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FAQs about Health/Disease of Tangs 10
Related Articles: The Surgeonfish family,
Acanthurus, Ctenochaetus,
Naso, Paracanthurus,
Zebrasoma , Prionurus,
Surgeonfishes of Hawai'i,
Surgeonfishes for Reef Systems,
Related FAQs: Tang Health/Disease 1,
Tang Health/Disease 2, Tang
Health/Disease 3, Tang Health/Disease
4, Tang Disease 5,
Tang Disease 6,
Tang Disease 7, Tang Health 8,
Tang Health 9,
Tang Disease 11, Tang Disease 12,
Tang Disease 13, & Tangs/Rabbitfishes &
Crypt, Yellow Tang Disease,
Black Spot Disease, HLLE 1, Tangs
in General,
Tang ID,
Selection, Tang
Behavior,
Compatibility, Systems,
Feeding, Treating
Marine Disease, Marine Diseases 2, | 
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Kole Tang Run in with Tunze….once an accident, twice a mistake, but more
get a clue? 7/25/06
Hi there: <Hello>
My Kole
Tang has been a super tough guy since I got him in December or so.
Always big and fat and eating. But on day 2 for reasons unknown I had to
free him from the overflow intake. Hmmm... Then in January, he twice
was stuck to the intake of a Tunze 6060 rotating on Sea-Swirls.<Poor
guy> That was odd indeed. Second time he was on it for a while,
seriously tattooed on one side.
<Hmmm I probably would have done
something creative to keep the fish from the intake and overflow the
first time there was a problem. Perhaps the pumps are to strong or the
fish weak for some unknown reason.>
Recovered from that though too.
<Lucky fish>I target fed to make sure he ate well and frequently, at
least 3x a day. Starting maybe in March, I'd say every couple weeks I'd
arrive home to see that the scales were missing in a splotch on one
side, almost always on his left side. In fact, I think always….that is
the side he was stuck on that last time on the Tunze.
<I wish you
were kidding but I have a feeling you’re not. Seriously you need to do
something to keep that poor fish off the intake of that pump. 4 months
every 2 weeks…. so the poor fish has been injured at least 8 times in
the last 4 months, not including his original 3 injuries. How many times
does it have to happen before you do something about it?>
Anyway,
I'd always target feed and he'd always eat and it would always clear up
within a couple of days.
<Very resilient. It’s great that you are
taking such good care of him after he is injured but some prevention
would go much further. One of these days the poor fish will not be so
lucky.>
I'm thinking, tough guy.
<Perhaps initially but every
time he gets hurt he is probably getting weaker, with a good chance of
some permanent damage to that left side.>
Now I am not so sure.
Tonight he is deep within the rockwork, not breathing hard, but
hiding. I can see that the scales are missing between his eyes right on
his head, and a bit on the side of his mouth. Hard to tell much else as
it's dark in there, even when the lights are blasting away! Not a
chance of getting a picture. Most worrisome is he didn't come out when
he saw me or when I fed the tank and that is an absolute first.
<Indeed, not a good sign.>
That has me concerned in the morning
he'll be gone.
<As you should be, there is a good chance he could
be. I would try turning the lights off and doing a water change.>
When I say the scales are missing is I see white flesh. I figured wounds
somehow against the rocks or maybe he picked a bad fight, though with
whom given my stock I haven't a clue. He should be the boss.
<Hard
to say given you have not listed the tankmates. Less dominant fish will
often pick on injured or weakened fish.>
Anyway, white flesh is
apparent now on his head similar to in the past when always on his body.
<Perhaps this was his last run in with the power head intake. If not and
he survives you need to do something with that Tunze intake>
Any
ideas what this could be or what I could do???
<Sounds to me like he
had yet another run in with the Tunze. If you can gently get him out of
the tank, you could try putting him in another tank to recover….. a
hospital tank where he is safe from the Tunze and other fish. Set it up
similarly to a quarantine tank with hiding places. Keep the lights off
and water quality good. If he survives PLEASE do the poor fish a favor
and do something with that pump intake. Build a mesh basket around it or
place a sponge over it. We do this all the time in seahorse tanks. It’s
really not a big deal. It may not be esthetically pleasing and the
sponge will need to be removed frequently to be cleaned, but at least
the fish will be protected from further trauma. This may sound harsh,
but needs to be said… once an accident, twice a mistake but really 3 and
on up times is irresponsible to say the least. You really should have
done something a long time ago. It is your responsibility to protect the
creatures in your care from harm as best you can. Leslie.>
Re: Kole Tang Run in with Tunze….once an accident, twice a mistake, but
more get a clue? (continued) 7/25/06
No, you have totally
misunderstood. I don't know how you misread that but sorry for my part.
<I apologize for the misunderstanding>
Anyway, the Tunzes are
out. I now have modified MaxiJet 1200s on the swirls, he's never had a
problem with them.
<That’s good to hear>
These wounds are not
the wounds he had when stuck in the pump, and began to appear months
after those incidents, which have not recurred. This is not a pump
issue. Something else is going on.
I have a pic now at
www.ostrows.us/sickkoletang.jpg
I'm wondering if there is some
parasite or bacterial disease that could do this?
<It’s possible but
hard to say for sure. Those are good-sized white patches/wounds. It is
really hard to tell from the photo if they are actually wounds with
broken skin or white patches. In my experience white patches of
bacterial and parasitic etiology are not usually that size when first
noticed. There is usually some indication something is going on earlier,
before the patches get to that size.> Tankmates: 2 green chromis, 1
royal Gramma, 1 percula, 1 hepatus, 1 scribbled rabbit, 1 mandarin goby,
1 Flamehawk. He's the biggest except for the rabbitfish.
<I am going
to guess that perhaps he injured himself on the rock or was injured by
the venomous spiny rays of the rabbitfish. If he seems to be holding his
own in your display tank and none of the other fish are bothering him I
would leave him where he is and keep a close eye. In addition I would
recommend a water change, maintaining stable and pristine water quality
as well as the addition of a vitamin like Vita Chem to a healthy varied
diet. I would also add some Bets Glucan to his food. You can get this at
most health food stores. Beta-glucan is a potent immunostimulant that
provides important health benefits for fishes. Research indicates that
it helps prevent infections and helps wounds heal more quickly; it is
safe to use in conjunction with other treatments and has been proven to
increase the effectiveness of antibiotics; is known to alleviate the
effects of stress; and to help fish recover from exposure to toxins in
the water (Bartelme, 2001) .
For more information on Beta Glucan for
aquarium fish, please see the following article:
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/sept2003/feature.htm
If
he does not appear to be doing well in your display tank and the other
fish are harassing him. I would remove him to a hospital tank and follow
the above directions. If the wounds appear to be getting worse you may
want to consider the addition of medication.
I hope this helps,
Leslie> Kole Tang Run in with Tunze, once an
accident, twice a mistake, but more get a clue? (continued 7-31-06)
I'm using Selcon regularly.
<That's great! Vita Chem has additional
nutrients. It might be nice to rotate the 2 supplements. Rotating
supplements is another way of varying the diet so your fish get a
variety of nutrients.>
I have Beta Glucan around (are you Puffer
Queen in another world?) which I have used in an anti-ich food recipe
that works wonders for me.
<Nope, not the Puffer Queen in any world,
more like the Seahorse Queen in this world. I do have Puffers though
(not in the same system as my seahorses>
Maybe I'll try that.
<That should be fine as long as there are no medications in your
anti-ich food recipe. Take care, Leslie> Re: Kole
Tang Run in with Tunze, once an accident, twice a mistake, but more get
a clue? (continued 7-31-06)
Thanks.<Your welcome>
There are
medications in the ich recipe. I'd just use Beta Glucan for this, though
an antibiotic is going to be tempting if it happens again, given the
seeming risk of infection with that size wound. Hopefully your ich
recipe does not contain any antibiotics, since ich is a parasite and
antibiotics will have absolutely no effect on it. The problem with the
indiscriminate or inappropriate use and inadequate dosing of antibiotics
and other medications is that this causes the organisms to build up
resistance creating super strains of organisms. These resistant
organisms do not respond to the traditional medications in the
traditional doses thus making treatment difficult and limiting treatment
options. I am sure you have heard the expression "An ounce of prevention
is worth a pound of cure." There is a great couple of article about
disease prevention in the marine aquarium please do have a look at this
here....
