Re: Mystery hitchhikers on my frogspawn - 2/11/2017
Thanks for the quick response. I have a couple of pics posted on the Bayou Reefkeeping forum. Here's a link:
Euphyllia eating Nudis?
<http://www.bayoureefkeeping.com/forums/topic/16109-euphyllia-eating-nudis/#comment-191958>
<Mmm; the little white bits right? I don't see rhinophores, gills on these... Look more like Scutus... a snail on what little I make out... white shells (could be overgrown), and black feet... No way for you to remove, shoot and send a better close up pic?>
It seems to be hiding within the soft tissue of the coral because there are times when you can't see it at all and then it just appears. Thanks again for the help!
<The better pic please. Bob Fenner>

Re: Mystery hitchhikers on my frogspawn - 2/11/2017
Actually, the long white thing that is extending down from the base of the soft tissue is one organism. The white bits are part of it.
<Don't see it mate>
There is no shell and it's all white. While it was extended out like that last night, I tried to suck it out with a turkey baster and it held fast. I then tried grab it with some tweezers and it still wouldn't come loose. It ended up breaking in two. The part that was still attached retracted up into the coral's soft tissue and I haven't seen it since. The part that broke off
kind of fell apart and the pieces were very small helical bits maybe 2-3 mm long. My fire fish ate ended up eating the pieces. Now I'm worried that it is going to die inside the soft tissue and as it rots will poison the coral. I'm debating whether I want to break the heads free from the rock and dipping them with Bayer.
<Have you considered fragging this colony? I might. B>
Re: Mystery hitchhikers on my frogspawn - 2/11/2017
Thanks for the quick response.
<<Hi Kevin and Bob. Sorry I’m a late arrival on this topic!>>
I have a couple of pics posted on the Bayou Reefkeeping forum. Here's a link: Euphyllia eating Nudis? http://www.bayoureefkeeping.com/forums/topic/16109-euphyllia-eating-nudis/#comment-191958
<Mmm; the little white bits right? I don't see rhinophores, gills on these... Look more like Scutus... a snail on what little I make out...white shells (could be overgrown), and black feet... No way for you to remove, shoot and send a better close up pic?>
<<Unfortunately, I can’t see enough detail in the photos to determine exactly what the subject is either. Offhand, it looks like a typical looping mass of Cerith snail eggs - I’ve seen these before on Euphyllids. Please see the following link for an example (bear in mind that these looping masses can be variably arranged): http://www.nano-reef.com/topic/270550-whats-on-my-frogspawn/ . Do you have any of these snails in your system? If so, and this is an egg mass, the multitude of loops should start breaking up and detaching within a few days.>>
It seems to be hiding within the soft tissue of the coral because there are times when you can't see it at all and then it just appears.
<<If this is an egg mass, perhaps it’s acting as an irritant? Honestly, I’m not a coral expert so I’m not sure if it’s possible for the soft tissue on a Euphyllids stalk to react by trying to alternately envelop then repel an irritant.>>
Thanks again for the help!
<The better pic please. Bob Fenner>
<<You’re very welcome. I just wish I could have given you a concrete answer. Ditto what Bob said regarding a photo (if possible!). Take care, Lynn Zurik>>
<Thank you Lynn. B>

Re: Mystery hitchhikers on my frogspawn: Mesenterial Filaments - 2/11/2017
<Greetings, Kevin>
I do not have any Cerith snails
<There goes that theory! On the plus-side, I believe I have an answer for you.>
and I've never seen snail eggs move around like this.
<No, any movement would have to have been caused by something else: water current, hatching individuals, instability/movement of whatever the mass was deposited upon, or perhaps a critter of some sort wriggling about inside the mass.>
Unfortunately, I can't get another picture because after I tried to pull it off, it retracted back up into the soft tissue of the coral.
<Yep, this is normal (see below).>
There is no question in my mind that it is some kind of separate organism. I have posted another picture to the forum- this time with annotation.
<Yes, I see – thanks. After thinking about this a bit more this morning, I started wondering if what we were seeing was simply part of the coral itself, and that was the ticket. All those loopy structures (that look like guts) did indeed come from inside the coral. They’re mesenterial filaments that, thanks to stinging cells/nematocysts, are used to capture/digest, as well as fight off any threat/intrusion into a coral’s “space”. It could be that the coral detected a threat (physical or chemical), and deployed the filaments. I see a small collection of vermetid gastropods to the left of the filaments that may be at least part of the issue. Vermetids send out sticky strands to catch food particles that drift by. Those strands could be contacting the coral’s soft tissue and irritating it. I ran across a photo at WWM that looks very similar: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/carydisf7.htm . Please see the query at the bottom of the page titled “Worm infestation… no -12/28/2007”, as well as a WWM search for mesenterial filaments, Vermetids.>
I appreciate the time you have spent trying to help me.
<No problem, I hope this helps. By the way, if you decide to get rid of the Vermetids, you can do so my either breaking them off with tweezers at the base (do not use bare hands – the tubes are brittle and very sharp!), or seal the tube openings with some gel-type Cyano glue.>
Hopefully the new picture will help you see it better.
<I think we’re good to go! Take care, Lynn Zurik>
Thank you Lynn. B <Always a pleasure, Bob!>
Follow-up Re: Mystery hitchhikers on my frogspawn: Mesenterial Filaments - 2/11/2017
Awesome! Thanks for the diagnosis.
<You are most welcome.>
Jordan was right that you know your stuff.
<Well, we all learned something this time! All I knew was that things weren’t adding up, critter-wise, so I followed a hunch and it paid off.>
You just saved the coral from the trauma of being broken off the rock and dipped again.
<Good>
I just knew it was some kind of parasite.
<I can certainly understand why.>
Unfortunately, in my haste to keep a parasite from harming my coral, I tore some of its mesentery trying to remove it. Hopefully it recovers!
<I would think so.>
It all makes perfect sense now that I put all the pieces together. They had (very small) Vermetids on them when I bought them as frags. The coral and the Vermetids have both grown considerably since I got them.
<Yay, regarding the coral! As for the Vermetids, they thrive/multiply in high nutrient conditions so do keep an eye on this. Same goes for what appears to be some Spionid or Chaetopterid worms to the right of the mesenterial filaments. In silhouette, you can see a number of paired feeding tentacles (“palps”). Although not visible in the photo, these palps extend from hardened mucus tubes covered with sand grains, bits of substrate, and/or shell. These worms are typically harmless/beneficial particulate feeders/detritivores but when numerous can irritate corals, particularly Zoanthids.>
In the last couple weeks, the coral has not been extending as much as it had been. Now I realize it was due to the Vermetids growing as much as they have. I will try scraping them off now that I know they are causing irritation.
<Good idea. Just be careful. You do not want to get a nasty infection after cutting yourself on those sharp little shells!>
Thanks again!
<It was a pleasure! Take care, Lynn Zurik>