK?
<As long as the water quality is stable in the display I see no problem, just be careful when using equipment on both tanks, you don’t want to contaminate your display.>
Also, should I upgrade my skimmer and main pump in the main tank?
<I would wait and see how things play out, if you are able to maintain the tank to your expectations then an upgrade would not be necessary. If the time comes when you are unsatisfied with your current products then I would upgrade.>
  What would you recommend?
<As far as skimmers I am fond of ASM, Euro-Reef and Aqua-C. As for pumps I like Iwaki for “dry” and Eheim for “wet”>
  Other than keeping an undesirable Tang, any other areas of concern?
<Tangs are in large part herbivorous so make sure he is offered fair such as Nori or dried seaweed as well as meaty affair.>
I would like to thank you again for all your help...  I did try to be brief. Oops.
<No worries.>
BJ Wincott
Niagara Falls, ON
<Adam J>

Achilles tang
Mr. Fenner, I have a few questions about the Achilles tang and a hybrid that occurs between it and the gold rim (powder brown). I have a 150g tank with a lot of LR, probably at least 125lbs, a protein skimmer, and I have excellent water conditions. I was wondering what you would think about my adding an Achilles tang to my tank as I think they are just beautiful. I have read your book and been to your WetWebMedia site and have gathered that they are somewhat touchy fish and they don't usually survive in captivity. 
<You are correct... and also tend to be "ich magnets" so to speak... Very important to get healthy specimens in good shape up front... acclimate them quickly, completely, and place them in a very well established, large, optimized system>
You mention that they need very high oxygenation in the water, which can be provided by lots of water movement, correct?
<Yes>
Also you mention that they need or enjoy higher salinity, in the 1.023-1.025 range. Other than these requirements and obvious good water quality, why do they not make it very often.
<A few things... as the genus and family goes, Achilles are "soft-bodied" and take a beating being caught, moved around... Their nature tends to a "wild side" with specimens frequently injuring themselves from swimming into tank sides et al. during the first few days/weeks of captivity... Their mouths are frequently mal-affected from the above and subsequently they may give up feeding...>
Do they get ich or carry it most of the time, or do they not eat or what.
I just wonder because I have happened across some other hobbyists on the internet that keep the Achilles tang and just love it.
<It is a fabulous species. Just on average, not easy to keep in captivity>
If I were to try to keep one, what should I do to increase the fishes chance of survival? Also, I have seen another Achilles tang that is absolutely incredible looking, it is an Achilles-powder brown (gold rim) tang hybrid that has got to be the most amazing fish I have ever seen. It has the basic Achilles colors, except the tail is bright powder blue. I have included a pic of it so you know exactly what I am talking about. I just wanted to know what you know (if anything) about the fish and if it is harder to keep than an Achilles or easier, what it might take to keep it, etc.
<Should be about the same>
Some guy on a fish forum says his LFS is selling them and I just wanted to know if I should try it, or stick to the regular Achilles. And one last thing about the Achilles, is there a certain locale that I should try to get it from (i.e., Hawai'i, Maldives, etc) that would produce a healthier, hardier fish?
<Are you in the United States? If so, the best ones come out of Hawai'i to here>
As much info as you have about the Achilles and the hybrid would be great, as I am really thinking about trying this fish. Thanks, Bob
<Sounds like you're about ready. Bob Fenner>

Achilles Tang, sel., dis.  03/09/2008
Crew -
<<Mike...Andrew today>>
I took a leap and decided to order an Achilles Tang from Marine Depot. It isn't set in stone for I am going to call them Monday morning to get some info on how long they have had them, eating, etc. - So I may change my mind. My question is, if needed, can these tangs undergo, hypo salinity treatment?
<<Yes, they can go through hypo-salinity if required. These are very delicate to say the least, and I have seen so many die in the home aquarium due to lack of knowledge about the species. Please do read more here with the linked articles and FAQ's http://www.wetwebmedia.com/acanthurTngs.htm>>
I know most can but with this particular specimen, I don't know if they can handle it. I know they are extremely difficult to take care of, but have done as much research as possible in the 3 months I have been waiting for them to be avail. They are very ich prone from what I have read, just wondering on your preferred methods of treatment if it were to come up. Thanks a bunch. Mike
<<Pay close attention the "Disease: Infectious, Parasitic, Nutritional, Genetic, Social" section of the linked article above. Thanks for the questions, hope this helps. A Nixon>>

Decompression?? Achilles losses, hypo   4/16/08
Hi crew,
I recently had some problems trying to keep my Achilles tangs alive. They were directly imported form Hawaii and during the 1st few days
they were doing quite well. I acclimatize them about 4-5 hours to low salinity (1.015) to quarantine them.
<Not a good practice w/ this Acanthurus species>
After the 3rd day of low salinity they suddenly died for no apparent reason, before that they starts to appear pale and their breathing was really heavy, overnight they start dying.
<Is the low spg. exposure>
I noticed that their abdomen was slightly bloated so suspected that their bladder.
<Water absorption>
Please advice me on the medication (if any) or what other methods can I use to counter this. Not possible to choose as I have stated that direct imported from Hawaii.
Thanks!
Anthony (Singapore)
<... Have collected this fish in Hawai'i' myself many times... Note how "soft-bodied" this fish is to your touch. Amongst already sensitive (to copper et al.) tangs, the Achilles does not tolerate reduced specific gravity well... and ones that have been "freshly collected" even less. I would adopt a different/better acclimation protocol. See WWM re: http://wetwebmedia.com/acclimat.htm
Bob Fenner>

Achilles tang help, hlth.  3-22-08
You guys are the greatest.
<Thanks, we try>
I just received an Achilles tang and a few other fish. I put them in their quarantine tank and every thing was normal. Last night somehow the bulkhead sprung a leak and I lost all but about 3 inches of water.
<Ouch - Teflon tape in the future, maybe?>
I replaced the water all and noticed my Achilles has come down with something that looks like fin rot.
<A bacterial infection likely caused by the stress from the leak>
I was wondering what I can do, and will his fins grow back if at all. Any information would be greatly appreciated.
<Yes, his fins will grow back after being appropriately treated with a common fin-rot treatment (antibiotic) from Seachem or Mardel, etc. This is a common ailment and all the information you'll ever need is easily found on our website - please see http://www.wetwebmedia.com/mardisindex.htm. Also, in the future please use proper spelling, grammar, and punctuation as these emails are made available to the public in our archives>
Thanks,
Brad
<M. Maddox>

Achilles Tang-Fin and Tail Rot, reading   9/29/08
Hello,
<Matt>
I recently purchased a Black Tang and an Achilles Tang.
<The last not easily kept...>
I have a 50 gallon quarantine tank I use for all new arrivals, before they go into my main display. My question is after about a month in the quarantine tank, the Achilles Tang developed fin and tail rot, and the Black Tang died. (I am beside myself with the Black Tang) I started a treatment with Melafix, will this help?
<No... worse than worthless. See WWM re>
The Achilles Tang lost about half of it's pectoral fins. My question is will they grow back?
<Could, possible>
And is my chosen treatment sufficient? The Black Tang was my first fish loss in about three years, and this is my first experience with  fin and tail rot.
Thank You,
Matt
<Or using, not using WWM... Please, search, read before writing us. Start here: http://wetwebmedia.com/WWMAdminSubWebIndex/question_page.htm
Bob Fenner>