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/mardisease.htm
Take care and best of
luck with your Tang, Leslie> Tang QT - 7/25/2006
Hi Lisa,
<<Hey Elise!>>
I need some advice!
<<Gladly.>>
Yesterday I bought a yellow tang. I gave it a ph and temp adjusted
freshwater dip before placing it in the QT tank. It died within an
hour. I am convinced the dip killed it because before the dip it was
bright yellow, vibrant and active, and after the dip it looked, well,
deathly.
<<Ouch, sorry to hear that.>>
I wonder if I dipped it
too long (nine minutes). I have performed this dip before with great
success, (on my blue tang), so I'm not sure what I did wrong. My kids
have their heart set on a yellow tang, so I bought another one, and put
it directly in my QT. It has one black spot, I'm sure it's black ick,
(I've seen it before).
<<Ick is not black.>>
My research leads
me to believe I should dip it, but I'm afraid! Should I dip for maybe 4
minutes? Do I need to treat the QT tank with copper or anything? It's
been in there about a day. Its bright yellow, and pacing up and down
the glass vigorously.
<<I would just do a hyposalinity extended
QT. Remind me, how large is your tank? With a regal and a yellow tank,
it really needs to be at least 6 feet long.>>
As always, thanks in
advance for your help!
Elise
<<Always glad to help my friend.
Lisa.>> Torn caudal spine, tang 7/3/06
I have a 250 gallon reef tank and I recently noticed that my sohal tang
has a torn caudal spine. Not sure what it could have been from but am
concerned about it. What do you recommend? Thanks Brett
<Mmm,
actually "nothing"... such tears/damage are not uncommon, and can, often
do heal of themselves. Handling tangs is dangerous business... most all
collectors have been sliced, gashed as times (I have on several
occasions)... It's not worth the possibility of damage to yourself or
the fish... The usual recommendation here to do what you can to provide
good environmental conditions, nutrition otherwise. Very likely there
will be no repercussions to the health of this fish from this damage.
Bob Fenner> Copper Treatment...Tangs And
Other Sensitive Fish 6/21/06
I'm about to start treating my
purple tang, firefish goby, royal Gramma, and neon goby with copper to
rid my tank of ich once and for all. The cleaner
shrimp and garlic
helped, but the ich would always reemerge after a few days. I have been
reading for WWM for the last 2 hours about copper
treatment to make
sure I do it right. From my understanding measuring the amount of
copper in the water is essential, especially when dealing with
tangs
and other scale-less fish/es.
<Yes>
I also read that many people
seem to have trouble reading levels of chelated copper and that test
kits are specific to either chelated or ionic copper. I have a bottle
of CopperSafe (chelated) and a bottle of SeaCure (ionic). Which would
you recommend I use? I also have a Salifert copper test kit on the way
in the mail.
<To measure the concentration of Copper Safe, a
chelated or total copper test kit is required. All readings should be
based on the total copper or chelated
copper results and not the
free copper results. The Salifert Test Kit measures dissolved or weakly
chelated copper. Strongly chelated copper will measure very low or not
at all with the Salifert Kit. I believe the Copper Safe is strongly
chelated. Bob, do you agree?> <<Is, do. RMF>>
Do you know which (if
either) type of these two copper medications would the Salifert test
measure more accurately?
<The Sea Cure would be my choice.>
Can
I rely on this test kit?
<Yes, a very accurate kit.>
After
reading several letters, it seems like many people treat the bare
hospital tank as directed on the bottle but then get strange results
when measuring with a test kit.
<I'm guessing the proper kit isn't
being used for the type copper they are using.>
Also, I'm still
confused as to the amount (ppm) and duration of treatment for tangs and
other sensitive fish. 0.15-0.25 ppm of ionic or
1.5-2.0 ppm of
chelated seems the standard, tangs and firefish too??
<I would
monitor the copper level very close and maintain at 1.5ppm with these
types of fish.>
Twenty-one consecutive days is what most people seem
to recommend. Then again I also read that Bob stated he would not treat
a tang for this long and drop
treatment to 14 days instead.
<Bob, is this dated info, or can tangs be treated at 1.5ppm for 21 days
safely?> <<Better to limit to minimum dose, exposure time. RMF>>
Thank you in advance
<You're welcome. James (Salty Dog)>
Ich and Tangs Part II 6/5/06
One more question on treating my
Yellow Tang, in re-reading over info on your site, I found the following
response to treating a tang with copper.
"<However, a standard
aquarium copper remedy, used in accordance with manufacturer's
instructions, is very effective. Avoid long-term use of copper with
tangs, as it could damage their digestive fauna>"
Is 4 weeks too
long? <Most likely ok.> I have one more fish to catch ( my Falco
Hawkfish) then all fish will be out of my reef and it can go fallow for
2 months. The tang has been in the QT with CopperSafe for almost a week
now. If I put the Hawkfish in there tonight, and wait 3 weeks, the Tang
will have been in copper for 4 weeks. Is this too long? <Probably fine,
but do watch carefully.> Should I remove him and put him elsewhere in
another week or will 4 weeks be Ok?
<Will probably be fine, but if
possible I would treat separately. Probably an overly cautious
approach, but once the Hawkfish is added you need to treat fully again
since Ich will be reintroduced to the QT and if the tang begins to
suffer options will be limited.>
On a side note, my canary fang
blenny is eating much more aggressively in the QT tank... (no LR to pick
at, he got hungry and decided he likes Mysid shrimp!)
<Excellent, a
small positive to the QTing process. Something to help carry you
through the seemingly endless weeks before you can start restocking the
tank.>
Thanks again,
Mike
<Chris>
Sailfin Tang Injury, Skin Disease? - 04/22/2006
I will keep
this short and sweet.
<Just the way I like it! Well.... most o'
the time.>
Been reading pages and pages on your website (love
it, wealth of useful info)
<Glad it is of service to you.>
But have been un-able to find a clear answer on this problem I'm
having with my juvenile sailfin tang.
<And I hope we can help!>
Established reef system (285L)
<A little small for a fully grown
sailfin.... But of course, by the time the fellow has grown, you'll
have become addicted to pet-fish and you'll have a larger system,
eh?>
of about 12 months, Ammonia = 0, Nitrite = 0, PH = 8.1
<I'd like to see this a tenth or two higher.>
and nitrate is at
about 10ppm. Salinity 1.022,
<And might like to see this just a
touch higher, 1.024ish, but okay.>
temp at about 25.5C
Filtration by overhead wet dry filter. Lighting is provided by 3 bar
fluor (2 white and one actinic blue)
<This is a reef
tank? Hopefully you don't mean normal output fluorescents? Or your
photosynthetic animals have very low lighting requirements?>
Corals and fish all happy and growing well, but sailfin has a
strange skin condition. Does have a small white patch over right eye
(I thought HLLE)
<Mm, if over only one eye, may just be from a
scratch or injury....>
and a small patch of What looks to be
normally coloured scale free skin. This area has grown in the last
six months (see pics).
<Excellent images! I very much think
that this is also the site of an injury, or contact with a
particularly aggressive Cnidarian perhaps.... I would first observe
VERY closely at different times during the course of a day to see
what other animals might have been to blame, then quarantine this
fellow for treatment if the site does not begin to improve on its
own very shortly. The animal looks otherwise quite good; clear
fins, etc.... may very well recover on its own.>
Sailfin readily
takes sea veggies, Nori Sushi wrap, flake food (JBL Maris and Krill)
Mysis and brine shrimp (likes to eat....just like me!).
<Hey, we
should all head out for dinner! I'm not keen on Nori, though, the
tang can have my share.>
Have treated with tri-sulfa tonight and
await outcome.
<This will likely help.>
I wonder if you
could help identify this disease as I have not been able to find
pictorial evidence to compare to.
<I really am leaning more
toward the idea that this is an injury or reaction to a coral or
Cnidarian sting rather than an infection.>
Was tri-sulfa the
right choice.
<I've no quarrel with Tri-Sulfa, this will likely
help the animal to heal - though I DO hope he's being treated in a
quarantine system and NOT the main tank, for an endless number of
reasons....>
Thanks for you time.
<Of course!>
Andrew
<All the best to you, -Sabrina> | 
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Re: Sailfin Tang Injury, Skin Disease? - 04/22/2006
Hi Sabrina,
<Hi, Andrew!>
Thank you so much for your reply,
<You bet.>
I'm glad the images were of some help.
<Yes, great
help. An image (well, a clear one anyway) is worth so much more than
the cliché of a thousand words.>
In answer to your query about the
high output fluoro's.... to be truthful I don't know if they are or not,
but in any case I've specifically chosen corals with low light
requirements, all LPS corals.
<Even many LPS have need
of more than normal output fluorescents, so do please take a look at the
needs of those you keep or have an interest in keeping.>
Will work
on raising the Ph and salinity a little over the next week,
<It's
not "off" enough to be an incredibly urgent issue at this point anyway.>
but am unable to treat this fish in quarantine, as I no longer have my
smaller tank.
<Oh my....>
I know its not ideal,
<Not at ALL,
for many, many reasons.... the safety of your invertebrates, bacterial
colonies, and more for just one reason....>
but the guy at my LFS
assured me the tri-sulfa would not harm anything, aside from killing
some of the bacteria in my filter....
<And possibly harming/damaging
other life....>
but should be fine with only 2 or 3 treatments. I
hope this was accurate!!
<I would discontinue treatment
and do a water change, to be quite honest. I would also (quickly) look
into a quarantine tank.... Even one of just 10 to 20 gallons would
suffice.>
Once again, thank you so much for your advice. -Andrew.
<Glad to be of service. Wishing you well, -Sabrina> Sailfin Tang
Injury, Skin Disease? - III - 04/22/2006
Ok it seems I'm in a
spot of bother then!! I Just did a water change yesterday, will have to
mix up a new batch. I'll put the carbon back into the filter to absorb
as much as I can over night. Will let you know how it goes in a couple
weeks. Thanks again.
<Glad to be of service. Please do look into a
quarantine tank.... It will be a small or moderate expense now, but
will save you much in life and frustration as time goes by. Read most
any of our saltwater ich FAQs files to understand how vitally important
a quarantine tank will be to you. Take care, -Sabrina>
Tang, et al. fishes parasitic problems, aquarium keeping
4/8/06
Hi there Bob,
<Stefan>
About 10 days ago I got
myself an Acanthurus japonicus Surgeon, about 10cm long. When I added
the fish he was a
bit intimidated by the larger fox face and the
tang did not really eat much for the first three days.
<Not atypical
behavior for a new Tang... esp. in the presence of an established
Acanthuroid species>
I moved the Fox to the sump to give the tang
chance to relax and hopefully get him to eat, which he did in small
quantities.
<No quarantine....?>
About five days after I added
him I noticed he became very uncomfortable with something and he kept on
doing fast
turns, like something chasing or biting him, he will be
relaxed the one moment, and next thing doing fast "8
figure" moves.
Closer inspection revealed that there are about 9 very small black spots
on the rear half of the
body, no spots on fins. Before I noted the
spots I suspected some gill parasite and I give him a freshwater
dip
with methylene blue for 6 minutes. Doing this made a big difference and
he stopped doing the crazy sudden turns.
He still occasionally
scratch himself against the glass after I did the dip. I read that
stress and a poor diet can cause
the black spot parasite to attack
the fish. The fish ate little till about day 6 when I started adding
"Entice" and
"Garlic Guard" to his Nori, now he eats a lot !!! great
products!!! The amount of black spots looks less, but are
still
apparent. This might be a stupid question, but should I put him through
all the stress to try and catch him for a
second dip, or should I
now leave him since his eating very well?
<... a bunch to state
ahead of a simple "yes/no" response here... This is likely a fluke
infestation... that might have become established now in your
main/display system... dipping and/or treating them elsewhere and
returning host fish won't really cure them...>
The colour of the
fish is now much more bright compared to the first week. The fox is
still in the sump with no signs of black spots. My tank is a 300L reef
with
about 11 KG crushed live rock on a thick Aragamite bed using a
plenum, lots of artificial rock... System is running for about 9 months.
Water Chemistry is very good.
Thank You Bob,
Stefan, South
Africa
<Welcome... Do please read here:
http://wetwebmedia.com/parasittkfaq2.htm
and the linked files
above re "Parasitic Systems"... and embrace such acclimation and
quarantine procedures outside your principal displays. Bob Fenner>
Oh my god, Help me!!!! SW Parasite problem? A good case for Hitchhiker's
Guide: Don't Panic 4/1/06
Oh my god, I can't believe
I have a problem with a parasite and I can't find any info about it
anywhere. Please help me. I have a 150
gallon tall tank. I have a 3"
yellow tang, 2 baby hippos 1 1/2", 1 PJ cardinal, 2 black clowns, algae
bunny, 2 small false percula clowns.
Three days ago I noticed my
smaller of the two hippo tangs to have a small black spot on her side.
Not like a grain of salt. BIGGER! Looked more like a big piece of poop
stuck to her side. She didn't seem to bothered with it until day 2. On
the second day she began to scratch almost every few minutes. I
discovered it could be a parasite so I called 8 LFS in the phonebook,
nobody knew what it was.
<Might be "nothing" pathogenic>
I qt
ALL my fish prior to placing in my display tank. She was in QT 6
weeks...
She looked good so I placed her in the display. I had the
water tested at LFS yesterday.
<Water chemistry changes with time,
transport... for what you have invested here, I would get/use my own
kits>
He said everything is great with your water. That isn't you
problem. Now today she has a gapping hole in her side and
looks like
something is in the re. Help. The tank is 3 1/2 foot deep
<Yikes!
Custom!>
so this will be fun trying to catch and put in QT. It takes
two people to do this on each side of
the tank to catch the fish.
FUN, FUN, Today I noticed the smaller black clown has the same spot on
this side. Help me please. The spot
is as big as, if not bigger than
the balled end of a straight pin. The hippo is not eating as well as she
has been. I need Big help before
she dies. All other fish have been
in the tank 6 months now. Tank has been running w no problems for 8
months now. Thanks in advance for
your help. I sure do need it.
Julie
<Mmm, I would drain the tank down to facilitate all the tangs
removal, and dip them per what you read here:
http://wetwebmedia.com/YellowTang.htm
re Paravortex (which this
likely is)
and here:
http://wetwebmedia.com/dips_baths.htm
and the linked files
above... and move the fish to QT to avoid re-infestation... for a month
or more and all should be well. Oh, and I would add a purposeful cleaner
organism here. Also covered on WWM. Bob Fenner> Sohal Tang, HLLE
3/4/06
Bob, <James today>
I have had a 7" Sohal Tang (which
has been a great fish) in my FO 135ga. tank for about five years. I
recently converted my tank from fish only to a reef tank (currently only
have a Clown and a mix of inverts). During the conversion, I realized my
Sohal Tang had HLLE. He only had one pit but was showing other
symptoms. I have read much on your site about HLLE and Sohal Tangs.
After noticing that he had HLLE, I took him to the LFS (a very good one)
so they could treat him and find him a home. I did not know for sure how
to treat him and was not sure he would do good in a reef tank. They have
treated him for about three to four weeks and he seems to have improved.
The LFS said that I can get him back for no charges. I would to get him
back, but want your opinion.
Now that my tank setup (and water
conditions) have improved greatly. Good protein skimmer/ W/D filter
25ga. sump/ 250lbs. live sand (about 3 1/2" to 4")/ 60 lbs. LR will add
more slowly/ Nitrates very low now!
Should he do alright in a reef
tank? <Sure>
If I change his diet (as directed on your site) and
with improved water quality is it likely that his condition will reverse
itself? <Does/can happen. Weekly/Bi-weekly water changes are a must
also.>
Your site states that the salinity (for a Sohal Tang) should
be kept near 1.025 , this is where I keep my FO tank.
Should he
adjust to a salinity of 1.022 (where my tank is now)? <Sure, just do it
slowly.>
Should I look for a younger and smaller Sohal Tang for my
reef tank? <Better to keep what you have.>
Thanks, <You’re
welcome. James (Salty Dog)>
Kent
Poorly Atlantic Blue
Tang.... 2/3/06
Hi All,
We have a 55 UK
gallon tank, with 30 kilos of Live Rock, MC500 Deltec, 2 power heads,
250 halide and two blue arcadias. Fish stock includes
Mandarin
Yellow tang
Atlantic blue tang
2 Green Chromis
2 percula
clowns
Brownbarred goby
Six lined Wrasse
9 red hermits
6
turbo snails
1 cleaner shrimp.
Our problem is our Atlantic blue
tang, it seems to have what I can only described a bubbly skin and there
are a couple of white spots on it.
<Unfortunately... quite prone to
such troubles... as are most Atlantic Surgeonfishes>
We are guessing
its Ich but we're not getting much help from our LFS who have told us
the just leave him and he will get over it?!?
<Not if it were
indeed crypt/ich... but I doubt this is what you are observing...
otherwise your other fishes would be mal-affected as well>
We are
concerned as we are relatively new to this and would like to do what is
right! I've read a lot of articles on this site with regards to
freshwater dips, garlic copper and so on and from this have deduced
freshwater dips are the way to go. Would you think this was advisable?
<Not w/o knowing what is going on here>
He is still eating well but
does seem a little irritable. Many thanks for any help and advice you
can give to us Brits as I haven't found a website as useful as yours in
the UK.
Emma and Simon, Lake District, UK
<Mmm, need more
information re the chemical make-up of this system. Were your fishes
quarantined ahead of placement? I would be leery re "adding something"
here in the way of "medicine"... Is there an aquarist friend, stockist
who might come by and take a look at your set-up, livestock? Bob Fenner>
Re: Poorly Atlantic Blue Tang.... 2/6/06
Thanks to
Bob Fenner for is prompt reply,
The tang seems to have deteriorated
overnight, he now have a number of visible white spots and his skin is
very bumpy and has developed two 5mm
white patches which looks like
the loss of pigment. All the chemicals are fine all tests have come back
as spot on. No fish have been
quarantined prior to putting in the
tank as we "assumed" this was done by the place we've been buying them
from.
<Not a good assumption>
Unfortunately there isn't anyone
local to come and check out our system we're a little in the
middle
of nowhere the most local person originally advised us to us water out
of the stream which runs through our back garden at first
(!!!) so
wouldn't trust anything he had to say. That's why we have to travel over
an hour to the best one in the area. No other fish are
affected at
all which makes me wonder if it is ich as I would have thought maybe the
clowns would have got it by now.
<As stated, this fish (Acanthurus
coeruleus likely) and other TWA tangs just don't "cut it" in
captivity... for whatever reason/s>
We have a cleaner wrasse but the
tang won't let him near and just chases him away.
<Labroides are not
found in the Atlantic...>
The fish store is posting out some
bacterial type to put into the system but I'm hesitant to use it,
especially due to the loss of pigment on his
skin. Many thanks if
there is any help you can give me, Emma, UK.
<Not much more to say
unfortunately. Bob Fenner>
SAILFIN TANG under Stress? 11/22/05
Hi. I Just added a
sailfin tang to my tank, past Wednesday. It was sold as in good
condition. But I noticed that it had a bulge in its stripes, just below
its snout on the lower part of his body. The size is about 2.5 inches.
It is not eating. I've been feeding the same as all the fishes in the
tank, marine fish pellets. It's kept with a black percula clownfish,
yellow tang, powder brown tang and a yellow tailed damsel, they are all
peaceful with each other except the yellow tang which sometimes gets a
little bit aggressive but doesn't do any harm. The sailfin doesn't move
much from its territory,
<A clue that these tangs are not "getting
along">
and I don't know if I've seen correctly but it has
eaten some of the other fish's wastes.
<Yes, natural. No worries>
I added a lettuce leaf to see, if it would at least go try it, but
wasn't successful, although I didn't know i had to boil the lettuce leaf
before introducing it to the aquarium. Also, I noticed like a white
thing coming out of its snout, as if it had a tongue, I don't know if
its a tongue or a parasite, or if its just blowing or what not which I
don't seem to see in any of the other fishes. As you can see I'm a
beginner, and its the first time I've had a problem like this. If you
have any advice, i would appreciate it, because its a beautiful fish and
wouldn't want to lose it..
Thanks in advance,
Frances Aviles
Guadalajara, Mx
<You really should move this sailfin tang to another
system, and soon. Though it may not appear to be "fighting", there is
too much antagonism for it to live comfortably in this setting. Bob
Fenner>
Black Ich and a Fallow Tank, Avoiding infectious and parasitic marine
disease 10/25/05
We now QT everything which has finally given us
a completely ich free tank with Tangs (including the Hippos... and they
are much, much calmer without those occasional spots!).
<I'll bet>
It has been 6 months since they returned to the tank and we've had a few
temp. drops from electricity going out. No spots AT ALL have showed up
(and I watch them daily)... so, I am a total believer of the experts
that you can have an ich free tank!!!
<Can>
My question is around
black ich. We are getting some corals from someone who has had ich and
black ich before (and possibly flukes). We know that 6 weeks QT will
ensure we do not transfer ich... but want to make sure that
Turbellarians, flukes, etc. will all perish if kept in a fish free
environment/QT. Will we be safe? What are the life cycles of the worms
and flukes?
<Simple to complex and diverse... some requiring or
facilitated by intermediate hosts, vectors, others more direct... there
are dip adjuncts that you can use to give you more likelihood of
avoiding pathogens... Bob Fenner> Head Line Lateral Erosion,
no.. Head & Lateral Line Erosion (in) Tangs = Poor Husbandry - 10/24/05
Hello,
<Hi Joe>
I am emailing you because I believe that I have a
yellow tang with head and lateral line erosion.
<Ok>
This is
about the third time this has happened to me in the past couple of
months. The tangs are healthy when I buy them, then they turn red around
their eyes and lateral line, their fins begin to erode, and after about
three months they die.
<Something environmental (your tank) is not
right, either sub-par water quality, stray electrical voltages or poor
variety/improper diet.>
I feed the tang Spirulina pellet food, mysis
shrimp, and Formula 2. Is there a problem with this diet?
<Actually
it's pretty good but I would try to increase the variety, maybe some
dried Nori or a nutritional supplement like Selcon.>
The other tank
inhabitants include a Volitans lionfish, a maculosus angel, a
Soldierfish, and a dogface puffer.
<This assortment of “messy” makes
me tend to believe you may have nutrient problems which can lead to t he
poor water quality and thus HLLE. Be sure to keep on regular water
changes.>
The maculosus seems ok, but he has a small
indentation/hole just above each side of his eyes. This has been there
for about six months and has not gotten worse, so I am not worried about
this.
<If its in more than one specimen its definitely
environmental, see above and please keep an eye on this specimen as
well.>
The yellow tank {tang?} has reddish pitting around his eye,
and his lateral line is very distinguished against the rest of his body.
He just developed some red blotching all over his body today.
<The
red spots could be anything from skin trauma to a secondary/parasitic
infection from the HLLE, it’s hard to say without seeing the fish. Do a
search on WWM re: Tang Disease.>
He continues to eat vigorously and
act healthy. No fish are picking on him either. Any help on how I can
reverse the HLLE would be greatly appreciated.
<Read here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/hllefaqs.htm.>
Thanks,
<You are
welcome.>
Joe Marano
<Adam J.>
Hypo or Copper? Tang with Ich - DON'T Send Messages Using html, Please!
- 10/23/05
Hello everyone
<Hello Tyler, Justin with you
tonight. Please do not use html formatting when sending us emails, it
leaves us separating the html information form your message.>
First
the bad news, my Powder Brown has ich. Now the good news, he has been in
a QT since I bought it.
<Well, good, that is the best way to find out
one has a disease to fight.>
I have read through many articles on the
site about using hyposalinity. I'm not 100% sure I want to do this. Does
this really work? Or, should I dust off the bottle of Cupramine?
Thanks
Tyler
<I would try the hyposalinity method on this tang
before I would dose with a copper treatment. Tangs generally do not
stand up as well as other fish to copper, and copper does require
frequent testing and dosing of the tank to ensure parasite removal. Hypo
salinity if done correctly is less stressful and does work. Please read
our FAQ’s on this as well. I have personally done this many times for
fish and seen great results.>
<Justin (Jager)>
Tang with Ick Question 10/11/05
<<Stan, some of my/other
input. Cheers, BobF>>
Hello Crew:
<Hi Stan, James here today>
I currently have a purple tang and a desjardini tang in my QT (20gal)
<<RMF would NOT mix two tang species in QT>>
which I plan on
adding to my 150 gal reef system once they pass QT. They've been there
for about a week and are both eating like little pigs and seem to be
doing fine. I've been feeding them a
variety of foods which includes
Spectrum Thera-A Anti-Parasitic Formula, Julian Sprung's Seaveggies,
Ocean Nutrition Marine Pellets Formula 2, Kent Marine Platinum Reef
Herbivore Fish Food which are sometimes soaked in Vita Chem.
However, in the last couple of days, I've noticed some white spots on my
purple tangs body and fins. Can't really see if the Desjardini has these
same spots or not because the spots are not as contrasting as on the
purple tang. I assume it's ick, or the beginning of it. So I looked here
and read some articles that hyposalinity and/or a cleaner shrimp might
do the trick without medications. So I added a shrimp a few days ago and
then this weekend started researching how to do the hyposalinity
treatment.
<<Not with the shrimp present. RMF>>
Instead of
finding out how, I found more articles claiming that hyposalinity was a
waste of time and wouldn't work long term. So I guess my question is,
how would one go about treating ick long term in QT? Isn't that what a
QT tank is for?
<<Not really what "quarantine is for"... a period
to review, observe health, behavior, possibly treat there/then... but
also for "rest". RMF>>
I know everyone has different opinions,
but what do most people do? Medicate? If so with what? Any help would be
very much appreciated.
<Stan, if it were me, rather then stress the
fish out with hyposalinity treatment, I would treat with copper. A
copper test kit is a must along with daily testing to insure an
effective and safe level is kept. Recommended dose to maintain is
0.015-0.020ppm.
<<Dude! Of what? Free copper/cupric ion... PLEASE
understand that there is a difference in reading/s with chelated copper
and their corresponding kits. RMF>>
I would treat for a minimum
of 21 days @ 80 degree temperature. The ick cyst casings are unaffected
by the copper so we have to wait till all hatch out where at this stage
they can be effectively killed by the copper. The ich that is embedded
in the skin of the fish also is pretty much unaffected by the copper.
Only in the swimming stage, after hatching and when they have to find a
host, is when they are most vulnerable to copper. James (Salty Dog)>
Tang with Ick Question ? - Follow-up 10/11/05
Thanks James (Salty
Dog):
OK. So a treatment with copper it is. Any recommendations as to
what copper brand / type to use? Isn't there chelated or non chelated ?
<Yes, there are chelated/non chelated types. If it were me I'd go with
Aquarium Systems Sea Cure Copper treatment along with their FasTest
Copper Test Kit. Fortunately for me I've never had to treat a tank in
10+ years, but if the problem arose, the above would be my choice.>
<<... three weeks... with an unchelated copper... on tangs? I would NOT
do this... I'd go with two weeks, and a chelated make/model with
accompanying at least daily tests. RMF>>
And I assume that I need
to move the cleaner shrimp to my main tank since he won't make it thru
the copper treatments right ?
<Stan, all inverts must be removed.
Google our WWM site on copper treatment for more info. James (Salty
Dog)> Re: Tang with Ick Question ? - Follow-up 10/13/05
Thanks for the quick replies James (Salty Dog), very much appreciated.
<You're welcome>
But I'm a bit confused here and was hoping that you
could maybe point me in the right direction.
Just as a reminder,
I've left the replies back and forth as a memory refresher. After
talking on Monday, I went out to my local pet stores looking for copper
but could not find any, believe it or not they were all out. So I
ordered it mail order that night.
Well here's the confusing thing. On
Tuesday, when I checked in on them and watched them for awhile to see
how they were doing, etc. I noticed that my Desjardini tang was laying
on its side and the cleaner shrimp was going to town on him. After
taking a closer look, I saw that the purple tang no longer had white
spots on him either (this is while the lights were on). Am I going nuts
?
<<James... respond to the question/s! Not going nuts... the
"spots" are reactions... do cycle on/off... RMF>>
Unfortunately, I
noticed that my Desjardini tang had a two spots missing from the
top/rear of his fin. I'm guessing Mr. purple is the reason. However,
when I checked on them this morning (lights still off) the purple tang
looks like it has
some type of spots on it (not white), and its body
was a bit discolored. The Desjardini on the other hand, seems like the
spots that were missing on its fins are filling in already.
So here
is my dilemma. Do I treat the tangs with copper ?
<Stan, this
treatment must last at least 21 days to be effective and are you using a
test kit to insure safe and effective doses?>
Why do I see spots one
day and not the next? Will treating them, if they don't have anything be
a bad idea or more harmful then good ?
<You have gazillions of cysts
laying on the bottom waiting to hatch and find a buddy. Continued
treatment is necessary to kill all the hatchings.>
And do I keep
pushing my luck in trying to keep two tangs in the same tank ? I'm sure
the 20gal isn't ideal but I'm hoping that the extra space in the 150
will allow them to get along.
<The 150 should be fine, you have to
accept the fact there will be occasional aggression. Its recommended
that no two alike tangs be kept together.>
I know it's pushing it.
Could go either way. They could get along, with the occasional "I'm
boss" reminders, or they may destroy one another.
<<This is
something you NEVER want to see. If the two tangs are also close
in size, you are probably pushing it too far with their compatibility,
this is not what could be considered "conscientious". MH>>
Should
I separate them in the QT tank ? Should I get rid of one of them and
just go with one ?
<If the aggression gets up to the next level,
then I'd probably trade one in. James (Salty Dog)>
I know there's a
lot of questions here, many of which are hard to answer, with no
definite yes or no. But I'd really appreciate any input that you guys
might have.
Thanks in advance
<You're welcome. Do compatibility
research in the future if you are considering buying two alike fish.>
Re: Tang with Ick Question 10/14/05
Hello Again James or Bob:
<James here. Stan I'm sorry for the poor reply I gave you. I strive to
provide the best information I can give. Unfortunately I was tired and
battled out from a long day with the in-laws. My apologies again.>
OK, so now my head is about to explode. Will someone please pass the
Excedrin.
<Morphine might be in order>
I'm sorry, I'm really not
trying to be a pest, but after goggling the site for ick, I walked away
one day with hyposalinity being the answer. Then when I tried to get
more info, and Googled hyposalinity, I came away with it being a waste
of time, that copper was the way to go. So I Googled copper treatment,
and came away with some questions. So I wrote in, asking for some
additional insight. Since doing that , I've come away with not one but
two more opinions (which
sound to me totally opposite) on how to
treat with copper and with what kind. Did I mention that I'm a bit
confused here ?
I understand that there will always be varying
opinions on how to do something. But if you're new at this (aka me) then
how do you know what to do ? Which is the more tried and proven method ?
Can anyone shed some light please ?
<<We're better at shedding
hair. MH>>
I'd like to get started on treating my tangs.
<Stan, I will try to simplify this for you. Ionic copper, usually from
copper sulphate is referred to as free ionic copper. It is easily kept
at a safe and effective level by use of a copper test kit. If your
treatment tank contains any carbonate substrate, quite of bit of the
copper will be absorbed by it, hence the necessity for the copper test
kit. Ionic copper dosages should be between 0.015-0.020.
Chelated
copper medications are made to slow the copper from precipitating out of
solution. Depending on the brand you use, dosage level will exceed 0.2
ppm. The dosage rate is tied to the actual volume of water, not tank
size. If this volume is misjudged then an ineffective cure will result
or it can become dangerous to the fish. As far as I'm aware of, there
are no inexpensive test kits to measure this accurately. Bob, correct me
if I'm wrong.
It is my recommendation to use an ionic copper/copper
sulphate to effectively cure the disease. My apologies to Mr. Fenner for
my initial reply. Go treat your tang, Stan. Also, the Aquarium Systems
Sea Cure is a non-chelated copper. James (Salty Dog)>
Thanks again.
<You're welcome and good luck with your tang.> Re: Tang
with Ick Question ? - Follow-up 10/15/05
James (Salty Dog):
Thanks for the info and no apologies necessary.
<These were
necessary on my part.>
I'm going to begin treating my tangs with
copper but I have a couple more dumb questions here.
My 20gal QT
currently is a bare bottom tank with a few PVC pieces and a sponge
filter running in it. What do I do with the sponge filter while treating
? Remove it ? Keep it in there and throw it away when done ? Do you
start frequent water changes to keep water quality up ? <You can remove
it so it doesn't become absorbed <saturated? RMF> with copper. I'd
change 10% of the water weekly. Keep a power head in there for
circulation. Read here Stan:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ichartmar.htm James (Salty Dog)>
Torn Between two tangs 10-12-05
Dear Crew,
<<Hello>>
I have
a 180 g FOWLR that had been a closed system for quite some time until
this summer when after a 4 wk quarantine I added an adult emperor angel.
<<QT should always be a minimum of 4 weeks and I personally suggest a
minimum of 6 weeks on tangs and angels as they like to harbor
"nasties".>>
The 180 had a powder blue and a Naso tang, both
beautiful fish. A purple tang and Foxface that I have had for 8-9 years
were looking like they were on their last leg ( probably old age ,
I guess ) and I decided to open the system to new inhabitants.
Unfortunately, despite using a QT the tangs look like they came down
with crypt. I pulled all fish from the system, treated then in QT's with
copper for 3 weeks and let the display lie fallow for 5 weeks.
<<Again as a general rule, a tank should be left fallow for 6-8 weeks
and temp. should be raised as high as tolerable for current inhabitants
to increase the rate of the parasite life cycle.>>
I have since
re-introduced all of the fish except for the tangs. For 4 weeks since
the 180 has been with fish the system looks great. My tangs are also
doing well while still in the QT except for some HLLE that they acquired
while copper treated.
The Naso has a few scattered papules on the
face and head and body that copper had no effect on ( ? HLLE ) but is
otherwise doing great. The Naso and powder blue are in a 55 g tank
together. The papules on the Naso are whitish and
much 4-5 times
larger than what is seen with crypt, this has been a chronic condition
for this fish but it has not been that noticeable nor has it affected
the fish's activity eating etc.
Now I am faced with a dilemma :
Should I dare re-introduce the tangs into the display. I fear that tangs
are very "parasite prone" Currently the 180 has an adult emperor 6". a
majestic 4-5" Foxface 5" Heniochus 4" a couple of clowns and one damsel,
250lbs of LR with plenty of hiding places.
Probably no good answer to
this question, but I thought I would try asking.
<<The best answer I
can give is; if you don't feel comfortable doing it, then don't do it.
You are correct in your thinking that tangs are prone to infection. My
advice would be to pick one and give the other to a friend or set up the
55 for the outsider.>>
Jimmy
<<TravisM>><<<I actually am going to
make a comment... both species listed here are unsuitable for a four
foot long system (should be in six foot minimum)... the mucus marks on
the Naso are likely "just" resultant from stress... RMF>>>
Sick Yellow-Eyed Tang 8/31/05
Hey there,
<Hi>
Great
website, but it's a little hard to navigate and search.
<Do you
have (specific) suggestions on how we might improve these aspects?>
Good
resource nevertheless. I wanted to seek some professional
advice about
my sick yellow-eyed tang. I purchased it about 3-4
weeks ago. My 60
gallon tank has been cycled through for a few
weeks before that, and I
introduced a small spotted damsel to
start the bio-cycle. When I
purchased the yellow-eyed tang, I
also introduced a small clown fish at
the same time. I secluded
the damsel in fear that it would be too
aggressive for the clown
and the tang, but after rearranging the
live-rock and releasing
the damsel after a few days, they seemed to get
along quite
well.
Very recently within the past 24 hours, my yellow-eyed
tang had secluded
itself under a large piece of live-rock and
didn't come out of its
hiding place. Usually, it would be
waiting with the other two fish for
me to feed them. Before
yesterday, the tang seemed to be swimming very
normally, and I
fed it Formula 2 pellets w/ garlic. He seemed to be
eating
those fine, but wasn't too keen on the seaweed sheets.
<Takes
time... familiarity>
I did an immediate 10-15% water change, and
lifted the live-rock it was
hiding under, only to find the tang
on its side and breathing heavily.
I do not have a quarantine
tank, so I had to seclude it in a small glass
fish-bowl that is
semi submerged in my 60-gallon tank. My only other
idea was to
place it in the homemade sump, but was afraid of the water
pump
catching the tang in its vacuum inlets. I've attached two pictures
of the tang. It is still breathing and still has normal coloration.
The only other symptoms are that it looks anorexic (it has only
looked
this way within the last 24 hours), and seems to swim
normally when in a
gentle current.
Any help/advice is
appreciated.
<Mmm, well, this specimen is badly emaciated...
starved... So, at least part of the answer here is poor handling
prior to your receiving the fish... "It has a low index of
fitness"... this coupled with stress of moving, a new tank... I
would return it to the main tank, and hope it recovers of its own
accord... Do take a look at pix of other/healthy Ctenochaetus
species... notice how much more well-fleshed they are. Yours is way
too skinny. Bob Fenner> |  
|
Re: sick tang mentioned in today's daily 8/21/05
Just thought
might add to the problem with the blue tang. That may be
cyanided
to check the WWM link about Methylene blue dips. As in that page
it
is mentioned that Methylene blue works well with reversing the effects
of
cyanide.
<Thanks much for this. Will post/share for current
and future situations. Bob Fenner> Tang questions 7-26-05
Thanks for your input. I did mention however that there are no
detectable nitrites or nitrates.
<Must have missed that - are you
testing nitrate as nitrate-nitrogen or nitrate ion? Have you used more
than one kit?>
There has not been any overt
aggression, and many
of the fish weren't around long enough to take a
beating. Regardless, it's good to hear it from somebody else because
that is exactly what I told my friend, I just wanted to double check and
make sure that I wasn't missing something obscure or even something
blatantly obvious.
<Does seem to me like bad water quality on your
friends part - is he using chemical filtration of any type?> Could I
still get a second opinion on this topic
from another member of WWM?
<I tossed this letter around the inbox, seems like no one has any
additional input>
As a side note, I am curious why a 3" Hippo can't
thrive in a 65. It's
one of our most popular fish and one of the
ones that people have had
the best success (extremely rare losses or
problems) even in 55g tanks.
My first SW tank (45g) I bought as a
setup and it came with a Hippo that
lived in there for over a year
and a half just in my possession and who
knows how long it was in
there before.
<Just because a fish is surviving doesn't mean it's
thriving. Tangs are open water fish, and in my opinion, a 3" in a 65 is
pushing it> It is now in a 90 and just about
the healthiest, most
beautiful tang I have ever seen. Now two years
into saltwater that
is the one fish that I can point to and say "I have
had that fish
for years" with a big smile on my face.
<Good to hear, though it
will outgrow that 90> I can understand
why at maybe 6" or so that
same fish would be quite crammed, which is
why my store offers huge
amounts of store credit on fish that have
outgrown
systems. Speaking from my fairly limited experience, and with
the
practical knowledge I have of tangs and their needs I am curious
what I am missing that makes 3" a misfit in a 65.
<See above>
Scott Johnson
Critter Cabana
<M. Maddox>
Powder Brown
Low-Down (Tang Quarantine) 7/14/05
I have a 75gal FOWLR, and I am
thinking of adding a Powder Brown (White Faced) Tang.
<Just keep
thinking, but please don't add this fish to your tank, unless a much
larger tank is in the very near future. Your tank really is too small to
support this fish for anything close to a natural life span, IMO. You
need a tank that is at least 6 feet long, to provide "physical space"
for the fish, as well as large water capacity to help dilute metabolic
waste...>
I have a 20gal hospital tank setup and I know how to
perform a freshwater dip.
<A good practice>
Should I run copper
in the hospital for the whole 21 days or just wait and see if anything
pops up.
<I would not use copper, or any other medicine, on a
prophylactic basis.>
I'm pretty sure with a Powder Brown it is going
to have ich (even if I don't see it) and I don't want to kill it the
copper treatment but I also don't want the ich in my main. What to do?
Thanks
Daryl
<Well, Daryl- if you were going to get this fish,
you'd be well advised to do a full 30 day quarantine, without copper or
other medication. Only medicate if the fish shows signs of illness. Just
make sure that you run the full 30 day quarantine. Regards, Scott F.>
Yellow Tang...Oxygen Deprived?? 30 Jun 2005
Greetings,
Although I wouldn't normally send questions this frequently (twice
this week!), I am stuck in a sort of problem now and any suggestions
would be of much help. I have a 75gal, fish-only tank with a wet/dry
filter "trickle" system. 130W power compact fluorescent
lighting. Ammonia/Nitrites/Nitrates are all 0.0.
I've had a
Yellow Tang in my the tank for over two months now, and up until about 4
days ago he seemed to be acting just fine. Curious about the tank,
eating well, swimming casually, breathing at a normal rate. About 4
days ago the temperatures rose here in Pennsylvania to 90-something, and
it's been like that every day since then. The house I currently live in
has no A/C, and I don't have a chiller system on the tank (prior to
this, in a different house, I had A/C). At present it would be tough to
afford either an A/C unit or a chiller.....If my floating thermometer is
correct, the temperature in the tank has gone from about 77 degrees to
81 in the past four days, and is holding pretty constant around 80
degrees.
<This is an okay range... diurnally... I might turn your
lights off during these hot days...>
The other fish (Sergeant Major,
Yellowtail Damsels, Green Chromis, and Coral Beauty Angel) seem to be
acting normally, but the Tang's breathing/respirating/gilling rate
increased the first day the tank temp rose.
<Yes, Surgeonfishes have
higher dissolved oxygen requirements than these other families of
fishes>
The day I noticed this, he seemed to be swimming and eating
normally so I didn't think much of it. Today I returned home from work
to find him breathing heavier, and swimming erratically. He'll swim
erratically for awhile, then quickly jerk to one side or the other,
almost like a seizure. I have one airstone in the sump already, but I
put another one in today...probably should have done that SEVERAL days
ago, something I regret. As far as I know, no factors might have
changed the water quality today. Is it possible that the Tang just
couldn't deal with the stress and finally gave in today?
<Maybe...
more likely something else in the tank triggered trouble... this in turn
might be temperature related>
The Tang also started to develop
very minor HLLE,
<This is an important piece of data... something
amiss water quality, nutrition-wise>
and it seemed to be reversing
before this heat wave occurred, but now it seems to be getting worse
quickly. Stress induced?
<Possibly... that and food...>
The
HLLE was going away with a diet of Ocean Nutrition Seaweed Selects algae
"paper" and Ocean Nutrition Formula Two frozen food. The color of this
fish, otherwise, still seems to be fine.
With most fish situations I
tend to try and figure out these problems myself, but I don't think the
Tang will last more than another day or so unless I do something. Any
information or suggestions will surely help. My hypothesis is oxygen
deprivation due to increased water temps, any other ideas?
Thanks again for keeping
such a great webpage on the net!
Bryan M.
<Something unknown re water quality... Where, when these mysteries
occur, I do water changes, add chemical filtrants. Bob Fenner>
Tang problem 7/5/05
Hi James
the water that was used was from
a local fish store that takes care of
aquariums and they
use water that they cycle....they have been trust worthy with
my other tank I've had for years so I didn't question them. <I have no
idea what we are talking about as you didn't reply with the original
query. We get hundreds of queries and it is impossible to remember the
query in most cases. Also, please cap all your "I's" and use
punctuation. These queries have to be edited before posting and it
saves our editor valuable time. Thank You, James (Salty Dog)>
Needing help about lipstick tang, illiteracy
Hi just wondering
we had a lipstick tang and it was fine and then a couple of weeks down
the track we brought a blue tang and put it in the tank and then the
lipstick tang started acting funny our blue tang died and then a couple
of days later our lipstick tang turned a really dark grey colour and
stopped eating.
i just wanted to know what does it mean when the
lipstick tang turns a really dark grey colour is it because it has a
disease.
thanks Semiany
please reply i would really like to
know.
<The darkening is a sign of psychological and/or physiological
stress... Something/s frightening and/or challenging to the specimen.
Bob Fenner> Sick hippo tang, system
Hello Crew,
<Lani>
I am writing about my hippo tang. Recently I have
seen a
few white spots on his body. He shows now
signs of distress, no
scratching, heavy breathing etc.
He still eats like a pig and all of
my water
parameters are normal. I haven't really had a problem
with saltwater ich before, but this doesn't look like
the typical
freshwater ich cysts, it is not "raised
from the skin". Any ideas
on what it could be and how
I should approach treatment.
Thanks,
Eric
<Likely some sort of parasite, but in something of a "stasis"
with its host... I'd add at least one type of biological cleaner (please
see here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/clnrfaqs.htm) and do my best to maintain
optimized, stable conditions, good nutrition... and keep an eye out for
infestation. Bob Fenner> Quarantine Query
Hi!
<Hi
there! Scott F. here tonight!>
I have an old 12 gallon tank I took
down a while ago. Would I be able to use this as a QT for a small-medium
tang?
<For a small tang, probably. For a medium sized specimen, it
may be a bit small.>
If not, how big should I have?
<I'd shoot
for a 20 gallon "long" style tank for a medium tang>
And how long
should I keep it in there under what water parameters? Thank you.
-Adam
<Well, Adam, I'm gonna refer you to an article I wrote on the
subject a couple of years back. It's right here on the WWM site at this
link, and should answer most of your questions on the quarantine
process:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/QuarMarFishes.htm
Hope this helps!
Good luck and I commend you on embracing the valuable quarantine
process! Regards, Scott F.>
Tangs, Crypto and UV - In Other
Words "QUARANTINE"! (5/15/05)
I have 3 tangs in my 125G tank,
and they are all getting along very well. Rarely see a raised fin, tail
slapping, etc.
<Lucky you. It may not stay that way as they grow.>
That said, two are the most common contractors of ich, the hepatus and
the powder blue.
<Yup.>
My reef has way too much rock with coral
frags all over to dig out. If I wanted to be proactive, what is the best
way to make sure ich does not enter the picture.
<4 weeks of
quarantine for any new additions. Make sure they get a good variety of
food with plenty of algae. Supplement with vitamins and HUFAs, which may
help prevent HLLE, a big problem with the Hippos. Keep system as stable
as possible. Minimize stress. Remove aggressors if problems do develop
eventually.>
I do weekly 15% to 20% water changes, aggressive
skimming, etc. Occasionally I'll see a tang scrape against a rock a time
or two, but I always hope it was just an itch.
<If this is
occasional, it is probably not a concern.>
Bottom line: do UV
Sterilizers, large enough with a slow flow rate, eliminate ich with
destroying too much beneficial stuff?
<No guarantees. It may help
and some people run it periodically or continuously, though there have
been unsubstantiated concerns of this leading to immunodeficiency in the
fish. For a great summary of UV pros and cons, read Scott Michael's
marine parasite article in Aquarium USA Annual. It was the 2004 Edition,
I think.>
Thoughts on the best way to avoid problem before it
starts?
<As above.>
Thanks.
<Hope this helps.>
HELP!! Tang with urchin wound!
Dear WWM Crew
<Rebecca>
MY idiot yellow tang swam into my long spine urchin (diadema sp. )!!What
should I do? It is sticking out of him still, but since you can kinda
see through him, it doesn't appear to be puncturing any organs, but I am
not sure where the swim bladder may be.
<About straight back from
the pectoral fin/s... at their end on the body if you folded them flat>
Around the wound and up a little bit, is kinda whitish, or bluish, is
that the poison?
<Mmm, no... color from the spine>
Should I pull
it out or leave it in to work it's way out?
<If it's small in size,
leave it...>
I know that urchin spines are made to go only one
way-farther in, so would pulling it out hurt him more?
<Mmm, not on
fishes>
Should I Quarantine him with Mela-fix? Oh, what in the world
should I do?
<Patience... take several deep breaths... this too will
work itself out>
BTW, the stupid fish is just swimming around like
normal and eating the seaweed I just put in as aggressively as ever.
<Good>
Thank you for any help, and hurry with answers please!
Thanks,
Rebecca
<Welcome. Bob Fenner, whose been poked by both
tangs and urchins plenty of times... and is still around>
Internal parasites or bacteria infection
Hi Guys!!
I have a
major problem with my supermale lineatus wrasse. He is apparently not a
happy camper. He has white feces or shall we call it stringy white poo
hanging out of its anal area.
<Either one>
The tank is a 55 gallon
with a UV, all water parameters are normal. When I first got him, he was
always swimming around eating like a pig. Now he is hiding in his cave,
has no interest in food, he always has his head out looking around
except he hasn't swam or ate in 3 days. I am very concerned. Since my
tank isn't a reef, I treated my tank with Maracyn and Metronidazole from
SeaChem. I noticed his white stringy poop is getting longer, it looks
like he is desperately trying to expel the waste from his anus. Am I
taking the right approach?
<One way, yes>
The diet I was feeding
him was that Canadian Mysis shrimp. It has high protein at 60%.
Couple times a week I add Selcon to it. He shares a home with a flame
wrasse, and a labouti who are all doing great. Do you have any other
suggestions on how I can speed this process along or is he doomed since
he isn't eating?
<This fish was/is very likely internally parasitized
from the wild... and in too small a system, and lacking "reef
circumstances", definitely a shortcoming... Do you have another, larger,
more "reefy" setting to move it to? I would add the Metronidazole to its
food... This is posted on WWM... and treat only for a few days. Bob
Fenner> Quarantine Procedure/ Swim Bladder Treatment 5.3.05
Good day,
<Hello, Ryan helping you today.>
I have a 5½-inch long
Pacific Sailfin Tang, which got white spots disease recently. When I
noticed it, I removed the Tang to a quarantine tank and added treatment.
After two days, I noticed that the Tang is spending a lot of time in a
vertical position and is not swimming normally, as if it would not have
any balance. It also looks like it is breathing quicker than normal. Do
you perhaps know what this could be?
<Sounds to be a swim bladder
infection, although it could be simple suffocation. Is the temperature
getting high in such a small tank? Is the surface of the water being
covered with a film?>
Is there anything I can do?
<Read Scott's
article on Quarantine procedure:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/QuarMarFishes.htm. Did you miss anything?
How is the copper level? Water changes will require a redose, as copper
will be removed. Copper will not evaporate, however, so you don't need
to redose when topping off. As for a possible swim bladder disease,
bacteria and parasites can cause this. A new tenant could have brought
something along. He needs a calm, clean environment to rebuild a healthy
immune system- He has maxed out.>
The water conditions are: Salinity
- 1.023
Ammonia - 0
Nitrites - 0
Nitrates -15
Your response
would be highly appreciated.
<I would try some medicated foods, for a
bacterial infection. Call it a hunch. Give the bottle a good read and
make sure that it is compatible with any copper medications. Have a look
here as well:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/AqBizSubWebIndex/fishdisho.htm
Cheers, Ryan.> Tang In Trouble? (Getting Tang To Eat
Post-Copper Treatment) 7/22/05
Greetings,
<Hi there! Scott F.
with you today!>
Help, my Yellow Tang is in grave trouble. Three
weeks ago I noticed Ich pustules on the fins of my Yellow Tang and
Purple Pseudochromis in my 60gal reef. I followed the recommendations I
found on this site and quickly set-up a 20gal bare-bottom hospital tank,
administered fresh water dip, and transferred all my fish to it (Yellow
Tang, Purple Pseudochromis, Three-stripe Damsel, pair of Ocellaris
clowns).
<Good moves..>
I treated the hospital tank for 2 weeks
with SeaChem Cupramine (at 82F), and after that I
started biological/carbon filtration with Penguin 100 bio-wheel filter
and daily 10-20% water changes using fresh RO/DI water mixed with
IO. The main tank has been running fallow at 84F. After 3 weeks, all
the fish except the
Yellow Tang appear healthy and active. The Tang
looks wafer-thin and has stopped eating. He will not touch sea-weed,
and is barely moving. Just stays in the corner and looks miserable. What
should I do?
<Hmm.. tough one. Although copper
treatments can be used with many fishes, including Tangs, not all of
them take it well. They have digestive fauna that enable them to process
food which, if damaged-can result in the fish having difficulty eating.
Collateral damage, if you will. In the case of this fish, I'd operate
under the assumption that either copper may have affected his digestive
tract, or that some sort of secondary infection has occurred.
Discontinuing the copper treatment was a good call on your part. I would
continue with regular water changes and increased filtration/aeration.
Before returning this fish to the display, I'd make sure that he is
eating. If he cannot be tempted with foods such as Nori and the
conventional frozen foods, I would try to get some fresh macroalgae (my
choice would be Gracilaria, aka "ogo", which you can get from e-tailers
such as Indo Pacific Sea Farms and others)-any macroalgae at this
point...In fact, getting a fresh live rock with some microalgae attached
would also be a good idea. Anything to stimulate him to "graze" again.>
It's been 3 weeks exactly and I'm tempted to put him back in the main
reef tank. He looks like he could drop from starvation at any time. I
realize that minimum 30 days is required to keep the Ich from coming
back, but I just worry that if I don't put him back into his familiar
reef where he can graze on algae, he will not make it. What should I
do? Thank yo for
your help - Rob
<Well, Rob- as indicated
above- I'd rather "bring the reef to him" by dropping in some rocks and
fresh macroalgae to help nurse him through this tough period. Although
the situation may be critical, these fishes can go a remarkably long
time without eating. Be sure that all of the copper is removed from the
water (use a good copper test kit, like Seachem's), and use copper
removing media such as Poly Filter or Seachem's product (the name
escapes me at the moment) if you still have residual copper readings.
Also, consider the use of some liquid vitamins (such as Boyd Vita Chem)
administered directly to the water (fish do drink) to provide at least a
possibility of supplemental nourishment for him. Hang in there...stay
with him, and don't give up. I've seen this before, and these guys CAN
recover. Good luck! Regards, Scott F.>
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